Devils 2020-21 team discussion (news, notes and speculation) - part IV

[Guadana]

I talked with Max Andreev from Cornell about his meeting with Reilly. What i heard Walsh isn`t tough to play against, he doesn`t play hard in corners and lose his challeges, he has problems when he try to remove the puck from own zone under pressure. Max says only good things about his puckmoving in offensive zone and about his game in PP, Max thinks Walsh is 40-45 points guy if he gets pp-time.

 

[Patrik26]

I talked with Max Andreev from Cornell about his meeting with Reilly. What i heard Walsh isn`t tough to play against, he doesn`t play hard in corners and lose his challeges, he has problems when he try to remove the puck from own zone under pressure. Max says only good things about his puckmoving in offensive zone and about his game in PP, Max thinks Walsh is 40-45 points guy if he gets pp-time.

So a smaller Mirco Mueller then. Hip-hip. Hooray?

 

[Figgie]

So a smaller Mirco Mueller then. Hip-hip. Hooray?

Muller will never do 40-45 points and he is 4 years older.

Edit: I would say that Walsh is new Will Butcher.

 

[My3Sons]

Both Jack and Goose had 12 hits this season while both Dadonov and Bratt had 29. There comes a point where our lack of physical forwards with some size becomes a problem and adding an undersized forward who lacks the strength to battle is not what we need even if he’s shifty and talented.

The fact that there’s a very good chance we will be drafting a smallish skilled forward at 7th is another reason why I think adding Dadonov while extending Gusev is not the best idea in terms of team building.

Thats an excellent point. In my view if you sign Goose and Dadonov then the team would likely trade Palms. The player drafted at 7 would probably be 2-3 years away and four year deals for the Russians would dovetail reasonably with that. It’s definitely a tricky question because NJ is too easy to play against as I see it.

 

[njdevils1982]

Review everyone's comments regarding Smith on LD side. Plus he's a righty so in theory you'd want him to play his handedness. Not a fan of your tone here Jim

But I get what you're saying, if Smith does go LD side. Then you have sevo subban and pietrangelo in some order, presumably.

But what do you do with Walsh? You think we signed him, promising him no nhl experience time? Why would we buy a depth issue in pietrangelo? Imo were better investing in a UFA LD (unless we make a trade). Until Smith and Bahl crack the NHL, our LD depth is fairly unknown. They're presumables waiting in the wings, but I don't want to assume Mueller and butcher can get the job done, even if Smith makes the team out of camp. We need vet presence

sure, if you held up a photo of him in front of a mirror he would be

 

[Pitaya]

I talked with Max Andreev from Cornell about his meeting with Reilly. What i heard Walsh isn`t tough to play against, he doesn`t play hard in corners and lose his challeges, he has problems when he try to remove the puck from own zone under pressure. Max says only good things about his puckmoving in offensive zone and about his game in PP, Max thinks Walsh is 40-45 points guy if he gets pp-time.

so he is Will Butcher but hopefully a better skater

sounds like any PMD who struggles in the defensive and transition game

 

[Guttersniped]

Thats an excellent point. In my view if you sign Goose and Dadonov then the team would likely trade Palms. The player drafted at 7 would probably be 2-3 years away and four year deals for the Russians would dovetail reasonably with that. It’s definitely a tricky question because NJ is too easy to play against as I see it.

Mentioning the draft pick was probably a mistake, my point is there is a glaring flaw to forward core made up of Nico, Hughes, Bratt, Gusev and Dadonov. I don’t know how anyone can watch these playoff and think a forward core composed entirely of shifty mites (yes, Nico has to be >>175 lb at this point but he’s not Dubois) is a great idea.

I like Dadonov and if we’re signing him or Hoffman I’ll probably take Dadonov but we added two soft offense first forwards in Goose and Hughes last year. Dadonov isn’t as soft (that’s not saying much) but having no size and little physical game in our top six is a still a bad thing. It’s fun to be speedy and skilled but always being the hittee rather than hitter wears you down, you can’t create space or crash the net and we are going to be completely physically dominated quite a bit. We all tsk tsked at the Leafs and that is a less physical top six. I get that these are the players we have to work with and there aren’t easy answers in the UFA market (or elsewhere) but we are hopefully leaving “the everyone sucks just get someone good who scores” phase soon and can start to think in terms of team construction.

I personally don’t have specific player wish list other than PLEASE GOD AT LEAST ONE NEW PLAYER TO PLAY LD WHOSE NOT TERRIBAD and good veteran goalie. Evolving Hockey’s estimated contract for Dadonov is actually bigger than Hoffman’s, they have 6y/7m for Dadonov and 5y/6.6m for Hoffman. Maybe they aren’t getting that in the current financial environment but I also think the chance of Devils signing either of these guys is slim. They’re older than Palms and Goose and comparatively unknown quantities. We need a top 4 defenseman and a goalie more than we need another top 6 forward so I don’t see the team’s biggest UFA signing going in that direction. It depends on how the free agent market is, maybe if they sign shorter deals but the market may end up being more normal than people predict.

