Player Discussion Carey Price - 2nd Baby Edition

[PaulD]

I am agreeing with you. It's a team game and Price is as good as the team in front of him. And sometimes he is actually worse than the team in front of him.

He played well and peaked in 2015, but he wasn't doing that without PK/Markov, Pleks and Max. And even MT as well who played a system to protect Price as much as possible. MT got a Vezna with Theo and then with Price. Not saying he is 100% to be given credit but he had to low talent Montreal teams produce Vezna winners, and then both Vezna winners dropped off.

It was all Therrien.

MeeShell also left all three of his teams in collapsing losing streaks.

To simplify.

While Price peaked a bad team with lousy center men did well in regular season. Not so good in play offs.

While Price was out injured or playing poorly the teams sucked in regular season and there were no play offs. Period. Hmmmm?

There is no mystery here. We dont need Columbo to crack this one.

 

[1909]

Not a goalie in history where you can make that statement after a game.

Price gets it harder because whether they like to admit it or not.....every single Habs fan out there knows this much ....

If Carey is not fantastic.....this collection of Canadiens aint winning ****.

Some of us have been saying that loud and clearly for years.

We don't ask him to be "fantastic".... Just solid, good.

 

[BehindTheTimes]

I am agreeing with you. It's a team game and Price is as good as the team in front of him. And sometimes he is actually worse than the team in front of him.

He played well and peaked in 2015, but he wasn't doing that without PK/Markov, Pleks and Max. And even MT as well who played a system to protect Price as much as possible. MT got a Vezna with Theo and then with Price. Not saying he is 100% to be given credit but he had to low talent Montreal teams produce Vezna winners, and then both Vezna winners dropped off.

Agreed, but you highlighted my point about the Toronto medIa, well I do think hearing it 24/7 on tsn, sportsnet and all the anglo broadcasts everyday for years has influenced members of this board. I even think it influences experts to varying degrees to be told something is true every day. No, one player is ever responsible for an entire team, the idea is completely absurd.

 

[Frank Drebin]

He certainly appears to be fragile, he might be worn out and in need of a fresh start somewhere else but his contract is in the way. I can't help but think of Luongo right now.

Luongos cap hit was just a touch over 50% of what prices currently is, and Vancouver had to retain 800k to get rid of it.

Let that sink in

 

[1909]

I don't think there is a point in complaining about Price anymore.

Its up to him to play better. No elite talent worth their salt is going to sit there and blame the players around them. They are elite for a reason.

Its a shame that due to his name and salary we are going to have to play this game of the next game he will turn it around forever. I think he wasn't pulled last night because its Price and we don't want to upset him or make the situation look bad.

For once we actually have some offensive punch and now we have a goalie who can't stop a beach ball.

He could had been benched after 1st period. Not yanked during the second in front of the crowd, of course.

 

[1909]

Habs would had to retain at least 3M $ per season to be able to trade him away.

 

[OldCraig71]

Luongos cap hit was just a touch over 50% of what prices currently is, and Vancouver had to retain 800k to get rid of it.

Let that sink in

I was never in favour of signing a goalie to that type of money and term because I believe that a strong top 6 and two decent goalies are the way to go but that might just be me. I would rather live and die with six guys instead of one.

 

[PaulD]

We don't ask him to be "fantastic".... Just solid, good.

Regardless of what you were "asking of him"

I was reffering to the reality of this team. I repeat, "if Price is not fantastic this team aint winning shit"

Thats a fact, has been for along time.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

I agree. And Julien said it best in his assessment in that Price has been "Good, but not great. And we know he can be great." He hasn't even been quote on quote "good" lately either, but great goalies do make those kind of saves, and that's what we're expecting from him. He has made a couple of them this year, but they seem few and far between what we're used to.

My point was that these aren't the goals that I'm having issues with. It's the soft ones where he kicks out an uncharacteristic rebound, ones where he stops battling or simply gets beat clean on a shot that he can see all the way because he wasn't set. If he was just letting in the grade A scoring chances, I'd be a lot less critical.

