CSS Final Rankings

[leoleo3535]

I couldn't remember when they released them so I assumed it was on the 11th or 12th like this year.

Regardless, there is no sitatuon where you can defend that rating. He scored 50 goals in the toughest CHL league, he was not a bad skater, he was not bad defensively, he was a leader, a clutch player who was extremlely talented.

I don't care that they don't do these lists as the end all be all rankings, the NHL sure acts like these are all accurate and they're the best. Fans who don't go on this site would have no clue that CSS isn't for "Real rankings". Anyways, there was no way he should have been that low.

Look at the players above him.
http://www.nhl.com/ice/draftprospectbrowse.htm?cat=1&year=2010

Etem, MacFarland, Straka, a bunch of highschool players. Thats an absoulute joke and you can't say these were right at the time.

Your opinion.
We get that you think Skinner was ranked too low.

Looking at todays rankings how do you feel about Wruck's ranking? McColgan's ranking? Forsberg's ranking? St Croix's ranking?

 

[Bjorn Le]

Your opinion.
We get that you think Skinner was ranked too low.

Looking at todays rankings how do you feel about Wruck's ranking? McColgan's ranking? Forsberg's ranking? St Croix's ranking?

Its not I thought, its fact, and just about everyone on this board would agree with that. NHL teams too.

And yet none of those guys you mentioned were anything as close to as good as Skinner, most are guys they are ranking low due ot size or simply a reason.

I don't understand why you constantly defend their actions, I don't think you'll find anyone who agrees with those rankings, NHL teams included because the draft never turns out like CSS has it. Their rankings have no sustence to us, and untill NHL recongnizes it themselves instead of trying to tell us they're the premier source, we'll keep bashing them.

Its not MY opinion these are awful. Its fact. Theres not many absoulutes you can say about prospects and rankings but sicne these are out consistently every year and consistently they're awful and never reflect the draft or players after thats pretty strong evidence no?

And are you saying CSS bases their rankings on stats? Because you're giving the excuse the playoffs barly started, which kinda reinforces that.

I'm sick of seeing these rankings come out every year and the NHL putting so much sustence on them because its their agency.

 

[The Scouting Report]

Its not I thought, its fact, and just about everyone on this board would agree with that. NHL teams too.

And yet none of those guys you mentioned were anything as close to as good as Skinner, most are guys they are ranking low due ot size or simply a reason.

I don't understand why you constantly defend their actions, I don't think you'll find anyone who agrees with those rankings, NHL teams included because the draft never turns out like CSS has it. Their rankings have no sustence to us, and untill NHL recongnizes it themselves instead of trying to tell us they're the premier source, we'll keep bashing them.

Its not MY opinion these are awful. Its fact. Theres not many absoulutes you can say about prospects and rankings but sicne these are out consistently every year and consistently they're awful and never reflect the draft or players after thats pretty strong evidence no?

And are you saying CSS bases their rankings on stats? Because you're giving the excuse the playoffs barly started, which kinda reinforces that.

I'm sick of seeing these rankings come out every year and the NHL putting so much sustence on them because its their agency.

What do you want the NHL to do? They're trying to get people excited about the draft, so they publish their Central Scouting list to do so. How are they putting so much substance in them? By publishing them?

It's fairly basic marketing.

 

[Bjorn Le]

What do you want the NHL to do? They're trying to get people excited about the draft, so they publish their Central Scouting list to do so. How are they putting so much substance in them? By publishing them?

It's fairly basic marketing.

I know why they do it, but I don't have to agree with it or want them to do it.

It's not the fact they publish it, I want them to do that but they put so much into it when they get released. They hype it up like crazy and then its bleh these are bad every time but they keep pushing it. Last year they have articles on all the top 10 players, hell even more than that. I can't remember them doing anything about Skinner, just because he was 34th on CSS rankings. Even months after. After he got drafted year but I don't remember it much.

