News Article: Devcore is willing

[coladin]

I was actually in agreement with how the Redblacks did it. It works for the amount of games/weather they usually have.

Sens don't get that luxury, they need to go above and beyond in order to pull people in. It's way too easy to just stay home now. Making it harder to get to the games will not help that.

I agree that they need to build downtown (I've never liked Lebreton as I find it's still far from downtown proper, but there really isn't any alternative..) but they really need to make it as easy on people to get to and from the games, otherwise people will just stay home.

Also the Redblacks didn't sell out many of their games this season.

We don't even know the logistics of getting there. How long to get there? If the train is full, when is the next train? The Quebec side may alleviate some traffic as they are going in the other direction. And the cars have the capacity to move enough people?

 

[Smash88]

We don't even know the logistics of getting there. How long to get there? If the train is full, when is the next train? The Quebec side may alleviate some traffic as they are going in the other direction. And the cars have the capacity to move enough people?

I'm not even worried on getting there, that would be the easy part.. lol

It's getting out. All those people cramming into Lebreton station in the middle of winter won't be fun.

 

[coladin]

I'm not even worried on getting there, that would be the easy part.. lol

It's getting out. All those people cramming into Lebreton station in the middle of winter won't be fun.

And as it stand now, the station stop is not at the arena, correct?

 

[starling]

Most affluent people don't use public transit. That's why most NHL arenas are near highways.

If affluent people don't use public transit in your city it only means that public transit in your city is garbage.

 

[starling]

And as it stand now, the station stop is not at the arena, correct?

It's exactly between two stations which is the ideal location so people can walk out of the arena, hang out if they want and walk to either one of the stations instead of getting stuck on the stairs and escalators.

One thing is walking 300 meters along a nice well-lit pedestrian promenade with cafes and bars. Another thing is trudging same 300 meters between dirty and smelly cars to your parking spot at CTC. Apparently "affluent" people prefer the latter.

 

[Mingus Dew]

If affluent people don't use public transit in your city it only means that public transit in your city is garbage.

Well yeah, that’s the point. Ottawa has a poor public transit infrastructure and therefore no culture of public transit.

 

[FlyingJ]

Any move to downtown is gonna bring a bunch of complaints from people outside the core who are too good to take public transit. I live in Kanata, it would be more inconvenient for me but I still want this move more than anything.

Yep. I do think the move downtown and ensuring alternative revenue sources is necessary to secure the franchise's long-term health. I also think it's an opportunity to further encourage Ottawa to grow the hell up when it comes to using public transit. If we're ever going to move from being a big-small-town to an actual big city, we need to embrace using transit. Though OC Transpo consistently does itself no favours when it comes to getting people on board.

Serious question though: were there many people in Kanata pushing for LRT or complaining about transit out there until it was announced that Phases 1 and 2 of the LRT didn't include Kanata? Admittedly, I don't live there so it's not like I have my ear to the ground as much as with other areas, but I can't really recall hearing many complaints from Kanatans as the expansions to the highway seemed to be what people there actually cared about. I suppose once any place reaches a certain population there will be enough people bringing up the issue, but it just never seemed to be much of a priority for the majority residents.

Well, I guess people in Kanata would have complained about the initial LRT plan that was basically a glorified commuter line almost exclusively for Barrhaven, but basically everyone in the city complained about that with the exception of Barrhaven residents.

 

[AchtzehnBaby]

Most affluent people don't use public transit. That's why most NHL arenas are near highways.

I take the UP when I go to a Leafs game...

 

[Masked]

If affluent people don't use public transit in your city it only means that public transit in your city is garbage.

How many cities in North America do you think millionaires regularly ride public transit?

 

[DrunkUncleDenis]

People are nuts if they think everyone will take public transit to the games. That would take decades of conditioning before it would even be remotely workable.

Some will use it for sure, but a big segment won't, if they go ahead and build Lebreton without ample parking, they will have problems selling certain tickets.

Do not use the Redblacks as an example, if the Sens played 9 home games, they would sell out every game easily, but they don't.

I tend to agree with you re: conditioning, Smash. Arenas with no public transit work in areas because "that's just how it has always been"; case in point, where I live there is a 51,000 person stadium with 250 underground handicapped parking, and THAT'S IT. On the other side of the city, an 80,000 person stadium in the suburbs. People just deal with it. There is public rail next to the 51k stadium, but they actually CLOSE the closest stop as to try to disperse the crowd upon exit.

