Player Discussion Colin White signed for 6 years x $4.75M

[The Devilish Buffoon]

Duc and Pager are both in the top 20 G in the league and the general consensus is people feel they should make $4-5 / season.

I doubt White will ever be top 15 in goals or points but he will make $4.75 AAV and $6.25 his last year.

This year looks like a replacement/ELC type year at a $4.75 cap hit. I do think he will provide equal value to his contract for 2-3 of his years but I doubt he exceeds the value of the contract. He would have to have a 30/65 type season or two. My guess is he ends up with $4-8 million of negative value over the contract.

A 30/65 type season pre-UFA is an 8mil player in todays league.

 

[GCK]

I just disagree with you. I’d rather have Pager play 3C than White for $5 million for the next 6 years.

I like the possibility of getting an asset for Pager but I’d like to trade White for a 21 strong DMAN and keep Pager.

So what numbers would justify a 4.75M cap hit in your opinion.

 

[Sweatred]

So what numbers would justify a 4.75M cap hit in your opinion.

For what it is worth I think White should have been given a show me contract/bridge around $1.8 x 2. After that he prob deserves his $4.75 x 4. I think it would have encouraged a little more off season training and motivation to complete his development .

I think that viewpoint is all over these early pages. In the end I hope these 2 over pay years aren’t a big deal and White gains some strength.

 

[GCK]

For what it is worth I think White should have been given a show me contract/bridge around $1.8 x 2. After that he prob deserves his $4.75 x 4. I think it would have encouraged a little more off season training and motivation to complete his development .

I think that viewpoint is all over these early pages. In the end I hope these 2 over pay years aren’t a big deal.

I don’t think that was realistic coming off last season and the org having to show fans and Chabot they were serious about their plans.

 

[Sweatred]

A 30/65 type season pre-UFA is an 8mil player in todays league.

Nobody wants to give our 30G guys (Duc / Pager?) anywhere near that.

 

[Sweatred]

I don’t think that was realistic coming off last season and the org having to show fans and Chabot they were serious about their plans.

I don’t want to argue this - but we have Pager/Duc putting up great seasons already passing White’s 2018 goals and I see these forums suggest $4+ contracts for those guys. We gave White $4.75 for 14G playing with Stone / MD.

 

[GCK]

I don’t want to argue this - but we have Pager/Duc putting up great seasons and I see these forums suggest $4+ contracts. We gave White $4.75 for 14G.

Pageau and Duclair have history which limits their value for a single year statistical anomaly.
All 3 of White, Duclair and Pageau have 1 year of 40+ points coming in to this season, the difference is the other 2 had many seasons of no real production.

 

[Sweatred]

Pageau and Duclair have history which limits their value for a single year statistical anomaly.
All 3 of White, Duclair and Pageau have 1 year of 40+ points coming in to this season, the difference is the other 2 had many seasons of no real production.

White hasn’t done much in the league or the AHL ... it’s not like he has some great history. If anything he has a history of being injured and he was way below a point a game in the AHL. He got promoted of .57 pts/game in the AHL. Compare those numbers to Brown, Bath, Balcers etc.

 

[Ice-Tray]

White still makes me think of Fisher who got the same treatment. Fisher had a cap hit of about $4.2 during that time, yet the cap was about half what it is now. The calculated risk on White living up to that contract looks even more astute.

It’s funny, I had the same though yesterday but about brown. Not as physical, but man, the ability to shoot into the crest so often is elite!!

 

[Ice-Tray]

White is looking better

 

[bert]

So what numbers would justify a 4.75M cap hit in your opinion.

5th in rookie scoring 40 points in 70 games at 21 years old projecting an increase in production as the player continues to develop. First round pedigree from a very good draft shown ability as a versitile two way player. Thats what they used.

This team isnt close to competing for a playoff spot let alone a cup right now. Why are people expecting players to be at that level when they are in their softmore season as year 2 of a 5 year rebuild.

I am not happy with the way he has played. He is at his best when he is playing with a physical edge. He is great when his feet are moving he is hard on the forcheck and is a physical pest. He needs to get back to that. I am not going to give up on the player at this point, I have seen him play an effective game and style. He can get back to it, he simply has no confidence right now you can tell in his play. He needs to be mentally tough and get his game back on track.

 

[Sweatred]

5th in rookie scoring 40 points in 70 games at 21 years old projecting an increase in production as the player continues to develop. First round pedigree from a very good draft shown ability as a versitile two way player. Thats what they used.

This team isnt close to competing for a playoff spot let alone a cup right now. Why are people expecting players to be at that level when they are in their softmore season as year 2 if a 5 year rebuild.

And that was a mistake. They should have used his pedestrian point totals in the AHL and factored in the MS/MD/Alex Chiasson type effect.

