GWT: Champions League Round of 16 Part III

[hatterson]

If you're talking about the penalty at the end of the Juve / Atletico game that was a stonewall 100% penalty, there's zero debate if you actually watch the whole video and see the attackers heel get clipped by the defender.

The handball against PSG all comes down to if the ref believes that the defender made himself bigger by having his arm out of if it's in a natural position. It's clear he didn't see it hit off the hand at all live, that's why VAR let him know to take a second look at it. The ref (not the var guys) looked at it and called the pen himself.

The Real/Ajax call, the Ajax player was clearly offside and was active in play, doesn't seem scandalous to me.

 

[Corto]

No idea where to put this, so here:

 

[Chimaera]

It wasn't like this before. There was the odd referee mistake here and there but not a constant trend like this. The thing is right now UEFA is selling tv rights for those games ALL OVER THE WORLD so it's better for them to have always the same big teams in the final rounds, much easier to sell and bring in some new fans of those big clubs.

UEFA these days couldn't live with a Dynamo Kiev in the 1/2, Olympiakos in the 1/4 or even the likes of Ajax Lyon Porto, they want Barcelona Madrid Juventus and a big EPL team, just like if they could in tennis they would always want Federer Nadal Djokovic to sell the game worldwide.

UEFA before was for the clubs of Europe and their fans, now it's for getting the most $ worldwide as possible.

One of the reason I enjoy watching the Europa more for a good time now.

It's true they want the glory clubs because it helps revenue, but the contract is already bought and paid. IF anything they care about who is in the final, because the sponsors don't want to pony up big bucks only to go see some poor matchup in a hike of a stadium.

But they're not actively influencing and fixing matches (well, at least not with VAR) to get results.

The CL sells. It doesn't need Barca in the finals or the quarters to sell. It doesn't need Real to make it if they have 5 or 6 other major, global clubs getting there.

Sure, ratings will be higher if Barca or Real make it to the finals. But we aren't talking about a 50% drop if they don't.

It would be one thing if they had a Czech league team, APOEL, some 3rd place Turkish league team, Celtic, and Feyenoord. They don't. Even if Lyon, Roma, or Atletico got through, we're still talking massive clubs in world football.

 

[Evilo]

Most people here think the call against PSG was a fair penalty, and at worst a 50/50, same for the Juventus penalty. The Real call wasn't really arguable, it was pretty clear (not sure what Ajax VAR you're referring to though). The Suarez thing does look like a pretty big mistake, but it happens. Obviously if you're looking for a conspiracy there you can find one, but the Suarez call aside there wasn't really anything scandalous about the other calls.

Most people find the call against PSG ridiculous.
In fact, I think every single United fan here has said they'd be mad if the call was against them. There was no 50/50 except for some *very* selected posters.
The Juve penalty was pretty bad. The push never warrants a penalty and the trip was his own doing.
The Real thing was when VAR wouldn't work in favor of Ajax on a play later in the game.

 

[Evilo]

No idea where to put this, so here:

And Mbappe has more goals than either.

 

[Evilo]

It's true they want the glory clubs because it helps revenue, but the contract is already bought and paid. IF anything they care about who is in the final, because the sponsors don't want to pony up big bucks only to go see some poor matchup in a hike of a stadium.

But they're not actively influencing and fixing matches (well, at least not with VAR) to get results.

The CL sells. It doesn't need Barca in the finals or the quarters to sell. It doesn't need Real to make it if they have 5 or 6 other major, global clubs getting there.

Sure, ratings will be higher if Barca or Real make it to the finals. But we aren't talking about a 50% drop if they don't.

It would be one thing if they had a Czech league team, APOEL, some 3rd place Turkish league team, Celtic, and Feyenoord. They don't. Even if Lyon, Roma, or Atletico got through, we're still talking massive clubs in world football.

I'd like to have your crystal ball.

And yes it's quite obvious UEFA wants the big clubs in the later stages.
Heck, the big clubs might just secede if it isn't the case.

