EightyOne
My posts are jokes. And hockey is just a game.
- Nov 23, 2016
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Post-Game Talk: Cole's Plus/Minus: End the road trip right!
- Thread starter ColePens
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YES THIS!! Thanks!! Although I thought I remembered another one with him holding the cup and the sign being yellow with a younger guy.
This. And it wasn't "because he was playing with talent", although that helped. He was skating and engaging even when he wasn't "playing with talent". Like most, he'll look better when he's on the ice with super stars, because they make everyone look better, but this was HIM playing significantly better then he has been in recent games.
And if I recall correctly, half of them were weak from distance chest shots with little chance of going in. I guess it's a start, but I wouldn't be bragging about that stat if you'd actually paid attention to the game itself.
TB is not a guy you want sitting for 50+ games a season. Grant and Ruhwedel are perfect for that role (for us). We're not worried about their development and we're not worried about pissing them off by not playing them. Blueger and Riikola can't sit for 50+ games because we're otherwise healthy and ppl are playing well. TB can come up when we need him, or if we want to get some looks or he's earned a couple games. He'll get his shot - if not this season, then next season. But as a 13F, Grant is ideal - even if he's "vanilla".
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Hainsey says hi (acquired 1 week before the TD). So does Schultz. And Kunitz (although not a rental with 3.5 yrs on his deal at the time) and Guerin. But the other 3 were all rentals (zero chance we were going to qualify Schultz at 3.9m). And then there's Hossa even though we "only" made it to GM6 of the cup finals that season.
And that's just the Pens... pretty sure I could look at other teams and see other smart deadline pick up's that did well for them.
I don't think swinging for the fences on a big name is the smartest use of the assets - even though if properly done most of the assets are vastly over valued. But I do think that properly thought out acquisitions are important to give teams the best chance possible to have post season success.
EightyOne
My posts are jokes. And hockey is just a game.
- Nov 23, 2016
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Right. Properly thought out.
I suppose I left too much to interpretation.
When discussing 'rentals' I thought it was obvious that these are the BIG name players with pending FA contracts expected to take a team to a championship and possibly re-sign.
Those deals rarely work out and rarely end with the player re-signing.
Kane last year was one of these rental deals. Surprisingly, he kinda did well with the new team AND re-signed. It took minimal assets to land him and having him on the team was a benefit. But it ultimately did not improve the Sharks' season. So, objectively I have to say it too was a failure. Just not spectacularly so.
I consider Hossa a fail. He didn't push the team to Game 6 on his back--but his scoring touches were nice. And he left in the summer (only to be crushed the next year...sweeeet!). Iginla was a failure--both in season (despite point totals) and the fact he left.
I think you're off base with this one. While it's disappointing that he didn't sign, I question whether we would have gone as far as we did without him as he was a pretty big part of our success that post season.
As for only looking at "big name" guys... I think it's several things that need to be taken into account. First off, only 1 team wins the cup, which means most rentals "fail" if the only measure of success is winning it all. Secondly there's only so many "big name guys" who get moved as rentals at/near the TD in any given year... which means the odds of a guy getting moved, and then meeting your "measure" of "success" is very low even if they have a big impact for their team in a given PO run. I mean Stastny (like Hossa) would fall into this category last season - even though he was a great pick up for Winnipeg and was a huge part of their run to the WCF, by every measure out there other than lifting a cup, that trade was a success.
Anyway, we're way OT here.
Icarium
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- Feb 16, 2010
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I was watching the game and thinking this was one of the most dominant game of Geno in a while and he only had one secondary assist and right on cue he scored two. Attaboy! After the first 10 or so minutes the Pens took over the game and never looked back. Didn't even need a PP goal this time. I hope we have seen the end of Rust on Crosby's wing, Simon is inconsistent, sure but Rust is consistently terrible on Sid's wing. And, of course, I am very happy for Sprong and De Smith, what a road trip this has been, the Pens looked so mediocre prior to it and now look amazing.
ColePens
RIP Fugu Buffaloed & parabola
This is a big time no-no post for me. Who are you trading? And which one of our guys like 38 like the examples you gave?
- Horny? Not many people in the league can carry his jockstrap at what he does. And if you watch other games you will see how many teams are desperate for a player like him.
- Kessel? 92 point guy, big part of 2 Cups, and on fire with HMK to start the season. No freaking way.
- Hags? The guy who does the biggest thankless job on the team? Nope.
- Cully? For what.. a 7th? Just to try young guys like we did last year and lose out on what Dad has already given us? No thanks.
And even if you have the greatest team, loaded top/bottom, it doesn't guarantee a Cup. If we win one more, we are beyond blessed. I personally believe thought process like that could ruin this window faster than anything.
Im happy for Simon and sprong and hope thay keep playing the same way as they did in vancouver
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Mr Jiggyfly
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- Jan 29, 2004
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Have to disagree. Simon is very good on the walls. No idea why he has a rep around here of being soft and bad on the walls. Guess it’s the same reason so many never saw his obvious skill set.