 

[The Scouting Report]

I know why they do it, but I don't have to agree with it or want them to do it.

It's not the fact they publish it, I want them to do that but they put so much into it when they get released. They hype it up like crazy and then its bleh these are bad every time but they keep pushing it. Last year they have articles on all the top 10 players, hell even more than that. I can't remember them doing anything about Skinner, just because he was 34th on CSS rankings. Even months after. After he got drafted year but I don't remember it much.

You're really deviating away from their target market big-time. 90% of hockey fans don't care about this list beyond skimming it quickly and taking away the top names so they might know who some of the blue-chippers are in the draft.

They really don't care about the 5-10% that are going to pick their decisions apart.

The NHL is marketing a product, the NHL Draft. You do that by hyping it up. They have an agency, NHLCS, which provides their rankings to do so.

It's pretty simple business, sir.

 

[djscooter]

I know why they do it, but I don't have to agree with it or want them to do it.

It's not the fact they publish it, I want them to do that but they put so much into it when they get released. They hype it up like crazy and then its bleh these are bad every time but they keep pushing it. Last year they have articles on all the top 10 players, hell even more than that. I can't remember them doing anything about Skinner, just because he was 34th on CSS rankings. Even months after. After he got drafted year but I don't remember it much.

Cool, we get it, NHLCS is dumb, If the NHL wants to use this to market the upcoming draft, its their choice. If you don't like them, no one is forcing you to read them.

 

[Dr.Sens(e)]

You're really deviating away from their target market big-time. 90% of hockey fans don't care about this list beyond skimming it quickly and taking away the top names so they might know who some of the blue-chippers are in the draft.

They really don't care about the 5-10% that are going to pick their decisions apart.

The NHL is marketing a product, the NHL Draft. You do that by hyping it up. They have an agency, NHLCS, which provides their rankings to do so.

It's pretty simple business, sir.

Thank you. The mock outrage, was getting to be just a bit much.

I love how everyone picks apart the Skinner ranking - which was a bad one, for sure - while failing to recognize that every ranking out there has massive stinkers.

If all the ranking were the same, it would give everyone nothing to be angry about. Which ironically, would make everyone even angrier.

 

[leoleo3535]

You're really deviating away from their target market big-time. 90% of hockey fans don't care about this list beyond skimming it quickly and taking away the top names so they might know who some of the blue-chippers are in the draft.

They really don't care about the 5-10% that are going to pick their decisions apart.

The NHL is marketing a product, the NHL Draft. You do that by hyping it up. They have an agency, NHLCS, which provides their rankings to do so.

It's pretty simple business, sir.

Outstanding post!

 

[Bjorn Le]

You're really deviating away from their target market big-time. 90% of hockey fans don't care about this list beyond skimming it quickly and taking away the top names so they might know who some of the blue-chippers are in the draft.

They really don't care about the 5-10% that are going to pick their decisions apart.

The NHL is marketing a product, the NHL Draft. You do that by hyping it up. They have an agency, NHLCS, which provides their rankings to do so.

It's pretty simple business, sir.

Already said I know why they do it, but it doesn't make the rankings any better.

CSS serves the main purpose of what Leo keeps drilling into us anytime someone basses CSS, and the secondary effect, that marketing where the NHL pushes it to be something its not is what pisses me off. If they're going to do that I'd want them to make the rankings a little more respectable.

@djscotter, I'm not even going to adress you because you think sacarsm is the way to adress your disagreements.

 

[leoleo3535]

Its not I thought, its fact, and just about everyone on this board would agree with that. NHL teams too.

And yet none of those guys you mentioned were anything as close to as good as Skinner, most are guys they are ranking low due ot size or simply a reason.

I don't understand why you constantly defend their actions, I don't think you'll find anyone who agrees with those rankings, NHL teams included because the draft never turns out like CSS has it. Their rankings have no sustence to us, and untill NHL recongnizes it themselves instead of trying to tell us they're the premier source, we'll keep bashing them.

