Online Series: De Niro, Pacino, Pesci and Martin Scorsese "The Irishman"

[NyQuil]

I’d spoiler tag that my friend.

I'd edit your post now, my friend, which incidentally contains the spoiler without tags.

Personally, I stay out of movie/TV threads until I've seen them after they come out.

But that is a discussion for another time.

 

[OhCaptainMyCaptain]

Stand out of the movie for me was Pacino. They were all fantastic, but he did the most for me.

 

[kihei]

Loved it. Thought the ending was great. Heavy. I could feel it.

Did not feel the 3.5 hours at all. Not once did I have an issue with that.

Felt pretty much the same way. I thought the ending made the movie something special compared to most of these Mafia/Organized crime movies, plus I really appreciated its total lack of glamour or romance about the life, a fascinating contrast with Goodfellas and, for that matter, the first two Godfather movies.

 

[NyQuil]

Felt pretty much the same way. I thought the ending made the movie something special compared to most of these Mafia/Organized crime movies, plus I really appreciated its total lack of glamour or romance about the life.

I found myself cringing a little bit at the steadycam shots (through the hospital). I know it's part of his style, but it just felt like a bit of a forced homage to his own Goodfellas.

Maybe it was an intentional contrast though - as you say, the opposite of the flashy club entrance scene.

Spoiler

Another similar approach was taken when you knew Hoffa was in trouble. They kept showing the car leaving and coming and going through that same intersection. It reminded me very much of Henry Hill's arrest day when he was running around doing errands.

It's a bit funny to put spoiler tags on a historical person but I will anyway.

Maybe I was looking for those connections as I was watching and I'm forcing it a bit.

In any event, I wonder how I would feel about the film if I had never seen Casino or Goodfellas. I find it hard to rate it in isolation which is why I don't feel inclined to give it a 10/10.

 

[OhCaptainMyCaptain]

My biggest complaints were that some of the scenes that required physical movements (like the grocery story fight) were absolutely ridiculous. Gotta find a different way to make those scenes work.

 

[HanSolo]

I thought it was mostly fantastic and one of Scorsese's better works in his last few outings but I have to agree with this:

The ending to me felt as if Scoresese realized DeNiro's character was shallow and devoid of any emotional complexity with twenty minutes left in the film. Tried to capitalize on unearned sympathy and family drama.

Particularly that it was unearned. The seeds were there for the effects it had on his family but because so much of it was focused on the fall of Hoffa, those elements were largely forgotten until the end, which ended up making the movie feel 15-20 minutes too long.

Still, great performances all around and a lot of memorable scenes. Just gonna be a tough one to rewatch.

 

[OhCaptainMyCaptain]

Anyone here read the book yet (I ordered it today)? Is that ending part in the book as well, or was that added by Scorsese?

 

[southsideIrish]

I guess I'm in the minority but I thought it was just ok. Fell asleep in several parts, and like others have said the CGI was awful. Decent movie but not the blockbuster it's being made out to be.

 

[wetcoast]

When I think about it, reviewing Scorsese's catalog makes me appreciate Brian De Palma a lot more than he's probably worth. But Carlito's Way and The Untouchables are good films.

Brian De Palma is a very underrated director.

Always did some very interesting stuff and even with his exotic name he is largely forgotten by many.

 

[Jumptheshark]

Anyone here read the book yet (I ordered it today)? Is that ending part in the book as well, or was that added by Scorsese?

The book is slightly different. It was built off of interviews.

When it came out it was taken apart by both historians and the FBI agents who investigated his claims. And they are having another run at it now.

 

[Pranzo Oltranzista]

When I think about it, reviewing Scorsese's catalog makes me appreciate Brian De Palma a lot more than he's probably worth. But Carlito's Way and The Untouchables are good films.

De Palma >>>> Scorsese

Yeah I should post that in the unpopular opinion thread.

 

[NyQuil]

De Palma >>>> Scorsese

Yeah I should post that in the unpopular opinion thread.

LOL, for sure.

Snake Eyes, Mission to Mars, Casualties of War....