Board play has always been something I’ve raved about Simon since I first started watching him. I called him a little Wolverine because he just keeps fighting and clawing and beats guys way bigger than him with his never say die mentality.
He is the one who outworked two Cannucks down low on Crosby’s second goal and pushed the puck to Guentzel...
Mr Jiggyfly
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- Jan 29, 2004
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Sprong is definitely at his best as a volume shooter, but he is an underrated passer as I keep trying to stress. He doesn’t need to get 7-8 shots on net to be effective, basically. He’s not Neal and I hate that comparison.
However, he’s like Kessel in the fact you want him to keep shooting. He’s had a couple games I watched where he was just on fire and had well over ten shots on goal and attempted something insane like 15 shots during ea of those games.
The Old Master
come and take it.
SHOOTANDSCORE
Eeny Meeny Miny Moe
- Sep 25, 2005
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I know we have kind of come to expect this level of play from Geno and Sid but I have to give them credit. Especially since I called them out at the beginning of the season. They're playing great hockey. It's a joy to watch.
I also have to give credit to Phil. When you see him cycling down low and cleaning up the garbage, you know he's on his game.
I liked Sprong's game, even in the first. He was really moving his legs and getting his nose dirty. You could see his confidence building. It was great to see Simon pull out of his slump too.
I also have to give credit to Phil. When you see him cycling down low and cleaning up the garbage, you know he's on his game.
I liked Sprong's game, even in the first. He was really moving his legs and getting his nose dirty. You could see his confidence building. It was great to see Simon pull out of his slump too.
JimmyTwoTimes
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- Apr 13, 2010
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Agree with first part but if we could land another potential top 6 player thru the draft that would increase odds as well.
Im talking 5-6 years away tho...who knows where we are at by then. Maybe make a trade for an elite player by then..sign one in FA..etc. Whoever the GM is by the time those 2 are 37-38 Im sure we will go after some high end FAs. Like I said..thats when we will have to start surrounding them with more talent.
Our best odds are these next few years but if handled right we should still be able to make the playoffs and maybe put together another run.
JimmyTwoTimes
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- Apr 13, 2010
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Talking about guys we have in our system who havent gotten their chance yet. Hoping a few of them can surprise and bring that type of value for a trade.
And if we want to extend our current window we are going to need guys like Bellerive/Hallander to reach their full potential to go with our top 3( and Hornqvist, Guentzel , etc).
Not sure if we have to go all in (trading our first) for these next few seasons was my original point.
I agree with the sentiment but there's so many ways to get talent around Sid and Geno 5-6 years down line if its a goer that I wouldn't be too fussed about who we draft now - certainly not compared to the possibility of pursuing cups with everything we've got now. I'm not saying spend picks and prospects like water, but accumulating them has to be something that occurs organically.
And pushing out players to make space for unproven kids isn't organic.
USMC607
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PensandCaps
Beddy Tlueger
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Dipsy Doodle
Rent A Barn
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Courtesy of the most time TOI he's seen this year and playing with a scoring line center.
Ogrezilla
Nerf Herder
it's neat how even though Sprong didn't immediately get that chance to start the year, Sully was still able to play him in a better spot last night. I wonder if any more opportunities will come up over the 73 games we have left.Courtesy of the most time TOI he's seen this year and playing with a scoring line center.
Seriously though, good stuff from Sprong. That's exactly what he needs to do; keep his head above water and then impress when he gets better chances.
BlindWillyMcHurt
ti kallisti
- May 31, 2004
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Well that was certainly an inspiring road trip. This group definitely seems to be coming together. I usually kinda roll my eyes a little at "team building trips." But if that's going to be the result, here's to hoping they pop up to Banff at least every other week from here on out. It's a hell of a lot better than hauling rocks up a hill, that's for sure. Verdict is still mostly out since it's still way too early, yet. But most areas of concern to start the year seem to be consistently trending in the right direction.
HMK keeps on clicking along. Despite all the success I still understand people's worries over that line. But overall, like I've been saying for a while, Malkin and Kessel can and will continue to simply produce. They just... work. Malkin's joking-not-joking quote about Kessel and his work rate is very, very accurate, though. When Kessel plays like he has, they are more or less unstoppable. An opposing coach's worst nightmare. The scary thing though is that even when both are off they are likely to put some goals up. That said... Sprong's nifty setup and overall tryout on Malkin's wing is super intriguing. I can't help but agree with the sentiment that those two seem a natural fit. It's just kind of unfortunate as far as timing and line construction. Hopefully they find a way to work him in there regularly, along with Sid.
The nutty thing to me about the way Malkin has produced so far this year is that to my eyes... he's not been entirely up to his standards in probably about half the games he's played to date. Which isn't surprising or upsetting -- I don't want him trying to move mountains in October. I also think he could even have a handful more points, already. Though of course you could pick just about any player out of the lineup and say the same. It's just crazy how effortless he can make it look out there when he's really on. Like that second goal last night on a half-snapper/wrister... that release was zany. It's like he barely moves and the puck is already in and out of the net top corner. Errey actually said it best -- sometimes it's just not fair.