To be fair though, I haven't seen too many soft goals this season. Every goalie will give up some but Price hasn't been that bad in terms of soft goals this year. I was fully ready to defend last night's game despite the number of goals until he gave up the winner which NEVER should've gone in. Those types of goals are killer. But he hasn't done that much this season.

As I said, I think he's better than his numbers suggest but I think he needs a change of scenery too. I will always defend the contract he got but I'll never defend how we gave it to him and then blew up the team. That was just bonkers.

 

[BaseballCoach]

Why do you think it is with the right side of his body? I must not have read your post so could you give me the shortened version?

I don't "think" the problem is there, I see it. It's not just that he gets beaten lot on straight shots to the blocker side. It is the awkwardness and clear inability to make the moves he used to make without collapsing to the ice.

I've been told by doctors that there can be several causes, so I won't speculate in public. However, he should be thoroughly checked and if he is not capable of playing in a professional league anymore, then he should retire for his own sake.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

Regardless of what you were "asking of him"

I was reffering to the reality of this team. I repeat, "if Price is not fantastic this team aint winning ****"

Thats a fact, has been for along time.

Well at least this year we can score. And for once that doesn't appear to be a fluke. Domi is turning out to be a really good player and Gallagher has suddenly reached another level.

 

[Frank Drebin]

Regardless of what you were "asking of him"

I was reffering to the reality of this team. I repeat, "if Price is not fantastic this team aint winning ****"

Thats a fact, has been for along time.

I'm not sure that I agree. If price was simply good we'd likely be 10-3 rather than 8-5.

Unless you mean playoffs, then we're going to need more than a fantastic price to go anywhere

 

[Frank Drebin]

I don't "think" the problem is there, I see it. It's not just that he gets beaten lot on straight shots to the blocker side. It is the awkwardness and clear inability to make the moves he used to make without collapsing to the ice.

I've been told by doctors that there can be several causes, so I won't speculate in public. However, he should be thoroughly checked and if he is not capable of playing in a professional league anymore, then he should retire for his own sake.

You consulted doctors about prices condition? Where the f*** am I?

 

[scrubadam]

It was all Therrien.

He also left all three of his teams on collaspsing losing streaks.

Clearly it wasn't all MT but he played a safe system that insulated Price. I guess MT is just lucky that 2 goalies playing under him won Vezna's and Harts.

 

[scrubadam]

He could had been benched after 1st period. Not yanked during the second in front of the crowd, of course.

Why though? Why can other goalies be yanked during games but not Price all of a sudden?

Thats the issue. The team has to walk on eggshells with Price. If he was any one else we would be calling up Lindgren or McNiven right now to see if we have a young goalie worth anything.

But since its Prices we have to wait for next game when he will finally bounce back, if not then the game after, or the game after or the game after etc...

 

[OldCraig71]

I don't "think" the problem is there, I see it. It's not just that he gets beaten lot on straight shots to the blocker side. It is the awkwardness and clear inability to make the moves he used to make without collapsing to the ice.

I've been told by doctors that there can be several causes, so I won't speculate in public. However, he should be thoroughly checked and if he is not capable of playing in a professional league anymore, then he should retire for his own sake.

Okay, I will pay better attention to his movements when I watch him. My observation has to do with confidence as a problem. The Price that is on his game is flying from the crease to fire a puck to center ice to one of his forwards, his movements are fast and precise and he is so silent but efficient when moving across the crease . Look back to the game in Boston, the night he passed Patrick Roy, that was goaltending master class, he was dominant. I sat here in complete appreciation of his efforts in that game and his movements seemed fine. A physical issue should not come and go like that. These are pro athletes but they are still people and life sends them the same ups and downs it sends us all. I am not debating with your view because it is every bit as relevant as my own but that's how I see it(today).

 

[PaulD]

Was an outlier, they happen. Price has stunk for close to two years and he was never the only reason we were winning games. Those who believed that were out to lunch.