Yeeeeesh.

 

[Cloned]

LOL, for sure.

Snake Eyes, Mission to Mars, Casualties of War....

Yeeeeesh.

Snake Eyes was an interesting premise ruined by cheesy casting and overstylish directing. Leave that stuff to Tarantino, who somehow makes it work.

 

[Hockeyfrilla]

Good flick.

 

[Pranzo Oltranzista]

LOL, for sure.

Snake Eyes, Mission to Mars, Casualties of War....

Yeeeeesh.

Well sure, but where are the comparables in Scorsese's filmography? Just stop and wonder what a Scorsese Mission Impossible film would feel like... And you could go the other way too, where are Scorsese's Body Double, Blow Out, Carrie, Phantom of the Paradise? I mean, I have nothing against Scorsese, but he is a pretty limited director who never took that many chances... And on similar playing fields, Scarface, Carlito's Way, The Untouchables, I think De Palma runs away with the cake.

I'll give you that BDP's later career is somewhat weak, but he doesn't get the opportunities Scorsese gets.

 

[NyQuil]

And on similar playing fields, Scarface, Carlito's Way, The Untouchables, I think De Palma runs away with the cake.

I enjoyed these films but I’ve always found them to be a bit hammy, overly dramatic and overacted.

 

[kihei]

Well sure, but where are the comparables in Scorsese's filmography? Just stop and wonder what a Scorsese Mission Impossible film would feel like... And you could go the other way too, where are Scorsese's Body Double, Blow Out, Carrie, Phantom of the Paradise? I mean, I have nothing against Scorsese, but he is a pretty limited director who never took that many chances... And on similar playing fields, Scarface, Carlito's Way, The Untouchables, I think De Palma runs away with the cake.

I'll give you that BDP's later career is somewhat weak, but he doesn't get the opportunities Scorsese gets.

Definitely disagree on this one. First off, the other way, around, where are the comparables in De Palma's work to Taxi Driver, Raging Bull, The King of Comedy, New York, New York, The Wolf of Wall Street, and The Irishman. That's a game that can be played both ways. They are two very different directors with different interests--who cares about comparables anyway? Plus, your comment that he doesn't take chances is mind blowing. How many directors can claim such diversity and curiosity in their choice of risky projects. Some examples:

Alice Doesn't Live Here Anymore
The Last Temptation of Christ
The Age of Innocence
Kundun
Bringing Out the Dead
Hugo
Silence

Then there are his music documentaries, which are excellent:

George Harrison: Living in the Material World (maybe the best single music doc that I have ever seen)
Lightning in a Bottle
The Last Waltz

Then there are the straight docs, like Letter to Elia about Broadway theatre and movie director Elia Kazan and My Voyage to Italy which reflects Scorsese's love of Italian cinema.

In a way I am a funny one to be defending Scorsese as he is not among my favourite directors, but there has seldom been a director with an interest in such a wide range of topics. I find the often lurid De Palma much less intriguing. And I don't believe Scarface, Carlito's Way and The Untouchables can hold a candle to Mean Streets, Goodfellas, Casino, and The Irishman. I have no problem with anyone claiming that they prefer De Palma to Scorsese. Matters of taste are obviously going to vary. But if one has to tear down Scorsese to make a case for De Palma, that does a disservice to both directors.

 

[Pranzo Oltranzista]

Definitely disagree on this one. First off, the other way, around, where are the comparables in De Palma's work to Taxi Driver, Raging Bull, The King of Comedy, New York, New York, The Wolf of Wall Street, and The Irishman. That's a game that can be played both ways. They are two very different directors with different interests--who cares about comparables anyway? Plus, your comment that he doesn't take chances is mind blowing. How many directors can claim such diversity and curiosity in their choice of risky projects. Some examples:

Alice Doesn't Live Here Anymore
The Last Temptation of Christ
The Age of Innocence
Kundun
Bringing Out the Dead
Hugo
Silence

Then there are his music documentaries, which are excellent:

George Harrison: Living in the Material World (maybe the best single music doc that I have ever seen)
Lightning in a Bottle
The Last Waltz

Then there are the straight docs, like Letter to Elia about Broadway theatre and movie director Elia Kazan and My Voyage to Italy which reflects Scorsese's love of Italian cinema.

