Player Discussion Danton Heinen III

[BMC]

What a game for #43. This should go a long way to restoring his confidence which IMO was/is his biggest issue.

 

[missingchicklet]

What a game for #43. This should go a long way to restoring his confidence which IMO was/is his biggest issue.

Agreed. It has been a total confidence thing with him. I think it was around Winter Classic time where he missed a couple shots and you could just tell he was deflated and lacked confidence in his shot. He has been doing most everything else fine all season long. I hated it when he was scratched because there are much worse players on the team that seem to get a free pass, and at that point sitting him was pointless. Glad Bruce had the intelligence to put him back in and give him some time on the top line. If he can regain his shooting then the tune around these parts will change dramatically. Kid is good and has a lot to offer the Bs. Never have understood the hate aside from the lack of scoring compared to last season.

 

[sarge88]

Is it too early to pass the crow around?

In all seriousness... Look what the kid can do with some competent line mates.

Yeah, it's easy to point at the fact he's playing with two of best two way forwards in the league. And I'm not saying he's a top 6 fix.

But there's no middle ground between that and who he was playing with the majority of this year- Backes who arguably shouldn't be in the lineup, a couple of rookie centers and some brief dips with the second line.

And that falls on Sweeney. They need some external help! Can't say it enough.

If this is the version of Heinen that we’ll see from here on out, and they can get a second line winger for either Bergy and Marchand or Krejci and Pasta, then they’re in good shape.

 

[Alberta_OReilly_Fan]

Heinen is sort of damn if you do/damn if you don't at this point... im glad hes showing life again. but I was never that down on him. I pretty much gave him credit for being a 50 point guy all along the way

where my problem kicks in is the same problem Toronto faces with a guy like kapanen. 20 goal/50 point guys get a minimum 3 mill per year salary.

is Heinen a guy that tips the needle? even when he has a hot streak like this past 10 games... is he worth a 3 mill cap hit on our team?

Im glad hes heating up... it should help us get more value for him in a trade but my feelings really haven't changed. if we can deal him/gryz and get us an affordable IMPACT top 6 CONTRIBUTING linemate for krejci than I pull that trigger.

I did like heinens game today though... pat on the back

 

[Jean_Jacket41]

The skills are there. You don’t score 50+pts playing 5 on 5 hockey with Riley Nash if you’re not good.

He’s just in a team wide sophomore ultra slump.

He has the skills to complete very well Bergy-Marchand and allowing Pasta to go with Krejci and give a great 1-2 punch lines for the first time this year.

 

[sarge88]

Heinen is sort of damn if you do/damn if you don't at this point... im glad hes showing life again. but I was never that down on him. I pretty much gave him credit for being a 50 point guy all along the way

where my problem kicks in is the same problem Toronto faces with a guy like kapanen. 20 goal/50 point guys get a minimum 3 mill per year salary.

is Heinen a guy that tips the needle? even when he has a hot streak like this past 10 games... is he worth a 3 mill cap hit on our team?

Im glad hes heating up... it should help us get more value for him in a trade but my feelings really haven't changed. if we can deal him/gryz and get us an affordable IMPACT top 6 CONTRIBUTING linemate for krejci than I pull that trigger.

I did like heinens game today though... pat on the back

My problem with him all year is effort/intensity/consistency.
(And missing the net far too much)

In the last 25 games or so, we saw 20 games of crap, a 2 game benching and a few games with two of the 20-25 best players in the game before they got anything out of him.

I mean, regardless of how many times people want to say he wasn’t playing badly or was just snake bitten/in the mythical sophomore slump, he was bad for the vast majority of this season.

If people want to think what he’s done since he’s played on line 1 is the same (effort and intensity-wise) they’re crazy. If not for the number on his back, I wouldn’t believe it’s the same guy, when compared to what we saw for 85% of the season. It’s been night and day.

Going forward is he good enough to continue to be a factor with Bergy and Marchand?

Or is he what we’ve seen for most of this season...a passenger on the 3rd line?

Glad I don’t need to make that decision.

 

[JoeIsAStud]

Heinen is sort of damn if you do/damn if you don't at this point... im glad hes showing life again. but I was never that down on him. I pretty much gave him credit for being a 50 point guy all along the way

where my problem kicks in is the same problem Toronto faces with a guy like kapanen. 20 goal/50 point guys get a minimum 3 mill per year salary.

is Heinen a guy that tips the needle? even when he has a hot streak like this past 10 games... is he worth a 3 mill cap hit on our team?

Im glad hes heating up... it should help us get more value for him in a trade but my feelings really haven't changed. if we can deal him/gryz and get us an affordable IMPACT top 6 CONTRIBUTING linemate for krejci than I pull that trigger.