 

[Corto]

Most people find the call against PSG ridiculous.
In fact, I think every single United fan here has said they'd be mad if the call was against them. There was no 50/50 except for some *very* selected posters.
The Juve penalty was pretty bad. The push never warrants a penalty and the trip was his own doing.
The Real thing was when VAR wouldn't work in favor of Ajax on a play later in the game.

"Most people"... I don't think it's a pen, but the referee expert on our TV says it's a pen - Kimpembe made himself bigger. You're the one being a hypocrite here, you're say this wasn't a pen, but Perisic (for example) was a 50/50, at worst.
Juve was a clear pen. Shove in the back at that speed, from behind - pen. And Correa didn't complain one bit. Very few complaints from anyone on Atletico, during the game or after.
Real thing I know only of the disallowed goal and was a 100% right call.
Suarez pen should've been called back.

 

[Chimaera]

I'd like to have your crystal ball.

And yes it's quite obvious UEFA wants the big clubs in the later stages.
Heck, the big clubs might just secede if it isn't the case.

Two questions.

Do you honestly feel UEFA conspired to fix matches in this CL? How so?

Do you honestly think PSG wins the CL (heck, makes the final) if not for a 50/50 penalty call?


I mean, by the logic of 'bigger clubs to the later stages', wouldn't PSG have gotten the benefit of the result by now? They have more star power than United does. BY far.

 

[Juve]

When is the draw?

 

[Pouchkine]

If people don't understand that right now UEFA is chasing all the money they can get from worldwide deals and doing all they can so that the big teams and big stars go the further possible then what do you need?

 

[Pouchkine]

It's true they want the glory clubs because it helps revenue, but the contract is already bought and paid. IF anything they care about who is in the final, because the sponsors don't want to pony up big bucks only to go see some poor matchup in a hike of a stadium.

But they're not actively influencing and fixing matches (well, at least not with VAR) to get results.

The CL sells. It doesn't need Barca in the finals or the quarters to sell. It doesn't need Real to make it if they have 5 or 6 other major, global clubs getting there.

Sure, ratings will be higher if Barca or Real make it to the finals. But we aren't talking about a 50% drop if they don't.

It would be one thing if they had a Czech league team, APOEL, some 3rd place Turkish league team, Celtic, and Feyenoord. They don't. Even if Lyon, Roma, or Atletico got through, we're still talking massive clubs in world football.

Lyon and Roma are nobodies for much of the new "worldwide" fans. The idiots that say "we" when talking about Real Madrid, who follow the game since a couple of years and choose between some of the current winners... It's who UEFA is targeting these days, those new modern fake fans.

 

[Pouchkine]

Before what was obvious was the host at the World Cup and Juventus in Italy had some favorable calls, I don't remember obvious crap like these being the norm back in the 60's 70's 80's 90's.

 

[Corto]

Before what was obvious was the host at the World Cup and Juventus in Italy had some favorable calls, I don't remember obvious crap like these being the norm back in the 60's 70's 80's 90's.

There was the 66 WC final.
There was Schumacher.
There was Hand of God.
Just 3 examples of horrible calls of the top of my head that possibly completely changed the outcomes of major competitions.

 

[Evilo]

"Most people"... I don't think it's a pen, but the referee expert on our TV says it's a pen - Kimpembe made himself bigger. You're the one being a hypocrite here, you're say this wasn't a pen, but Perisic (for example) was a 50/50, at worst.
Juve was a clear pen. Shove in the back at that speed, from behind - pen. And Correa didn't complain one bit. Very few complaints from anyone on Atletico, during the game or after.
Real thing I know only of the disallowed goal and was a 100% right call.
Suarez pen should've been called back.

You know what? The ref on my panel laughed at the notion it was a pen. Ferdinand said it wasn't a pen. And you can't say he's not United. AGAIN you're the only one who compares to Perisic even though it is not the same play at all. So stop the name calling.
Juve wasn't a clear pen LOL. SHOVE? Seriously? Slight touch is more like it. Ah, not enough complaining. That's quite an argument.