Its not MY opinion these are awful. Its fact. Theres not many absoulutes you can say about prospects and rankings but sicne these are out consistently every year and consistently they're awful and never reflect the draft or players after thats pretty strong evidence no?

And are you saying CSS bases their rankings on stats? Because you're giving the excuse the playoffs barly started, which kinda reinforces that.

I'm sick of seeing these rankings come out every year and the NHL putting so much sustence on them because its their agency.

Again the teams use it as a list....not a ranking....hence the seperate NA skater, goalie / Euro skater ,goalie.

TSR, FC, RLR, ISS, McKeens etc. are all available and have some good info re the prospects.

 

[Bjorn Le]

That reinforces my point.

 

[Seachd]

Already said I know why they do it, but it doesn't make the rankings any better.

CSS serves the main purpose of what Leo keeps drilling into us anytime someone basses CSS, and the secondary effect, that marketing where the NHL pushes it to be something its not is what pisses me off. If they're going to do that I'd want them to make the rankings a little more respectable.

So you'll decide if they're respectable or not?

 

[Dr.Sens(e)]

Already said I know why they do it, but it doesn't make the rankings any better.

CSS serves the main purpose of what Leo keeps drilling into us anytime someone basses CSS, and the secondary effect, that marketing where the NHL pushes it to be something its not is what pisses me off. If they're going to do that I'd want them to make the rankings a little more respectable.

@djscotter, I'm not even going to adress you because you think sacarsm is the way to adress your disagreements.

The thing you don't seem to realize is that the lists of individual teams would be even more outrageous to you. They will have sure-fire top 10 picks not in their top 20 or 1st round altogether, and guys most see as in the 20-40 range in their top 10.

It's why NHL teams don't just go by the lists provided out there. Their scouts don't give a crap what CSS, Mckeens, ISS and you say. They follow their own judgement, which if nothing else, is subjective and meant to remain independent.

The CSS is attempting to show not only a list, but an opinion. The other ranking services out there basically follow each other and all of their outliers slowly trend back to the spot the majority seem to favour. It makes them boring. Redline is a bit better, but they and CSS are the only two sanity checks out there in terms of reminding us how divergent the lists are. This is why guys like Wheeler go top 5 when he wasn't even projected to be a 1st rounder by most.

 

[MarcPiquesFan]

If you dont think Nathan Beaulieu is a first round pick, than I would be very curious to see your top 30-40 prospect list. I'm sure it would be much better than 10 scouts who day in and day out scout these players for a living

Oupsss... :S I forgot a word ^^ What I wanted to say is that Nathan Beaulieu isn't even an early 1st rounder. By that, I mean, he's not in the top 15 prospects. Of course he'll be draft in the first round, but I don't see him as one of the best 15 prospects of this draft.

I should always re-read myself ^^ Sorry for the inattention here, my mistake.

 

[Bjorn Le]

Yet drafts are never as unreasonable as the CSS.

Regardless, this arguement is going nowhere.

 

[ponder]

Taking shots at people who have just passed away, yeah you guys are awesome, hiding behind the anonymity of the internet. Have some respect.

I had no idea he'd just passed away until after making that post, otherwise I certainly would not have criticized him. I posted this already in this thread:

Wow, I have not been following the news recently and totally did not realize he just died, I feel bad about that comment now actually. With that being said I have always found his player comparisons to be unusual/poor, but didn't mean to ***** talk a guy who just died

 

[YEGJuniorFan]

Dylan Wruck at 99, at least someone is showing some love. Kids a player

 

[KristoLeblanc*]

Being a follower of the LHJMQ, its a freaking joke that Beaulieu and Huberdeau are ahead of Couturier.

Once people will realize that Huberdeau and Beaulieu are playing on one of the best team of the LHJMQ in the past 20 years, there stats are inflated a lot and both aren't as good as Couturier. Sean is doing his thing for 3 years now, he was already a stud at 16 years old in the playoffs and his team this year isn't really good, despite that he posted an ridiculous +55.