Knowing the driving culture of Ottawa, there will be a traffic problem, especially when it gets real cold. I'm not bothered by it, though. I think it will eventually ease over time when people actually figure out for themselves that driving down to Lebreton will be horrendous.

The train will be a game-changer, guys.

 

[DrakeAndJosh]

Yep. I do think the move downtown and ensuring alternative revenue sources is necessary to secure the franchise's long-term health. I also think it's an opportunity to further encourage Ottawa to grow the hell up when it comes to using public transit. If we're ever going to move from being a big-small-town to an actual big city, we need to embrace using transit. Though OC Transpo consistently does itself no favours when it comes to getting people on board.

Serious question though: were there many people in Kanata pushing for LRT or complaining about transit out there until it was announced that Phases 1 and 2 of the LRT didn't include Kanata? Admittedly, I don't live there so it's not like I have my ear to the ground as much as with other areas, but I can't really recall hearing many complaints from Kanatans as the expansions to the highway seemed to be what people there actually cared about. I suppose once any place reaches a certain population there will be enough people bringing up the issue, but it just never seemed to be much of a priority for the majority residents.

Well, I guess people in Kanata would have complained about the initial LRT plan that was basically a glorified commuter line almost exclusively for Barrhaven, but basically everyone in the city complained about that with the exception of Barrhaven residents.

Most of the older people I've heard talking about it (my parents/uncles/aunts/ etc) didn't really care for the LRT and thought it was a waste of money. But they're all suburbanites and it really has no effect on their day to day lives. Most of my friends who are students would have loved to have the LRT come to at least Hazeldean so we could get to UOttawa/Carleton easier. I'd also love to be able to hop on the LRT to get home from the market instead of splitting a 40-50$ uber or finding somewhere to crash.

By the time the LRT gets to Kanata I don't see myself having much use for it (unless Sens at Lebreton works out). I'll either be living downtown or too old to care about going to the market. Either way it's gotta get there eventually. All that said, I couldn't imagine living in Kanata without a car. So improved transit is definitely needed, especially if it keeps growing.

 

[Emerica]

How many cities in North America do you think millionaires regularly ride public transit?

Affluent = millionaire ?

I live downtown Montreal and know a few people who make >100k that don’t own cars. Much more frequent than you seem to think.

 

[Tnuoc Alucard]

Most affluent people don't use public transit. That's why most NHL arenas are near highways.

Still does not change the fact that the letter writer, I talked about in my first post on this issue, was totally ignorant of the parking and traffic problems that they assumed would be part of an planned Arena, located at Lebreton Flats, as they are at the current location.

 

[slamigo]

It's not just a car culture in Ottawa. Ottawa has terrible public transit. I don't mind using public transit in other cities but I don't even consider riding the OC Transpo. It's garbage IMHO.

 

[Tnuoc Alucard]

A lot is going to be walk up from downtown dwellers from the core as well. You will see a lot of Ubers as well.

I maintain as a downtown yuppie, that if or when they have the arena down here, I will buy season tickets.

Approximately 100K people commute, via public transportation, to the Downtown area, in Ottawa, on weekdays.

This means that week day games (at Lebreton) would just be a stop, on the "way home" commute, for a lot of people taking in these games, after working in downtown & Tunneys.

 

[Tnuoc Alucard]

People are nuts if they think everyone will take public transit to the games. That would take decades of conditioning before it would even be remotely workable.

Some will use it for sure, but a big segment won't, if they go ahead and build Lebreton without ample parking, they will have problems selling certain tickets.

Do not use the Redblacks as an example, if the Sens played 9 home games, they would sell out every game easily, but they don't.

The original RLGs plans for Lebreton Flats, only included 500 parking spots, and I think it's been updated to 1500 parking spots.

There will be virtually zero parking for the majority of fans, as these spots will be mostly for employees and vips.

Therefore if anyone wants attend games, then Public Transportation is going to be the way to get there.

 

[slamigo]

Approximately 100K people commute, via public transportation, to the Downtown area, in Ottawa, on weekdays.

This means that week day games (at Lebreton) would just be a stop, on the "way home" commute, for a lot of people taking in these games, after working in downtown & Tunneys.