It's great to see Crosby (and a handful of others, especially Horns) get back into their groove. Matter of time, of course. But still great to see. Loved that tic-tac-toe goal Sid finished off last night. Terrific work by Simon to start that sequence. I would be surprised by Big Rig's hands/vision there but he's shown some of that a few times in the past.
Sprong and Simon with extremely promising games. Took Sprong a little bit to get into it but as someone already mentioned above... I think that shift with Sid gave him some confidence.
I thought Pettersson looked like the real deal for Vancouver. Like Goldobin's game, too. Though the rest of the team looked incredibly flat. Pouliot is a flaming bag of dogshit. Sutter is every bit as "bleh" as I remember, too. Super classy gesture by the team and city of Vancouver re: the moment of silence. I have nothing but unbridled hate for the vast majority of the rest of the league and their fans. But I've always kinda liked Vancouver. They seem really chill. Relaxed. Able to take things in stride. Deep thinkers. Extremely fond of snack foods. Like to laugh a lot. Big video game fans. Always down for listening to lots of music.
Really all of Canada seems in the same boat, lately. No idea why. I'm green with envy, though.
HMK keeps on clicking along. Despite all the success I still understand people's worries over that line. But overall, like I've been saying for a while, Malkin and Kessel can and will continue to simply produce. They just... work. Malkin's joking-not-joking quote about Kessel and his work rate is very, very accurate, though. When Kessel plays like he has, they are more or less unstoppable. An opposing coach's worst nightmare. The scary thing though is that even when both are off they are likely to put some goals up. That said... Sprong's nifty setup and overall tryout on Malkin's wing is super intriguing. I can't help but agree with the sentiment that those two seem a natural fit. It's just kind of unfortunate as far as timing and line construction. Hopefully they find a way to work him in there regularly, along with Sid.
The nutty thing to me about the way Malkin has produced so far this year is that to my eyes... he's not been entirely up to his standards in probably about half the games he's played to date. Which isn't surprising or upsetting -- I don't want him trying to move mountains in October. I also think he could even have a handful more points, already. Though of course you could pick just about any player out of the lineup and say the same. It's just crazy how effortless he can make it look out there when he's really on. Like that second goal last night on a half-snapper/wrister... that release was zany. It's like he barely moves and the puck is already in and out of the net top corner. Errey actually said it best -- sometimes it's just not fair.
It's great to see Crosby (and a handful of others, especially Horns) get back into their groove. Matter of time, of course. But still great to see. Loved that tic-tac-toe goal Sid finished off last night. Terrific work by Simon to start that sequence. I would be surprised by Big Rig's hands/vision there but he's shown some of that a few times in the past.
Sprong and Simon with extremely promising games. Took Sprong a little bit to get into it but as someone already mentioned above... I think that shift with Sid gave him some confidence.
I thought Pettersson looked like the real deal for Vancouver. Like Goldobin's game, too. Though the rest of the team looked incredibly flat. Pouliot is a flaming bag of dogshit. Sutter is every bit as "bleh" as I remember, too. Super classy gesture by the team and city of Vancouver re: the moment of silence. I have nothing but unbridled hate for the vast majority of the rest of the league and their fans. But I've always kinda liked Vancouver. They seem really chill. Relaxed. Able to take things in stride. Deep thinkers. Extremely fond of snack foods. Like to laugh a lot. Big video game fans. Always down for listening to lots of music.
Really all of Canada seems in the same boat, lately. No idea why. I'm green with envy, though.
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What are the rules regarding jersey numbers in the NHL?
I would love to see Malkin come out with a 101 jersey on, even just for warmups, preferably in a game against the Hawks...
I would love to see Malkin come out with a 101 jersey on, even just for warmups, preferably in a game against the Hawks...
Empoleon8771
Registered User
I'm just surprised he was good because he has alternated between good games and bad games, so I fully expected this to be a bad game for him
I think what this road trip has showed is that how individual guys like Johnson, Oleksiak and Maatta look defensively depends a lot on how structured the team is playing. If the team is playing structured, all of those guys look at least solid defensively. If the team is collapsing, those guys are the first guys you're going to notice screwing up.
Empoleon8771
Registered User
Simon has made me look really dumb in the last 2 games for saying he can't replace Sheary, he's been excellent. But what a surprise, play Simon with skilled center and suddenly he looks competent.
I think it is really obvious for what the lineup should be in the next game if Brassard is healthy, I think everyone would agree it should be:
Guentzel-Crosby-Simon
Hagelin-Malkin-Kessel
Rust-Brassard-Sprong
Sheahan-Cullen-Hornqvist
It just makes sense based on how everyone is playing and for potential fits on lines. I don't like Rust on LW, but Simon should be on RW with Crosby so Rust has to go to LW.
Agree that should be the lineup given a shot next game....
Simon and Sprong already are easily making up for the loss of Sheary....Sprong himself has 4 points in the 8 games he’s played, which translates into 40 points...Simon the same..they can more than make up for Sheary, and Rust and Hags limited production to date, assuming they can stay healthy...
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