Nobody expects White to be an elite player. I don’t think you will ever quote me referencing that. The player eval on White was a mistake and we should have set him up to continue his development. As it stands we’ve passed him around positions and lines scared to ultimately demote him.

We are paying him more than some have suggested appropriate for the 6th and 15th leading scorer in the NHL. We are willing to jettison Pager vs pay him $5 and we are watching Tyle Ennis types outplay White daily for league minimum type contracts.

I’m sure if I suggested to you that we should pay Brann or Paul $4.75 next year you may think that is a reach. Whites games isn’t any better than either of those now.

 

[GCK]

If Brannstrom has a pre contract year equivalent to White sign me vs up for 6 x 4.75.

 

[topshelf15]

Yeah he has been off for sure,but I was one of the people that was happy we signed him when we did...He will work through this and be better for it in the long run ,so Iam not too concerned

 

[Micklebot]

I’m sure if I suggested to you that we should pay Brann or Paul $4.75 next year you may think that is a reach. Whites games isn’t any better than either of those now.

White was paid based on his performance last year and his projection going forward.

Its not hard to figure out why someone would have rolled the dice on White continuing his progression from last year and not be willing to pay Paul the same amount this year based on his current performance.

Maybe if paul was 3 years younger and had almost twice as many pts this season he would be in a more comparable situation.

 

[Sweatred]

White was paid based on his performance last year and his projection going forward.

Its not hard to figure out why someone would have rolled the dice on White continuing his progression from last year and not be willing to pay Paul the same amount this year based on his current performance.

Maybe if paul was 3 years younger and had almost twice as many pts this season he would be in a more comparable situation.

I am not a big Paul fan but he may outscore White’s 14G and he’s not playing with Stone or MD.

 

[Ouroboros]

Playing like he's been palette swapped with Colin Greening.

 

[Micklebot]

I am not a big Paul fan but he may outscore White’s 14G and he’s not playing with Stone or MD.

Its an outlandish comparison regardless of how many goals Paul gets this year.

 

[Rand0m]

Probably because they are basing the sample size larger than 30 games like you are. Thats why theyre pros and youre not.

Well, I’m not claiming to be a Pro, but these supposed pros decided to give a 6yr contract after 1 ok season. And big surprise, the fire and intensity is gone... At this rate, I’m convinced he’d clear waivers if he wouldn’t be eligible.

I don’t disagree with the amount he’s paid, it’s the term that makes no sense. This isn’t a Chabot type player despite their similar draft pedigree. White seems like more of a complimentary player, he doesn’t drive the play himself. As other have said, he’s being outplayed and outworked by most fringe UFA’s on this team. Not a good look for him.

Now this is more of an indication of the poorly built team, but at this point, White is the highest paid player on this team, he sure isn’t playing like it.

 

[BloodRedArmy]

For what it is worth I think White should have been given a show me contract/bridge around $1.8 x 2. After that he prob deserves his $4.75 x 4. I think it would have encouraged a little more off season training and motivation to complete his development .

Guess what his agent would have said to those numbers.

 

[Do Make Say Think]

I was a major backer of his and he's been a let down, no way around it. He seems to be a complimentary player through-and-through.

Not without hope however: his level of play has been consistent and we know he can produce; it is just a matter of finding the right fit. Hopefully it will come in the form of a very highly drafted forward next year

 

[Sweatred]

Its an outlandish comparison regardless of how many goals Paul gets this year.

Outlandish ? Doesn’t Paul have 6 goals in 40 games ? What is outlandish about it? Paul limited play is more effective than White’s ...

 

[Micklebot]

Outlandish ? Doesn’t Paul have 6 goals in 40 games ? What is outlandish about it? Paul limited play is more effective than White’s ...

No he doesn't, he has 6 goals in 35 games but even if he did have those extra 2 goals comparing the contract negotiations of a 24 year old Paul who is on pace for 24 pts in 71 games to a 21 year old White who got 41 pts in 71 games is outlandish. If you can't admit that there is no real need to continue here.

 

[Sweatred]

No he doesn't, he has 6 goals in 35 games but even if he did have those extra 2 goals comparing the contract negotiations of a 24 year old Paul who is on pace for 24 pts in 71 games to a 21 year old White who got 41 pts in 71 games is outlandish. If you can't admit that there is no real need to continue here.

The White fan base is so hung up on those 41pts last year. Behind that is a undeveloped player who is weak on the puck and a turnover machine. His play prob slots him in the top 6 lines in the org. The worst thing for his development was picking up those points with Stone. It got everyone so excited.

If you don’t see that I agree there is no need to continue here.

 

[JungleBeat]

White has played like a grinder since he got drafted. He’s not going to change his play style overnight and become a centre that can create plays for his wingers.