And a LOT of those people are married with children. No way anyone takes the bus all the way home to Kanata or Barrhaven, grabs the wife and kids and says "Let's all ride the bus back downtown!"
It's pretty much only the under 30 crowd that will stay downtown after work and hit up a restaurant and take in a game. And tourists. Tourists will undoubtedly fill the arena to some extent.
But the regular CTC family crowd is not going to take public transit downtown. I know I wouldn't.

 

[branch]

Approximately 100K people commute, via public transportation, to the Downtown area, in Ottawa, on weekdays.

This means that week day games (at Lebreton) would just be a stop, on the "way home" commute, for a lot of people taking in these games, after working in downtown & Tunneys.

It's unfortunate that it seems that his ego is getting in the way of everything. If we are to take him at his word that he wants to leave the franchise to his children one day, shouldn't he swallow his pride and get that arena built at any cost?

 

[Tnuoc Alucard]

We don't even know the logistics of getting there. How long to get there? If the train is full, when is the next train? The Quebec side may alleviate some traffic as they are going in the other direction. And the cars have the capacity to move enough people?

The LRT plans on their trains running, every 5-6 minutes, and will have a capicty of about 600 people.

Therefore after an event/game there will be trains stopping, going in both directions, with the capacity to take roughly 600 people, in each direction, every 5 or 6 minutes.

So 18000 people would fill 15 trains.

 

[Tnuoc Alucard]

It's exactly between two stations which is the ideal location so people can walk out of the arena, hang out if they want and walk to either one of the stations instead of getting stuck on the stairs and escalators.

One thing is walking 300 meters along a nice well-lit pedestrian promenade with cafes and bars. Another thing is trudging same 300 meters between dirty and smelly cars to your parking spot at CTC. Apparently "affluent" people prefer the latter.

Between Bayview and Pimisi

 

[starling]

How many cities in North America do you think millionaires regularly ride public transit?

Not that it matters anyway, but NYC, San Francisco, Boston, Toronto, DC, etc. Whenever it's more convenient and reliable than sitting in a car stuck in traffic.
Hell even in Ottawa many people with million+ in their savings account would ride a bus to work because they value their time. There is a billionaire in Ottawa who regularly rides a bicycle to his office.
I find it funny how people perceive all rich people as living in glass houses. No, smart self-made people are around you. It's bankrupt full of themselves dumb narcissists who buy golden toilet bowls and start their motorcade to cross a street.

 

[Tnuoc Alucard]

It's unfortunate that it seems that his ego is getting in the way of everything. If we are to take him at his word that he wants to leave the franchise to his children one day, shouldn't he swallow his pride and get that arena built at any cost?

Yes, but I get the feeling that he wants to squeeze the remaining years out of the CTC before making the move downtown. Heck, it'll only be 22 years old this coming January, if my math is correct.

 

[bert]

Not that it matters anyway, but NYC, San Francisco, Boston, Toronto, DC, etc. Whenever it's more convenient and reliable than sitting in a car stuck in traffic.
Hell even in Ottawa many people with million+ in their savings account would ride a bus to work because they value their time. There is a billionaire in Ottawa who regularly rides a bicycle to his office.
I find it funny how people perceive all rich people as living in glass houses. No, smart self-made people are around you. It's bankrupt full of themselves dumb narcissists who buy golden toilet bowls and start their motorcade to cross a street.

Great post.

 

[FlyingJ]

It's not just a car culture in Ottawa. Ottawa has terrible public transit. I don't mind using public transit in other cities but I don't even consider riding the OC Transpo. It's garbage IMHO.

I mean, I don't have a high opinion of OC Transpo, but it's not the worst. When I went out to Calgary back in 2012, I was astonished at how lacking their public transit was Granted, that city is so spread out that I resolved to never complain about urban sprawl in Ottawa again (Ottawa has big city limits, but the actual urban portions are pretty limited, even with the Greenbelt, with a lot of rural areas really pushing the limits). I'm not saying we shouldn't demand better, but it's important to keep things in perspective.

It should be noted that the LRT is a good thing and has the potential to drastically improve OC Transpo too. Hell, I've often wondered over the last year if the increase in the don't-give-a-****-o-metre among OC drivers is because a bunch of then are going to lose their jobs once the LRT phase 1 opens. I mean, I feel for them regardless of how the poor service frustrates me because they are losing their jobs, but this is the result of creating a better and more efficient transit service.

 

[FolignoQuantumLeap]

How many cities in North America do you think millionaires regularly ride public transit?

Literally every metropolitan area in North America besides LA.