Dahlin vs Heiskanen

[Hokinaittii]

He’s the best Dman 21 and under in the league

Offensively yes. But let's not diminish the value of Heiskanen's better game in his own zone. They are both defenders after all.

I think it's pretty much coin flip between the two who is better.

 

[Snowsii]

Makar has like 16 primary points. He picks up easy points for sure, but he’s involved, which is a big plus. He’s the best Dman 21 and under in the league

Heiskanen and Makar both have 13 5v5 points (5+8) only difference is that Heiskanen got 1 and Makar has 9 points in pp

 

[RorschachWJK]

You can't say _every_ Finnish fans is biased though. It's wrong to assume because one's nationality.

Even Finns can see if someone is better than some Finn.

Exactly. It is actually even quite likely that Dahlin will be better than Heiskanen. So far he isn't, however.

 

[AvsFan29]

Offensively yes. But let's not diminish the value of Heiskanen's better game in his own zone. They are both defenders after all.

I think it's pretty much coin flip between the two who is better.

Makar has phenomenal stats defensively. Leads the league in GAR. I don’t know Heiskanens stats, but I am a big fan. He was phenomenal last year. Definitely a franchise #1D

 

[Erebor]

Makar has phenomenal stats defensively. Leads the league in GAR. I don’t know Heiskanens stats, but I am a big fan. He was phenomenal last year. Definitely a franchise #1D

The difference here is that Heiskanen plays 25 minutes a night, most of the time against the other teams top players. As an Avs fan you should remember how frustrated MacKinnon was the last game because Heiskanen shut him down.

 

[Conspiracy Theorist]

If Makar was swapped for Heiskanen the Avs would be instant contenders.

 

[Slimmy]

Makar has like 16 primary points. He picks up easy points for sure, but he’s involved, which is a big plus. He’s the best Dman 21 and under in the league

I don't necessarily disagree. Just asking for a bit of nuance.

 

[Kiekura]

Makar has phenomenal stats defensively. Leads the league in GAR. I don’t know Heiskanens stats, but I am a big fan. He was phenomenal last year. Definitely a franchise #1D

Yeah Makar is currently playing what people were expecting from Dahlin this season. Offensive threat who is great on own end too.

 

[steierwrass]

Makar and Dahlin benefit lot from their teams PP, when looking points. But they also are big parts of those PP's. Makar of course benefits from MacKinnon, Rantanen and Landeskog, but he is also able to help those players way many others aren't. But same time Heiskanen also doesn't have similar PP to play with. I guess, he wouldn't be as good as those two are in PP, but he isn't the biggest issue in that PP. Also his points get disadvantage from Dallas' system, which is more defensive than others. It's not easy to make one on one comparison on points. They are all good to attacking side of game. Little different tho. And little with little different game systems. If you want to see Heiskanen's offensive game with similar freedoms to Makar and Dahlin, better look game, where they are behind in third period. He plays differently.

In defense difference is now bigger. And big part there is how they are trusted there. Heiskanen is probably best defensive defenseman in Dallas on even strength. And he is used like that. It felt like Oilers tried to avoid McDavid and Draisaitl to play against him. (Hard to prove, when all played so much.) He isn't strong as some guys close to goal, but he can defend fast players in very top level. There aren't many, if any, better in league.

I'm really waiting to see, what kind of futures these all have. I have always liked good two-players. Defenders and forwards. This generation of defenders is special. These all have potential to win Norris very many times.

 

[RorschachWJK]

If Makar was swapped for Heiskanen the Avs would be instant contenders.

Come on, let's not go that far. Heiskanen isn't that much better than Makar (debatable if he is at all, just different strengths).

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

If Makar was swapped for Heiskanen the Avs would be instant contenders.

Or.... We can keep Makar and still be instant contenders.

 

[Dynamite Time]

OMG... this feud is still roaring.
They’re 19 and 20 yrs old; give it a few seasons. My pick though is Heiskanen.

1. He easily plays 20+ mins a game; 5 v 5, PK, PP; nails it all.

2. Points aren’t everything. Klingberg is our #1PP quarterback; a lot say Heiskanen should have that spot although I’d rather have Heiskanen on our PK than Klingberg.

3. Stars play a defensive/low scoring style of game compared to the Sabers offensive push/speed type of game.

Anyways Heiskanen again is my pick; he’d look just as good on an offensive team like the Sabres as well I believe.

 

[Unspecified]

Last season:
Heiskanen= .402 PPG.
Dahlin= .536 PPG.

This season:
Heiskanen= .60 PPG.
Dahlin= .66 PPG.

Your assertion is objectively false.

Dahlin is 19 years old.
Heiskanen is 20 years old.

Dahlin is significantly more productive and a year younger. Numbers don't lie. There's literally not even a debate.