So yeah swing and miss as usual.

 

[Evilo]

Two questions.

Do you honestly feel UEFA conspired to fix matches in this CL? How so?

Do you honestly think PSG wins the CL (heck, makes the final) if not for a 50/50 penalty call?


I mean, by the logic of 'bigger clubs to the later stages', wouldn't PSG have gotten the benefit of the result by now? They have more star power than United does. BY far.

I'm pretty sure UEFA influences the outcome of matches yes. We've seen draws leaked before the draws, we've seen absolute ridiculous calls over the years.
And let's not pretend UEFA is a clean organisation.
Yup I think it's clearly possible. I'd say it're more likely than not.

Wins the CL? I have zero idea. But if not for that 10/90 call (can people stop saying it was a 50/50?), they're through to the next round and get Neymar back. Who knows?

You have no idea of what you're saying if you think PSG is a bigger club than United for UEFA. United was among the first to pressure UEFA for super leagues and all of this CL clownish system. PSG is suing UEFA.
I mean, seriously???? You're SERIOUSLY wondering this?

 

[Evilo]

Just not the French, right? Damn UEFA and their conspiracies vs big clubs.

I know you have a very low IQ, but please link me to ANY POST I made about french clubs being targeted. ONE.
I SAID from the beginning it was UEFA vs PSG. And their favourable tendency for big clubs is something I've talked about for years.

Of course, you'd rather lie, like you ALWAYS DO. In fact you're trolling.

 

[Chimaera]

I think it's much easier to blame the UEFA boogeyman, the grand conspiracy than just saying PSG hasn't been good enough.

 

[Pouchkine]

There was the 66 WC final.
There was Schumacher.
There was Hand of God.
Just 3 examples of horrible calls of the top of my head that possibly completely changed the outcomes of major competitions.

Like I said mostly rare occurences and only 2 examples of non-host teams.

 

[Pouchkine]

I don't recall conspiracy theories in European Club Football before the last 10-15 years when the competition really became global and a big $ thing.

 

[Ivan13]

Or the stuff Europeans were allowed to do to Pele when the WC was this side of the pond, or how the Kempes led Argentina butchered the Dutch without repercussion, Spain was awarded a PK that eliminated Yugoslavia despite the foul being yards outside of the box, etc. Football has been run by the officials and interest lobbyist since the beginning.

 

[Pouchkine]

PSG is hated by everyone except PSG fans and is suing UEFA so of course it's not one of their babies.

 

[Pouchkine]

Or the stuff Europeans were allowed to do to Pele when the WC was this side of the pond, or how the Kempes led Argentina butchered the Dutch without repercussion, Spain was awarded a PK that eliminated Yugoslavia despite the foul being yards outside of the box, etc. Football has been run by the officials and interest lobbyist since the beginning.

Again at the World Cup and mostly calls going for the hosts... You have many examples for European Club competitions?

 

[Evilo]

Yes, pressure has always existed. I'll remind everyone Tapie's words after his C1 final defeat : "now I know how to win" and it wasn't on the pitch.

Thing is now, refs don't just make mistakes. Their mistakes can be either confirmed by VAR, even if it defies logic or can be induced by VAR officials, who I remind are not good enough to be on the pitch for realy reffing.

 

[Ivan13]

Again at the World Cup and mostly calls going for the hosts... You have many examples for European Club competitions?

One time my hometown team got through to the semifinal (IIRC) because the captain started jumping up and down before the ref could see on which side the coin has landed. That was back when the team going through was decided by a coin toss after a draw. There have been plenty of dubious reffing decisions through the years, they just weren't as visible due to the lack of social media.

 

[Pouchkine]

But they were not constant year after year as we do see since 10-15 years every year in the CL. Even with every game on tv and replays...