News Article: Colorado Avalanche Media Coverage Part III

[CobraAcesS]

This is also a problem. If a "white" person is feeling hurt or confused for just being grouped into a demographic that has historically been privileged, imagine how a person of color feels for being part of a group that is historically discriminated against.

It can be hard for a white person to realize if they have been privileged, then maybe they don't deserve everything they have gotten. It seems like an attack on white people when really it is just reality that people of color have more difficulties.

See this is part of the problem.

Where did I say I was hurt? Assumption

Why is it remotely acceptable to tag someone with "privilege" due to their skin color? Stereotype

Who is anyone else to judge what someone else deserves based on skin color? Assumption

How do you quantify someone's experience in life based on skin color? Assumption

I have no clue how it feels to part of any other demographic, but I'll tell you this. It shouldn't be entitlement.

But you know that saying.. Opinions are like ass holes, everyone has one.

 

[LOFIN]

Ha ha ha, I am not even going to respond to something so blatantly and willfully ignorant. The stench of white privilege is too unbearable for words.

Yeah, when you think white people haven't been taken to slaves and been f***ed over it might seem like that. This is why these issues don't translate between North America and Europe. And I apologize, some of the stuff I said in this thread is out of place and because I live in Europe I can't possibly know about the social atmosphere of the society in NA. But I can tell you not everything you say also can be translated to Europe. Making generalisations is the biggest problem we have in our discussion culture.

 

[MaKarter]

See this is part of the problem.

Where did I say I was hurt? Assumption

Why is it remotely acceptable to tag someone with "privilege" due to their skin color? Stereotype

Who is anyone else to judge what someone else deserves based on skin color? Assumption

How do you quantify someone's experience in life based on skin color? Assumption

I have no clue how it feels to part of any other demographic, but I'll tell you this. It shouldn't be entitlement.

But you know that saying.. Opinions are like ass holes, everyone has one.

It might be more meaningful to chat with PM if you would like to continue the conversation. Stereotypes and assumptions that are proven with facts and research.

 

[Pokecheque]

Oh come on, that's not racism. The reason he speaks like that is because he grew up in Michigan and Chambers wasn't aware. There's nothing wrong with asking someone why his second language is so good.

If someone from the US (for example) comes to me and speaks fluent French you can bet that I'm going to ask them why their French is that good.

He took up valuable time in an engagement of limited time and access where someone could've actually asked a worthwhile question to ask something he could've have easily found the answer to if he just picked up his phone and bothered to Google his name. Would've taken all of thirty seconds, he literally could've done it during the presser. And other reporters and TV people have mentioned his background many times before. It just smacked of laziness.

 

[CobraAcesS]

Ha ha ha, I am not even going to respond to something so blatantly and willfully ignorant. The stench of white privilege is too unbearable for words.

Not that I completely agree with his sentiment, but you didn't respond to me either.

I think you enjoy having the microphone sometimes. One way conversations are easy though. Especially when you think you're entitled to the upper hand.

It might be more meaningful to chat with PM if you would like to continue the conversation. Stereotypes and assumptions that are proven with facts and research.

I'm pretty confident you didn't do a background check on anyone posting here.

 

[Foppberg]

Ha. I saw this thread blowing up (relative to summer activity) with multiple Poke posts so I knew it was going to be some kind of race/gender argument lol

 

[UncleRisto]

I dont think about him as a black hockey player. I think about him as a French hockey player. You just proved my point. You bring race into the equation, and can't think of him as a normal person. That smells like racism to me.

You're baiting, but firmly attaching a race qualifier to people is a base level flaw of the American social security system. I don't remember what the legislative thing was that's responsible for it, but that's how it goes.

He took up valuable time in an engagement of limited time and access where someone could've actually asked a worthwhile question to ask something he could've have easily found the answer to if he just picked up his phone and bothered to Google his name. Would've taken all of thirty seconds, he literally could've done it during the presser. And other reporters and TV people have mentioned his background many times before. It just smacked of laziness.

