Do we have the worst 4th line in the league?

[pooleboy]

McCelement takes up tons of minutes on the PK and often goes against top lines in a line with grabo and kulie

yea thats what im saying, dress him to play center on 4th and 2nd line wing or something and dress 7D maybe... idk mcclement on the 4th line and the 2nd line isn't a huge deal

 

[crkkh]

The height and weight of our first three lines seems to have increased with this current fourth line.

In the pregame interview with McClement, it was noted that Carlyle had said he wished the rest of the club had McClement's work ethic. He's a perfect player to wear that A on this team. And maybe, just maybe, the club's play for each other, newly talkative (When's the last time you've seen a Toronto team communicate like that?) cooperative team identity is in no small part to Carlyle certainly, but to McClement's example as well.

I think I have to go back to 2001 to remember feeling this good about a win.

Roll that fourth line on and on...

This...
The skilled players are more effective with confidence and space...
Seems obvious the protection needed when Pacioretty jumps Grabovski from behind when he's already in an altercation...Grabovski was already coming to the aid of Komarov...
Wouldn't mind a few shifts against Boston and Philly with McLaren or Orr running shotgun on the top lines...just for a different look...
I remember the contributions of Semenko and McSorley for Gretzky and Kurri...

 

[Noble Peasant]

Worst 4th line in the league? Are you on crack? More like on of the most effective.

McClemment is a great checking centre, and McLaren and Orr are both monsters out there. Everyone is scared of them. The best part is, the opposing tough guys have to go through McLaren or Fraser before they can make it to Orr, and most of they time they don't even get close.

 

[leafspring*]

Worst 4th line in the league? Are you on crack? More like on of the most effective.

McClemment is a great checking centre, and McLaren and Orr are both monsters out there. Everyone is scared of them. The best part is, the opposing tough guys have to go through McLaren or Fraser before they can make it to Orr, and most of they time they don't even get close.

Devane is coming along nicely too,and he could play effective 4th line minutes without hurting the team. This is a poor thread i think.

 

[tony m]

Worst 4th line in the league? Are you on crack? More like on of the most effective.

McClemment is a great checking centre, and McLaren and Orr are both monsters out there. Everyone is scared of them. The best part is, the opposing tough guys have to go through McLaren or Fraser before they can make it to Orr, and most of they time they don't even get close.

Saturday Feb 23 - Toronto at Ottawa - Me thinks the 'worst 4th line in the league' will vastly change the dynamics from the last time we met. Paybacksa*****.

 

[Mystifo]

They were effective last night. But that does not mean I am going to say they are an amazing 4th line just if they can manage to play like they did last night every night then we might have something.

 

[zeke]

Having two heavyweights on a line will give you a line with a clear purpose, but I don't think you could ever call them a great 4th line. Maybe a good one.

But together a line like Komarov-McClement-Orr/Brown/Hamilton, though, and you might have one of the best 4th lines anywhere.

 

[My Sweet Shadow]

We've got a Randy Carlyle 4th line. McClement is one of our top PKers and Orr/McLaren are bruisers we can send out for 5 minutes a game to bang some bodies and provide some energy. I have no problem with is since we're basically rolling the other three lines.

 

[leafspring*]

We've got a Randy Carlyle 4th line. McClement is one of our top PKers and Orr/McLaren are bruisers we can send out for 5 minutes a game to bang some bodies and provide some energy. I have no problem with is since we're basically rolling the other three lines.

Have a look at the box score if you think Carlyle "basically rolls 4 lines". He can actually coach a game within the game. He is a react coach,and that could be by the minute.

 

[Rockinz]

no, no we dont.

toughness is undervalued around here

 

[Tak7]

We've got a Randy Carlyle 4th line. McClement is one of our top PKers and Orr/McLaren are bruisers we can send out for 5 minutes a game to bang some bodies and provide some energy. I have no problem with is since we're basically rolling the other three lines.

Running an enforcer 4th line only goes so far, though.

In a tough schedule grind (3 in 4 nights, etc), sometimes it helps having 4 lines being able to roll.

The flip side, is that it gives your three lines a lot more time. I'm always in favor of Kessel and Kadri et al getting more ice time.

Plus, despite some questionable blue-line usage, I think Carlyle rotates his lines well

 

[masyo88*]

LOL so funny reading some of the ladies in this thread, Our forth line is bomb! As Montreal found out last night!

 

[Duffman955]

LOL so funny reading some of the ladies in this thread, Our forth line is bomb! As Montreal found out last night!

Bourque's chin found out so bad, he nearly fainted

 

[masyo88*]

Bourque's chin found out so bad, he nearly fainted

Stop it cause a fourth line of Hamilton Steckel Mcarthur is better and has grit.

 

[My Sweet Shadow]

Have a look at the box score if you think Carlyle "basically rolls 4 lines". He can actually coach a game within the game. He is a react coach,and that could be by the minute.

You shouldn't use direct quotes if you don't directly quote me. He uses the other three lines pretty evenly. Kessel, Grabo, Bozak, JVR, Kulemin, MacArthur, Frattin, Kadri, and Komarov all have averaged between 11 and 16 minutes of ES TOI/G this season. Sure he plays the match-up game more than most, but he still spreads out the minutes quite well (though he does overplay the top d-pairing sometimes).