I did like heinens game today though... pat on the back

But assuming Heinen finishes the season in Boston, he isn't going to get paid as a 50 point winger, barring some incredible finish, and strong playoff, and if so I'll happily give him 3 mil.

His slump this year means Boston will be able to get him for less money, either on a 1 or 2 year deal in the offseason

And to be fair if Heinen signs a 2 year deal in Boston for say 3.5 mil total, and puts up 45-50 points combined with his strong 200 foot game, he will get a LOT more than 3 mil a season

 

[rocketdan9]

But assuming Heinen finishes the season in Boston, he isn't going to get paid as a 50 point winger, barring some incredible finish, and strong playoff, and if so I'll happily give him 3 mil.

His slump this year means Boston will be able to get him for less money, either on a 1 or 2 year deal in the offseason

And to be fair if Heinen signs a 2 year deal in Boston for say 3.5 mil total, and puts up 45-50 points combined with his strong 200 foot game, he will get a LOT more than 3 mil a season

3 mill???

He be lucky to get the same amount as Kuraly with the production this season

Good game today though

Maybe the benching has awoken him

He cant keep relying on this though

 

[Alberta_OReilly_Fan]

But assuming Heinen finishes the season in Boston, he isn't going to get paid as a 50 point winger, barring some incredible finish, and strong playoff, and if so I'll happily give him 3 mil.

His slump this year means Boston will be able to get him for less money, either on a 1 or 2 year deal in the offseason

And to be fair if Heinen signs a 2 year deal in Boston for say 3.5 mil total, and puts up 45-50 points combined with his strong 200 foot game, he will get a LOT more than 3 mil a season

ive done the work going to cap friendly... set the filter to guys under age 23 who had 1 single 45 point season... and I looked at their salaries.

you can do this too yourself if you want to see how nhl teams pay guys with 1 45 point season under their belt.

ill throw out a couple example

in 2017 {before the cap went up} teuvo teravaien had 77 points in his 2 seasons... got a deal for 2.85 mill
oliver bjorstrand just signed with 66 points in last 2 season for 2.5 mill
ondrej kase just signed with 53 points in his last 2 season for 2.6 mill
andre burakovsky had 73 points in the 2 seasons before he got 3 mill
and ryan strome got 64 points in his last 2 seasons before getting 3.1 mill

danton Heinen is at 63 points right now... still 3o games to go. he could easily have more points then any of these 5 comparables by the time he signs his contract.

how does Heinen stack up defensively against these guys? to me... hes very comparable to any of these people. we have to remember Heinen in arbitration eligible. we might try to force him to take a discount deal but he can just file for arbitration... and these are his comparables

I think he can easily make a case for 3 mill already... but at worst 2.5

 

[Alberta_OReilly_Fan]

3 mill???

He be lucky to get the same amount as Kuraly with the production this season

Good game today though

Maybe the benching has awoken him

He cant keep relying on this though

hope you will look at the real nhl situation I just highlighted in the post following yours... people need to stop this 'the guy doesn't deserve money' mentality because that's NOT how the REAL NHL works. Players with arbitration rights can go to an arbitrator and compare stats to other players who also have stats and if those stats are comparable an arbitrator will award a contract based on the stats.

look at the deal ryan spooner just got... why?
because... stats will get you paid. that's how it works.

this is why I am in favor of trading away guys who DONT DESERVE the money and ARENT WORTH IT... because if you end up having them on your team you WILL PAY

 

[Ratty]

Great game from Danny today. He’s put up points since joining 37 and 63. As Sarge parenthetically noted above he has to cut down on missing the net. I saw two opportunities today where he missed the net with clear shots. Just something he has to work on.

Here’s hoping this run, though brief, develops more confidence in his approach and more consistency game in, game out.

 

[The don godfather]

So are we keeping danton now? So confused with this kid.

 

[TCB]

So are we keeping danton now? So confused with this kid.

I think it was all between his ears. Sitting him out was the best thing that's happen to him this year.

 

[ODAAT]

What a game for #43. This should go a long way to restoring his confidence which IMO was/is his biggest issue.

makes you almost wonder why Butch didn`t give this move to the Bergy line a bit of a look sooner in the year? I understand that line with Pasta is golden but man o` man, kept pushing Heinen out there with the Backes`, Nordy`s of the world.....

 

[DoubleAAAA]

That may have been Heinens best game as a B. What a difference in his game. Would be great to see him continue.