 

[MadDevil]

A better skating Will Butcher would be a pretty good player. Although I'm not sure Walsh has as high a "hockey IQ" as Butcher. But I've honestly not watched much of him since I've kind of dropped off following college hockey the last couple years.

 

[Better Call Sal]

Bring back Brian Boyle.

There, I said it.

 

[MadDevil]

Bring back Brian Boyle.

There, I said it.

Only if he's on the PP.

 

[Better Call Sal]

Only if he's on the PP.

PP went into the toilet after we dealt him.

I’m only half serious but I love the guy and wouldn’t mind him being back in that 4th line role.

As for the point above, we will hopefully be getting some size with the forward lineup in guys like Foote, Bastian and Kuokkanen if they find their way on the team. Truthfully as long as you have guys who play heavy even if they aren’t big bodies, that will make a difference on its own.

 

[The Wumpus]

Bring back Brian Boyle.

There, I said it.

I think the entire team's average player size went down three inches and 20lbs when we traded Boyler.

 

[My3Sons]

Mentioning the draft pick was probably a mistake, my point is there is a glaring flaw to forward core made up of Nico, Hughes, Bratt, Gusev and Dadonov. I don’t know how anyone can watch these playoff and think a forward core composed entirely of shifty mites (yes, Nico has to be >>175 lb at this point but he’s not Dubois) is a great idea.

I like Dadonov and if we’re signing him or Hoffman I’ll probably take Dadonov but we added two soft offense first forwards in Goose and Hughes last year. Dadonov isn’t as soft (that’s not saying much) but having no size and little physical game in our top six is a still a bad thing. It’s fun to be speedy and skilled but always being the hittee rather than hitter wears you down, you can’t create space or crash the net and we are going to be completely physically dominated quite a bit. We all tsk tsked at the Leafs and that is a less physical top six. I get that these are the players we have to work with and there aren’t easy answers in the UFA market (or elsewhere) but we are hopefully leaving “the everyone sucks just get someone good who scores” phase soon and can start to think in terms of team construction.

I personally don’t have specific player wish list other than PLEASE GOD AT LEAST ONE NEW PLAYER TO PLAY LD WHOSE NOT TERRIBAD and good veteran goalie. Evolving Hockey’s estimated contract for Dadonov is actually bigger than Hoffman’s, they have 6y/7m for Dadonov and 5y/6.6m for Hoffman. Maybe they aren’t getting that in the current financial environment but I also think the chance of Devils signing either of these guys is slim. They’re older than Palms and Goose and comparatively unknown quantities. We need a top 4 defenseman and a goalie more than we need another top 6 forward so I don’t see the team’s biggest UFA signing going in that direction. It depends on how the free agent market is, maybe if they sign shorter deals but the market may end up being more normal than people predict.

I agree that LD is the top priority. Part of me wants to pass on any free agent wingers other than one top six winger to play with Nico and Palms.

I’d like to see the 22-23 year old players get extended play in the bottom six and see who sticks. Merkley and Bastian have both shown a flash in their limited NHL time. The team should see what it has in Kuokkanen who scored points ar a good clip in his short stint with Bingo. It’s also time to give McLeod a long look. It’s time to move on from Rooney and Hayden if possible. You still have Zajac Wood and Anderson to play bottom six minutes so it’s not as if they are just filling out the entire team with untested players. The hard part is going to be the wait until Foote is ready to play with Jack.

 

[Brooklyndevil]

so he is Will Butcher but hopefully a better skater

sounds like any PMD who struggles in the defensive and transition game

That’s why he goes down and refines his game. And also gives Walsh a chance to get bigger and stronger.

 

[Guadana]

So a smaller Mirco Mueller then. Hip-hip. Hooray?

He is 4 years younger and play in different game. But i don`t bet all money on him.

 

[Patrik26]

Bring back Brian Boyle.

There, I said it.

Put him in the shootout. Seriously.

 

[Guadana]

so he is Will Butcher but hopefully a better skater

sounds like any PMD who struggles in the defensive and transition game

Fitz should build decent d-core, where players can win their challanges, be decent on boards and can move the puck into the offensive zone. After he able to add young puckmovers for cheap deals, pump their statistics and trade after couple of years. And add another young puckmover. Ofcourse Fitz should regularly recruit players of this type.
Guys like Shattenkirk(or Butcher for example) are very dependent, but they can perform their work in good suitable terms. But I would not overestimate the specificity of their work. Reason why i`m not on Sergachev`s hype.

 

[glenwo2]

Put him in the shootout. Seriously.

I miss Boyle.

 

[My3Sons]

Fitz should build decent d-core, where players can win their challanges, be decent on boards and can move the puck into the offensive zone. After he able to add young puckmovers for cheap deals, pump their statistics and trade after couple of years. And add another young puckmover. Ofcourse Fitz should regularly recruit players of this type.
Guys like Shattenkirk(or Butcher for example) are very dependent, but they can perform their work in good suitable terms. But I would not overestimate the specificity of their work. Reason why i`m not on Sergachev`s hype.