Lets not also forget that Heiskanen is again averaging FAR more TOI than Jesus Dahlin, and for the record, Heiskanen is 8 months older not a year. If you are going to state something as fact at least let it be fact.

 

[Unspecified]

Heiskanen doesn't "perform" as well as Dahlin when it comes to generating goals, which can be objectively measured.

The question really becomes is Heiskanen that much better defensively to make up for less productivity than Dahlin. Tough question to answer, especially so early in their careers. I'm not going to claim Dahlin is better defensively and make a case, but I can prove- without question thus far- that Dahlin is better at generating points.

When the word "outperformed" was used, this was the context and "Heiskanen outperforms Dahlin" seems like a disingenuous thing to say with such certainty when the offensive numbers (objective facts) prove otherwise.

Waiting for stats to back this up....

 

[Zub]

Waiting for stats to back this up....

This is majority of Dahlin fanboys here, claiming alot of things without any stats to back it up.

 

[RorschachWJK]

This is majority of Dahlin fanboys here, claiming alot of things without any stats to back it up.

Some of them (you know who I mean) also concentrate on writing huge walls of text mainly about how there is a vendetta going on against their golden boy.

 

[BFLO]

Heiskanen definitely has the upper hand right now. Dahlin and the Sabres are in a major slump to put it mildy, some might call it free fall.

I think Heiskanen benefits from his teams overall focus on playing sound defensive hockey. It's easier to make good defensive plays when the rest of the team isn't constantly blowing their assignments.

Dahlin suffers from his team being a complete mess in all 3 zones, but especially the D zone. It's easy to get exposed for a mistake when no one else on the ice is in position or making a good play. Leads to Dahlin making some desperate and risky plays that blow up in his face.

 

[Stubu]

Makar has phenomenal stats defensively. Leads the league in GAR. I don’t know Heiskanens stats, but I am a big fan. He was phenomenal last year. Definitely a franchise #1D

I don't know about stats, but Heiskanen has been the Dallas #1D this year. That's with Klinberg's absence, but anyway.

Makar is awesome, I'm torn between the two, and then there's Dahlin. I'll just be a'homering...

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

You were pwned. Again. But please continue your crusade, it is providing laughs for many people

It must suck to spend an inordinate amount of time discussing a subject you’d rather look at a spreadsheet to form your opinions on rather than watching the game be played.

Is the point of being a hockey fan that you like watching the game being played? If you enjoyed numbers and spreadsheets so much, why not become some form of mathematician?

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

You can't say _every_ Finnish fans is biased though. It's wrong to assume because one's nationality.

Even Finns can see if someone is better than some Finn.

That’s true, and I’ve tried to make that clear.

 

[Kiekura]

It must suck to spend an inordinate amount of time discussing a subject you’d rather look at a spreadsheet to form your opinions on rather than watching the game be played.

Is the point of being a hockey fan that you like watching the game being played? If you enjoyed numbers and spreadsheets so much, why not become some form of mathematician?

Have you watched? Stats only back it up what people have been saying and that is that Heiskanen is CURRENTLY better than Dahlin.

Me and many else have said that Dahlin was better last year and on future he might and probably is again.

 

[Snowsii]

Have you watched? Stats only back it up what people have been saying and that is that Heiskanen is CURRENTLY better than Dahlin.

Me and many else have said that Dahlin was better last year and on future he might and probably is again.

Dont bother.. His golden boy cant do anything wrong.. It's the coach fault, that Dahlin is playing poorly (And he's playing poorly, coz he's misused)

 

[RorschachWJK]

It must suck to spend an inordinate amount of time discussing a subject you’d rather look at a spreadsheet to form your opinions on rather than watching the game be played.

Is the point of being a hockey fan that you like watching the game being played? If you enjoyed numbers and spreadsheets so much, why not become some form of mathematician?

Please continue! You are like the golden goose....laying eggs everywhere you go

 

[Kiekura]

Dont bother.. His golden boy cant do anything wrong.. It's the coach fault, that Dahlin is playing poorly (And he's playing poorly, coz he's misused)

Well Kruger did bench while he was playing just fine. But it is still Dahlin himself making mistakes

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Have you watched? Stats only back it up what people have been saying and that is that Heiskanen is CURRENTLY better than Dahlin.

Me and many else have said that Dahlin was better last year and on future he might and probably is again.

That’s rather ironic. The stat watchers clammed up when I asked if they’ve been watching any games. All they’ve been doing is appealing to authority and citing stats.

To answer your question, I’ve watched a number of games recently. Actual Sabres fans that watch their team play, unlike those like you with an anti-Dahlin agenda, don’t seem to have any issue with his play in recent games. Maybe you should stop worrying about Dahlin then. But of course you won’t because you are here to misinform.