 

[rocketdan9]

hope you will look at the real nhl situation I just highlighted in the post following yours... people need to stop this 'the guy doesn't deserve money' mentality because that's NOT how the REAL NHL works. Players with arbitration rights can go to an arbitrator and compare stats to other players who also have stats and if those stats are comparable an arbitrator will award a contract based on the stats.

look at the deal ryan spooner just got... why?
because... stats will get you paid. that's how it works.

this is why I am in favor of trading away guys who DONT DESERVE the money and ARENT WORTH IT... because if you end up having them on your team you WILL PAY

true

but also like Krejci... Heinen may have been getting a raw deal playing with guys like Backes on the third line

Then again Heinen did have ample of opportunities on the 1st two lines this season

Its tricky with Heini

 

[PB37]

So are we keeping danton now? So confused with this kid.

What's there to be confused by? The kid was struggling as a 23 year old, second year player. He's been given a fresh leash and to his credit, he's been making it count. Just add this to the bin of many reasons why you don't give up on young talent just because they're going thru growing pains.

 

[PB37]

Love that he's been cashing in on this chance. However, there's a few times the past couple of games that there's been a sequence where I felt a RH shot would have had a better chance to shoot off of the work Bergeron/Marchand produced. It's been awhile since they've had to play with a LW shot on an extended basis.

 

[KrejciMVP]

Win the conn Smyth heinen

 

[JCRO]

So are we keeping danton now? So confused with this kid.

You were the one pushing to ship him out for a bag of pucks

 

[The don godfather]

You were the one pushing to ship him out for a bag of pucks

Still would trade him for virtanen in a heartbeat.

 

[KrejciMVP]

Still would trade him for virtanen in a heartbeat.

Try for panarin

 

[sarge88]

What's there to be confused by? The kid was struggling as a 23 year old, second year player. He's been given a fresh leash and to his credit, he's been making it count. Just add this to the bin of many reasons why you don't give up on young talent just because they're going thru growing pains.

It cuts both ways though. He might be a productive middle 6 guy or he could turn into the next Peter Prucha.

I’d feel better about him if his effort and intensity level was more consistent.

I mean DeBrusk hasn’t played great for several games, but he’s always noticeable.

Heinen disappears and isn’t productive for long stretches.

 

[GloryDaze4877]

true

but also like Krejci... Heinen may have been getting a raw deal playing with guys like Backes on the third line

Then again Heinen did have ample of opportunities on the 1st two lines this season

Its tricky with Heini

Heinen really didn’t have “ample” opportunities with the first two lines this year. He would get a period or two, and then Cassidy would shift him down.

That said, I think it was MMB that was talking about Heinen having to produce “on his own” and not blaming it on linemates (or lack thereof). I agree with him up to a point, but I’m not sure how much anyone is going to do with Backes this season?

When a guy gets put with two players as talented as 37 and 63, they should produce. To Heinen’s credit, he has performed well the last two games. To my eyes, the biggest difference in 43’s game with those two players is his movement. When he’s with them he is constantly moving with and without the puck and it’s creating opportunities.

I would love it if he was a long term solution on that line, but it’s way too early to say that. What Heinen does if he’s playing well is give the B’s options. If they can get him and DeBrusk going AND pick up a wing and a center, imagine how tough they will be? Just a hypothetical, but say they added Toffoli and Henrique.

They could go:

63-37-43
22-46-88
74-Henrique-Toffoli

Or

63-37-88
22-46-Toffoli
74-Henrique-43

Any number of combinations that allows them to roll three good lines.

 

[rocketdan9]

Heinen really didn’t have “ample” opportunities with the first two lines this year. He would get a period or two, and then Cassidy would shift him down.

That said, I think it was MMB that was talking about Heinen having to produce “on his own” and not blaming it on linemates (or lack thereof). I agree with him up to a point, but I’m not sure how much anyone is going to do with Backes this season?

When a guy gets put with two players as talented as 37 and 63, they should produce. To Heinen’s credit, he has performed well the last two games. To my eyes, the biggest difference in 43’s game with those two players is his movement. When he’s with them he is constantly moving with and without the puck and it’s creating opportunities.

I would love it if he was a long term solution on that line, but it’s way too early to say that. What Heinen does if he’s playing well is give the B’s options. If they can get him and DeBrusk going AND pick up a wing and a center, imagine how tough they will be? Just a hypothetical, but say they added Toffoli and Henrique.

They could go:

63-37-43
22-46-88
74-Henrique-Toffoli

Or

63-37-88
22-46-Toffoli
74-Henrique-43

Any number of combinations that allows them to roll three good lines.

I agree this team is 2 forwards away from being a legit threat for the cup

Toffoli and Henrique would be nice