And its not like I'm biased or anything, I'm from St-Jerome, the same city where Huberdeau is born and played his hockey. He imrpoved a lot and is a really good player, he is just not nearly as the complete package of Couturier.

 

[djscooter]

I had no idea he'd just passed away until after making that post, otherwise I certainly would not have criticized him. I posted this already in this thread:

Sorry for singling you out bud, I saw the two comments I just kind of flew off the handle at it.

 

[I am the Liquor]

Dylan Wruck at 99, at least someone is showing some love. Kids a player

Great wheels. Too little.

 

[YEGJuniorFan]

Great wheels. Too little.

I think he gets a cup of coffee or two in the NHL, worthy of a 5-7 round pick

 

[Bjindaho]

Thats not my point, CSS putting Skinner in what likely would be mid second round (Not just NA Skaters) was a joke. Skinner could have been back in junior this year and that rating would still have been horrible. I don't think teams had their opinion changed from a second rounder to a top 10 pick in 3-4 weeks regarldess of his amazing playoffs.

That 34 was ridiculously low and he should have been higher no question about it.

IIRC Skinner was 34th on their midseason rankings. He was something like 17th on their final rankings.

 

[Bjindaho]

I stopped reading after that.

To be fair, his comment about Saint John`s 4th line is completely valid. How Jason Cameron is ranked is still beyond me.

And I am a fan of the three guys he mentioned and would probably take them all above Tesink and Kelly for sure, and would consider taking them above Oke (whose game has grown by leaps and bounds).

 

[Bjindaho]

Oupsss... :S I forgot a word ^^ What I wanted to say is that Nathan Beaulieu isn't even an early 1st rounder. By that, I mean, he's not in the top 15 prospects. Of course he'll be draft in the first round, but I don't see him as one of the best 15 prospects of this draft.

I should always re-read myself ^^ Sorry for the inattention here, my mistake.

The thing scouts like about Huberdeau and Beaulieu is their growth. They`ve taken their weaknesses and they`ve busted their tails on them to fix them. Beaulieu came into the league with worse hockey sense than Jamie Bishop (Halifax pick). He has drastically improved this to the point where his hockey sense is actually helping him make plays.

And for those that say he is soft and safe,

The reason some Q fans don`t like the idea of him early is because he still gets caught from time to time, and his play has progressed over the year (so Beaulieu in October wasn`t the same player that is playing in the playoffs). He is physically capable and should be a good two-way defenseman.

On a powerplay that clicked at 25%, he had 8G and 17A on the PP.

 

[GM17*]

Ya he QB's one of the PP.. hard to say top one in SJ they could run about 4 units out better than most teams could run one..I would personally rank him 3rd on their D corps right now.. Gelinas is older and a more experienced.

I'm with Marcpiquesfan here. Beaulieu's a nice player and all.. and I could be very wrong.. but I've seen him 30+ times since his midget days in SJ and if he's a 5-10 overall pick it's gonna be a weak draft. He could eventually QB an NHL PP but I just don't think the brains are there. I've seen people say he's soft though.. he can actually chuck em pretty good.

I've also seen people say he's a safe pick. I don't see that at all.. pretty boom/bust IMO.. could be a 40-50 pt dman or could never play a game

Yea Despres is the clear #1, followed by Gelinas and Beaulieu who kind of mix n match depending on the gametime situation.

I've seen Gelinas + Beaulieu out together and it's pretty fun to watch. If he was playing like this from day 1 he'd be a pt/gamer (because he is now basically). He's no sure all star though thats for sure.

C'mon... Nathan Beaulieu isn't even a 1st rounder... That's a shame.

Pejorative Slured comment needs to be quoted again.

He's not top 10, but he's top 20 for sure. Saying he's a 2nd-3rd rounder or w/e is far more offbase than what CSS ranked him at.