In a way I am a funny one to be defending Scorsese as he is not among my favourite directors, but there has seldom been a director with an interest in such a wide range of topics. I find the often lurid De Palma much less intriguing. And I don't believe Scarface, Carlito's Way and The Untouchables can hold a candle to Mean Streets, Goodfellas, Casino, and The Irishman. I have no problem with anyone claiming that they prefer De Palma to Scorsese. Matters of taste are obviously going to vary. But if one has to tear down Scorsese to make a case for De Palma, that does a disservice to both directors.

Might have gone ahead of myself a little, didn't think about the docs, and haven't seen Hugo and Silence. What I meant is that there is - from The Last Temptation to The Age of Innocence too - a similarity in tone that you don't find in De Palma's work. And yeah, Scorsese is probably much more consistant. I'll rephrase to: high-end De Palma >>> Scorsese. ;-)

 

[Burner Account]

My biggest complaints were that some of the scenes that required physical movements (like the grocery story fight) were absolutely ridiculous. Gotta find a different way to make those scenes work.

That scene was a sore thumb for me, as well. I really liked Ray Romano as a supporting pick.

 

[kook10]

I guess I'm in the minority but I thought it was just ok. Fell asleep in several parts, and like others have said the CGI was awful. Decent movie but not the blockbuster it's being made out to be.

I agree. It was entertaining to me, but didn't seem original for Scorcese and had a few bothersome points. I don't think it had anything to do with the fact that I read when it came out either. Not only was the cgi weird, Deniro's body type was off for the younger parts and his movements were stiff like an old man. Pacino also only rarely bothered to do Hoffa's Michigan accent.

 

[GIN ANTONIC]

Maybe I need to watch it but I found Scarface to be a terrible film that literally gave me an ill feeling while watching it. I know not super relevant here but it was brought up in this thread and I don’t understand at all why it’s praised as much as it is.

 

[Neutrinos]

Excellent piece of film making, however, I felt the story wasn't particularly captivating

I think Pesci will win the Oscar for Best Supporting Actor

 

[KallioWeHardlyKnewYe]

Felt pretty much the same way. I thought the ending made the movie something special compared to most of these Mafia/Organized crime movies, plus I really appreciated its total lack of glamour or romance about the life, a fascinating contrast with Goodfellas and, for that matter, the first two Godfather movies.

That final shot in particular is a pretty clear direct quote of The Godfather. A damn effective and fitting one too.

The other film that came to mind for me while watching The Irishman was Unforgiven. The conclusions aren't quite the same, but there's a similar funereal reckoning to both. Clear final words on a genre and subject that their creators are most associated with. It is finished.

Great performances across the board from the main trio. I thought Pesci was very quietly stealing the movie out from under his costars, but a lifetime of Robert DeNiro really comes together and pays off in that last 30-40 minutes. Pacino can do bluster in his sleep, but his few quieter, flailing moments round out his portrayal.

My only complaint is the de-aging. It worked better than I expected, but it's still a distraction, especially DeNiro's artificially blue eyes.

 

[KallioWeHardlyKnewYe]

De Palma >>>> Scorsese

Yeah I should post that in the unpopular opinion thread.

I would love to build a big, beautiful house next to you on De Palma island ... but I can't go quite that far.

 

[KallioWeHardlyKnewYe]

Well sure, but where are the comparables in Scorsese's filmography? Just stop and wonder what a Scorsese Mission Impossible film would feel like... And you could go the other way too, where are Scorsese's Body Double, Blow Out, Carrie, Phantom of the Paradise? I mean, I have nothing against Scorsese, but he is a pretty limited director who never took that many chances... And on similar playing fields, Scarface, Carlito's Way, The Untouchables, I think De Palma runs away with the cake.

Hey, you're stealing my Matt Damon >>>> Leonardo DiCaprio bit!