Yeah. But people ask all kinds of shit on the internet that they could've just googled themselves in two minutes. Lots of reasons for that, I suppose.

 

[LOFIN]

You're baiting, but firmly attaching a race qualifier to people is a base level flaw of the American social security system. I don't remember what the legislative thing was that's responsible for it, but that's how it goes.

That's f***ed up and I genuinely didn't know that.

 

[Balthazar]

He took up valuable time in an engagement of limited time and access where someone could've actually asked a worthwhile question to ask something he could've have easily found the answer to if he just picked up his phone and bothered to Google his name. Would've taken all of thirty seconds, he literally could've done it during the presser. And other reporters and TV people have mentioned his background many times before. It just smacked of laziness.

Uninformed? Yes. Stupid? Absolutely. Racist? Nope.

 

[Pokecheque]

Yeah, when you think white people haven't been taken to slaves and been f***ed over it might seem like that. This is why these issues don't translate between North America and Europe. And I apologize, some of the stuff I said in this thread is out of place and because I live in Europe I can't possibly know about the social atmosphere of the society in NA. But I can tell you not everything you say also can be translated to Europe. Making generalisations is the biggest problem we have in our discussion culture.

Okay, I get that. I'm positive Europe has some race-related issues, but I don't contest at all that they're very different and likely nowhere near as bad as the ones that exist here in the United States (and to a smaller extent, Canada).

And both major parties in the U.S. have done a lot to propagate and further systemic racism, otherwise I don't think it would have ballooned into the monster it is today.

 

[MonsterMack]

Crying racist/racism at the drop of a hat does nothing to fix any of this. Such a dirty label that's thrown around so callously that people on both sides naturally respond defensively.

 

[Foppa2118]

Since we're a bit of a global community here on HF, even though we analyze a lot of American issues, I think it's important to point out that issues like race may not be as big a deal to some, but the US has a much higher percentage of their population that are black, than Canada or lots of places in Europe.

Racism exists pretty much everywhere obviously, but it affects more people in the US than places like Canada and parts of Europe, because there are just a lot more black people living in the US than those countries. Both in total numbers and percentage of population.

USA - 48,221,139 - 14.7% (Black alone or in combination with other races)(44M and 13.4% identified as black alone)
Canada - 1,198,540 - 3.5%

I wasn't able to find what the demographics are for race in countries like Sweden and Finland, which is a little telling. I would guess it's around 1% Black. I saw numbers for African immigrants but that's not necessarily the same.

 

[tigervixxxen]

Uninformed? Yes. Stupid? Absolutely. Racist? Nope.

I heard how he said it but I’m not trying to get into a semantics debate. There absolutely is Russian racism in the sport and I wish it was one of the topics addressed with this new social awareness is the only thing I’m saying.

 

[Pokecheque]

Crying racist/racism at the drop of a hat does nothing to fix any of this. Such a dirty label that's thrown around so callously that people on both sides naturally respond defensively.

Drop of a hat. Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight.

Also, here's a nice example of another form of gaslighting: Bothsidesism.

 

[Foppberg]

I heard how he said it but I’m not trying to get into a semantics debate. There absolutely is Russian racism in the sport and I wish it was one of the topics addressed with this new social awareness is the only thing I’m saying.

Speaking of not trying to get into a semantics debate BUT, would Russian racism be Russian xenophobia?

 

[LOFIN]

I wasn't able to find what the demographics are for race in countries like Sweden and Finland, which is a little telling. I would guess it's around 1% Black. I saw numbers for African immigrants but that's not necessarily the same.

I think there are more people with Middle-Eastern background in most European countries compared to African. France and the United Kingdom are the two outliers, due to their colonial history.

 

[Pokecheque]

The development system absolutely needs criticism and he doubles down with fluff pieces on it, but that’s a whole other topic. He didn’t do the prospect profiles with Wheeler and I asked Wheeler about it and he said Clark has a lot on his plate right now. He only attended occasional days of training camp. I agree right now there’s not a whole lot to report on from the bubble but there’s stories like Kamenev’s absence, Colin Wilson’s disappearance, Kaut not playing in Europe, Cam Morrison’s signing deadline, Byram’s future next year, Barberio Switzerland rumor, Igor’s contract termination just to name a few. We all know these things (except Kamenev which he broke to be fair but I asked him if he has any extra details like was it conditioning or mutual and he said word for word the tweet again so that sounds like a PR drop to me) from mostly our own twitter digging.

