Dahlin vs Heiskanen

[Panthaz89]

There was a debate which one would have a better rookie season and many swedes ridiculed finns who picked Heiskanen.

The thread was only supposed to be about Dahlin....no one even remotely starting doing anything until people just started randomly posting "Heiskanen is better" randomly in the thread its too bad people had to start an unnecessary flame war against each other. Same thing happened to Hughes prospect thread before he even got a chance to play.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

These have literally been popping up and starting due to Finn fans starting all the way back to Dahlin's rookie season in his own prospect thread......they've done the same thing to Hughes over and over again too your actually arguing for the insecure side if anything and can't even let certain guys get 2 years into their career without bashing them to death especially with people posting that Dahlin has been horrid defensively when he was good at both ends since he was 18.

My argument from the start has been that these two are idiotic comparison points, that's like comparing a winger to a center, but people have been doing that since 2006.

 

[93LEAFS]

No. IF Dahlin has a career like Lidstrom, then he is also a generation Dman. And Lidstrom wasn't considered generational until he proved it. For now, Dahlin is a good dman on track to be a star dman. No where near generational. Top tier young star dman in the league. Hasn't separated himself from the others. I'll take Heiskanen by a hair.

Lidstrom wasn't generational. Generational are players who are clearly the best player from their generation or have a very strong claim for it. It isn't position based. Lidstrom was never voted the best player in the league by either the writers who cover the game (didn't even finish top 3 ever) or by his peers.

The only clearly Generational players since expansion are Orr, Gretzky and Lemieux. Past that, you can make very strong arguments for Crosby, Ovi and Hasek, and Jagr to a lesser extent. McDavid is making a very strong claim. Past that, I don't really see anyone seriously in the discussion. So, I doubt Dahlin ever gets in it. Great young player, but I don't think he'll ever win multiple Harts or Lindsay's, which is what generational players do.

 

[tsujimoto74]

No. IF Dahlin has a career like Lidstrom, then he is also a generation Dman. And Lidstrom wasn't considered generational until he proved it. For now, Dahlin is a good dman on track to be a star dman. No where near generational. Top tier young star dman in the league. Hasn't separated himself from the others. I'll take Heiskanen by a hair.

By your own stated rule, Lidstrom can't have been a generational player. He didn't come in and immediately dominate a la Crosby, McDavid. He didn't even play his 1st NHL game until he was 21.
Also, again, Dahlin is doing things no D has in 40 years. Not sure what trajectory you're imagining he's on, but those are the sort of accomplishments that define generational players. He's got developing to do still, but he absolutely is exhibiting that level of potential/talent.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

He doesn't kill penalties, which is why they've argued between him, Risto and Jokiharju this season.

Their PK is 26th. They are doing something wrong.

In my opinion, Dahlin should be on it. Do you disagree?

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

No. IF Dahlin has a career like Lidstrom, then he is also a generation Dman. And Lidstrom wasn't considered generational until he proved it. For now, Dahlin is a good dman on track to be a star dman. No where near generational. Top tier young star dman in the league. Hasn't separated himself from the others. I'll take Heiskanen by a hair.

Thats not how these discussions often work. McDavid was called generational before he entered the league, as was Crosby and some say Ovechkin. There are even people who claim players such as Matthews were generational when they entered the league. This is discussed a lot more when they enter the league than at the end of their careers.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

The way rookie Dmen are tearing up the league currently (Makar & Hughes) it makes Dahlin’s production seem mediocre. Dahlin still has the potential to be a superstar but definitely not generational.

If you compare age and production, they are the mediocre ones, not Dahlin.

 

[Zub]

He’s very good. He didn’t carry them.

Defensively and OA he did, but you just wanna shit on him because he didnt score a million points.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Defensively and OA he did, but you just wanna **** on him because he didnt score a million points.

You are the one who makes up things and then clams up when asked to back up what you said.

There are 2-3 players in the league who carry their team. Heiskanen didn't carry his team.

 

[Zub]

You are the one who makes up things and then clams up when asked to back up what you said.

There are 2-3 players in the league who carry their team. Heiskanen didn't carry his team.

Care to give an example of what i've made up? Your'e the one shitting on Heiskanen and ignoring all the other factors that should be taken in when comparing the two.

 

[Oil Dood]

Lidstrom wasn't generational. Generational are players who are clearly the best player from their generation or have a very strong claim for it. It isn't position based. Lidstrom was never voted the best player in the league by either the writers who cover the game (didn't even finish top 3 ever) or by his peers.

The only clearly Generational players since expansion are Orr, Gretzky and Lemieux. Past that, you can make very strong arguments for Crosby, Ovi and Hasek, and Jagr to a lesser extent. McDavid is making a very strong claim. Past that, I don't really see anyone seriously in the discussion. So, I doubt Dahlin ever gets in it. Great young player, but I don't think he'll ever win multiple Harts or Lindsay's, which is what generational players do.

Eric Lindros was a dominating a player as their was in his prime, he was certainly generatinal until the injuries took him.

Dahlin has a couple of guys to get by to win those awards, not just McD either. Closest thing to a generational talent outside of McDavid might be Makinnon but even he is not there. As far as defensmen go there are none that I would call generational. In fact Orr might be the only defender that has been one.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Care to give an example of what i've made up? Your'e the one ****ting on Heiskanen and ignoring all the other factors that should be taken in when comparing the two.

In relation to Heiskanen. You said I criticized him. I asked for where it was, and obviously you couldn't prove something that didn't happen.