The fact that we have 3 lines who can play big minutes gives us a little lee-way to be a little more stingy with our 4th line. Obviously, the ideal case would be to have a 4th line who could play 7-8 minutes a game (i.e. Campbell-Paille-Thornton on Boston), but I don't think we need to make a big deal about a few minutes of 4th line play.

 

[ConnorTO]

Saturday disagrees with you, completely.

 

[Ryancoke13]

By worst do you mean most entertaining?

cause if so, we have the worst

 

[LeafOfBread]

Do people read the OP date anymore? So many delayed reactions saying "LOL U CRAZY BRO"

 

[JimLaheyprobert]

lol this is the dumbest thread, we are 7-5 and our 4th line has only been out for 1 goal. A 4th line is ment to provide energy and play safe minutes to take some pressure off your top line guys. If they can score thats a plus, but if there also the most feared line in the nhl then that also is a plus, and if having them around allows people like kessel, grabo, kadri, frattin and JVR to play their game because they feel safe, then to me they are doing their job. We lead the league in hits, we are tied for first in fights and i havnt seen much loseing in the fighting department. This is mostly due to our forth line and oh ya did i mention we are 7-5? Give the boys some credit.

 

[Snow Dog]

I've been giving them credit all season(see ORR/Brown thread) for allowing the rest of the team to play taller and they haven't been a liability at any time.


Some fans believe that the tough guys aren't needed and would prefer a line that can put up a few goals.

Sure,if we had a team like Boston where there was toughness throughout the line-up that might apply.

Since the Leafs top 3 lines aren't as tough as they could be,we need a fourth line like this as a deterent.Look at the Habs game,they tried some rough stuff and it completely backfired.Do you think the Habs will be trying to pull that crap next game?I highly doubt it.

 

[G51 K81*]

What a dumb thread.

 

[Guided by Veseys]

I'm gonna take back what i said about orr earlier in this thread. Great vision on the goal tonight and he is bringing a huge amount of presence to the winning atmosphere.

 

[Defense]

We were up 5-1 with under 5 mins to go and McLaren made a nice shot block. Those are the little things that will be noticed by a coach like Carlyle. I was impressed with the 4th line tonight and the game before against Montreal.

I believe this is the least selfish team I've seen in years.

 

[lampshade*]

Seriously, I don't understand why it's like this. Now, the fourth line isn't crucial, but they still play an important role to bring energy and chippy play when needed.

Obviously with injuries, things are a little bit screwed up right now, but I don't see why the hell we need McLaren AND Orr out together. What will two goons accomplish, seriously?

In comparison, the Habs and Bruins both have good, dependable 4th lines (though 2.5 for Prust is a joke).

Why can't we just roll something like Brown-McClement-Hamilton? Dress Orr for games where we need a goon on the ice. Since Brown is injured right now, pick up a cheap 4th line option who's better than McLaren, or hell even call someone up that can bring more than he can.

The 4th line doesn't have to be amazing, but they can't be a liability either, and that's what they have been this year.

I wish we had kept Darryl Boyce. He was a perfect fourth liner.

The fourth line is not efficient, and there's no reason to play two goons in a game against Carolina of all teams, but it's the least of our problems.

Where was Mikhail Grabovski tonight, spending his money?

We've legit had a few goals against with the 4th line out. The 4th line is easy to fix, but it can't be a liability.

This team has a lot of flaws right now and injuries haven't helped.

As it stands, I would say our fourth line is one of the worst in the league, yes.

But Orr won a couple of fights, so I must be wrong.

It's a problem. They get hemmed in their zone every game and are causing the loss of momentum while giving up serious scoring chances to the other team and even resulting in a few GAs. Can't have that happening especially when they only play a few minutes a game.

When your first line, second line and third line are among the worst in the league, you tend to overlook the ****tiness of the fourth line, however much a liability it is.

I just hate how we have a blackhole of cream puffiness in Bozak, Kulemin, MacArthur, Grabovski dead in the middle of the roster, guaranteed to take 50% of the games off.

As good of a coach he is, he has that old school mentality which can be a pain in the ass. The thing that's pissed me off the most so far is his refusal to change up the PP or juggle combinations that simply aren't working.

Phaneuf-Kostka, DOES NOT WORK
Kostka on the PP, DOES NOT WORK
McLaren and Orr playing every game, DOES NOT WORK!!!

Fraser/Holzer in for Komi?

He's a good coach but he's gotta see that these combos are failing us.

Just the first page. Loafofbread this thread was started less than 2weeks ago. Maybe instead of pulling the keyboard trigger you can wait a while next time and see how things workout. No need to make excuses now, just accept your failure of a thread.

 

[JimLaheyprobert]

Orr with the game winner, Mclaren with a great shot block. Constant pressure from the 4th line all night. But what jumped out at me the most was Phanuef and Rinaldo got tangled up, and if this was last years leafs rinaldo would have forsure went after phanuef becuase thats the type of player he is. But now, he knows who is sitting on the leafs bench and he knows if he cheap shots our captin that he will have to pay the price later so what does he do he skates away. These are the type of things that im talking about, having these guys on our roster allows our players to play their game and not having to worry about getting run or cheap shotted. Now that Orr, fraser and mclaren are chipping in offensivly it makes the 4th line look even better.