Look I don’t want to rip on Clark, I don’t question the effort as I’ve said. I just feel like he’s got a long way to go as a reporter and especially the top reporter for this team.

I see. I like the strides they made in talent development, but I agree it's by no means an organizational strength.

 

[UncleRisto]

I think there are more people with Middle-Eastern background in most European countries compared to African. France and the United Kingdom are the two outliers, due to their colonial history.

Yup. That said, Finland is still VERY white, so that does influence these things.

Anyway, shouldn't we be discussing some terrible Adrian Dater article?

 

[MonsterMack]

Drop of a hat. Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight.

Also, here's a nice example of another form of gaslighting: Bothsidesism.

At the drop of a hat.

By "not everyone" you mean, racists?

Do you really think this comment is productive?

 

[CobraAcesS]

I think there are more people with Middle-Eastern background in most European countries compared to African. France and the United Kingdom are the two outliers, due to their colonial history.

I've heard and read there are issues in Europe for immigrants from those countries. It seems like a similar issue.

My last deployment was spent living among the population in Iraq. Some people don't simply appreciate the voice they are entitled to in this country.

Other places in the world deal with sex trafficking, religious killing, and gender inequality as a part of daily life and the normal.

Americans of all colors have it pretty damn good. Especially when you can break into a store in a major city and no one shoots your ass.

 

[UncleRisto]

I've heard and read there are issues in Europe for immigrants from those countries. It seems like a similar issue.

Certainly there are, but I wouldn't say the issues of first or even second generation immigrants are the same as we were discussing here. But definitely not free of issues there.

 

[CobraAcesS]

Certainly there are, but I wouldn't say the issues of first generation immigrants are the same as we were discussing here. But definitely not free of issues there.

Well, a group of people not having the same opportunities, and treated differently by law enforcement sounds pretty similar.

I think everyone has realized my point by now though, and that is regarding these issues not having borders.

I don't really enjoy it when Americans crap on America, and act like other places don't have similar divisive and in some cases worse issues.

I don't have a problem discussing issues either, but if someone has a grass is greener attitude they need a perspective adjustment IMO.

Most of these younger people who riot don't often have a basic grasp of the issues themselves, but hypocrisy isn't convenient for the people with the mega phones.

 

[Foppa2118]

Well, a group of people not having the same opportunities, and treated differently by law enforcement sounds pretty similar.

I think everyone has realized my point by now though, and that is regarding these issues not having borders.

I don't really enjoy it when Americans crap on America, and act like other places don't have similar divisive and in some cases worse issues.

I don't have a problem discussing issues either, but if someone has a grass is greener attitude they need a perspective adjustment IMO.

Most of these younger people who riot don't often have a basic grasp of the issues themselves, but hypocrisy isn't convenient for the people with the mega phones.

I would say that America having lots of issues with race, and Americans in general having a better life than most countries on Earth, aren't mutually exclusive. It's fair to point out both things.

 

[UncleRisto]

Well, a group of people not having the same opportunities, and treated differently by law enforcement sounds pretty similar.

I think you're assuming a bit here. Issues of recent immigrants are hardly systematic. Of course they can be to some extent. But that's a conversation too large to be had.

I don't have a problem discussing issues either, but if someone has a grass is greener attitude they need a perspective adjustment IMO.

Most of these younger people who riot don't often have a basic grasp of the issues themselves, but hypocrisy isn't convenient for the people with the mega phones.

For sure.

 

[CobraAcesS]

I would say that America having lots of issues with race, and Americans in general having a better life than most countries on Earth, aren't mutually exclusive. It's fair to point out both things.

I would say that its been loud here, and that is in large part due to the freedoms we enjoy.