Thise kind of players usually do well when given limited responsibility and are sheltered from tough defensive minutes. Don’t forget that even on a somewhat team friendly deal that Shattenkirk was bought out and had to play for pennies relatively speaking. I’m sure Butcher can play well with a very good partner on a third pair where he just has to make a first pass or gets offensive zone starts behind a good faceoff guy. I’m skeptical he can function well on a second d pair and play tough defensive minutes against second line forwards and the odd shift against the other team’s top line.

If NJ could package Butcher with Wood for a semi-legit left defender who could play well on the second pair I’d do that. The team can replace them internally over the next year or so in my view and while both have their strengths, they don’t move the needle enough to suggest to me they will help move the team towards winning even if they could be decent complementary players on a team that is already winning.

 

[Nubmer6]

so he is Will Butcher but hopefully a better skater

sounds like any PMD who struggles in the defensive and transition game

I believe Walsh has a hard shot, which would be something he has over Butcher.

 

[TheUnseenHand]

I believe Walsh has a hard shot, which would be something he has over Butcher.

Butcher has no slap shot, but he has a great wrist shot.

 

[Guadana]

Thise kind of players usually do well when given limited responsibility and are sheltered from tough defensive minutes. Don’t forget that even on a somewhat team friendly deal that Shattenkirk was bought out and had to play for pennies relatively speaking. I’m sure Butcher can play well with a very good partner on a third pair where he just has to make a first pass or gets offensive zone starts behind a good faceoff guy. I’m skeptical he can function well on a second d pair and play tough defensive minutes against second line forwards and the odd shift against the other team’s top line.

If NJ could package Butcher with Wood for a semi-legit left defender who could play well on the second pair I’d do that. The team can replace them internally over the next year or so in my view and while both have their strengths, they don’t move the needle enough to suggest to me they will help move the team towards winning even if they could be decent complementary players on a team that is already winning.

Yeah. And on his limited role with pp time he can reach his 40-45 points potential. His first year perfomance was good active for trade, but not good result for big bang deal. Zacha was better in his limited role(i know there is too many hot heads, but i think he is a decent third liner, pk-killer) for his money, and he did his job without good partners. Butcher and players of this type cann`t lead the attack by themselves and insure other players, cann`t be productive without drivers.
If we somehow can trade Butcher and van pick for Russel and edm first r.p. it would be Fiesta. Butcher can and should be replaced by Smith and Walsh(after time). And if Walsh can show real progression in his game - he should be replaced with profitable after.
Today game is placed on puck challenges and battles on boards. It`s about 70% of today hockey game. D-core should be competent in this components of the game and i hope couple from Bahl, Okhotyuk, Misyul and Mccarthy(and please, God or Devil, Sanderson) shold be a real deal. Limited salary cap will not allow to keep the best defenders of all stripes, the best centers and the best wingers forever. I hope Fitz will understand which parts of the mechanism are irreplaceable and require maximum investment, and which parts can and should be changed depending on the situation and the results of the development of young players.

Once upon a time Gelinas was 0.5 PPG player.

 

[OmNomNom]

sure, if you held up a photo of him in front of a mirror he would be

Think I meant lefty, typed this way too late at night

 

[Guttersniped]

I agree that LD is the top priority. Part of me wants to pass on any free agent wingers other than one top six winger to play with Nico and Palms.

I’d like to see the 22-23 year old players get extended play in the bottom six and see who sticks. Merkley and Bastian have nothing shown a flash in their limited NHL time. The team should see what it has in Kuokkanen who scored points ar a good clip in his short stint with Bingo. It’s also time to give McLeod a long look. It’s time to move on from Rooney and Hayden if possible. You still have Zajac Wood and Anderson to play bottom six minutes so it’s not as if they are just filling out the entire team with untested players. The hard part is going to be the wait until Foote is ready to play with Jack.

They will likely bring in a UFA forward because you don’t the want the sitting spare forward to be developing prospect, I have no problem with Rooney but he’s a UFA. Hayden’s a RFA, I don’t care what happens to him and I imagine no one else here does either but he may be back.

Anderson is on the team. I’m pretty confident that Merkley will make the bottom six, I thought he looked good in his 4 games. McLeod showed definite overall improvement last season and he will definitely get another shot but he does need to contribute offensively to stick. I don’t know if that will happen but hope springs eternal so McLeod goal watch enters year three. I missed Kuokkanen’s one game, so not sure what to expect other than what I’ve read but Fitz is a big fan. The crowd of Bing’s 20-22 yr old forwards could always produce a surprise in camp as well.

Not a whole lot of top 6 scorers are available as UFAs, it seems like a particularly weak group after Hall and Toffoli. Is Florida even going to lose both of their UFA forwards? They moved Trocheck already so they can resign at least one guy and let the other and Haula walk. Other than them it’s Craig Smith, Mikael Granlund, Carl Soderberg... it’s a very thin market. Maybe we get someone unexpected while bargain hunting.

 

[njdevils1982]

Think I meant lefty, typed this way too late at night

ya, i figured …. it was all in fun