The arguments use to go "We were bottom across the board in everything but goaltending" citing corsi as proof of this in order to put Price on a pedestal.

Well for consistency sake maybe we should now make the argument that "We are top across the board in everything except goaltending". Funny how it works, when the metrics say the team is bad, it's true, when the metrics say the goaltending is bad, it's false. Subban was our MVP, I thought so then and I think so now.

Easy to say that now.

Price from 014 Olmpics untl he was injured in the fall of 016 was the MVP of the league......and the Canadiens.

Revisionists are coming out now !

 

[Cole Caulifield]

And for that, he will be making 10.5 million dollars in 2026.

Full NMC, and 83% of his contract in signing bonuses massively frontloaded. It's the type of contract where Bergevin just immediately gave everything to Price without any negotiations. Completely buyout proof whether there's an amnesty buyout after next lockout or not. We're stuck with him until he decides to retire or wants to get traded out. But even then, with him playing this way good luck with that.

 

[PaulD]

Clearly it wasn't all MT but he played a safe system that insulated Price. I guess MT is just lucky that 2 goalies playing under him won Vezna's and Harts.

Yes i watched Therrien system all the nights Price stopped 38 of 39 shots and won 2-1.

All the nights they were peppered 14-2 shots on net on the first period.

Therrien system was protecting Carey.

Now its MBs accounting.

 

[Tyson]

Maybe, just maybe that Price is mentally Fried from having to carry this team all of these years? Going into every game he always knew he would have to be the difference. I think a change of scenery is needed.

 

[BaseballCoach]

I dont think you get anything from hiding him.

Get in there and have a Bounce back game. Its the big leagues. Not peewee

OK, but he is playing like a Bantam CC goalie. It's not about a game. I think the Habs realize now that there is something serious going on, and good on them to put Niemi in until it is figured out.

 

[PaulD]

I'm not sure that I agree. If price was simply good we'd likely be 10-3 rather than 8-5.

Unless you mean playoffs, then we're going to need more than a fantastic price to go anywhere

Yes I doi mean play offs. Its all about play offs.

Always believed that. But I Mike Keenam summed it up better than anyone I can recall when he said to his Hawks at the beginning of camp.

The 82 games are all preparation for your 83rd game.

 

[BaseballCoach]

I don't think there is a point in complaining about Price anymore.

Its up to him to play better. No elite talent worth their salt is going to sit there and blame the players around them. They are elite for a reason.

Its a shame that due to his name and salary we are going to have to play this game of the next game he will turn it around forever. I think he wasn't pulled last night because its Price and we don't want to upset him or make the situation look bad.

For once we actually have some offensive punch and now we have a goalie who can't stop a beach ball.

I don't think Carey CAN play better. Not by much, anyway. There is a reason and a problem. They need to figure it out.

I'm not a Carey-hater. I fully agree he was a cut above the rest of the goalie universe for about a three year period. But if he is not well, he won't be able to snap his fingers and perform better, just because some fans are pist at his contract.

MB, on the other hand, is still the IdiotGM. Just months after Carey's first big slide, the one that got Therrien finally fired, and just weeks after his being outperformed in the playoffs, the IdiotGM signed Price to an 8-year contract extension for almost max money. The stupidity is mind-boggling, but it is not Carey's fault.

 

[PaulD]

OK, but he is playing like a Bantam CC goalie. It's not about a game. I think the Habs realize now that there is something serious going on, and good on them to put Niemi in until it is figured out.

Sure . But he did not play that way against Boston. Nobody was on here hanging him after that game. Price will bounce back or he wont.

But you have to play him so he can play his way out of it. He is never going to duplicate his 015 season....and the team cant win in the play offs if he does not. But the show must go on and he is your number one goalie....I have never seen a guy get out of a rut watching the back up from the bench.

Habs are not a contender.................even less so without the Carey Price of 015.

Im still hoping for a new GM. So Careys uncharacteristic play bothers me little.

 

[durojean]

I think people underrate a lot the presence of Andrei Markov in the life of Carey Price.

Yes Markov was a really good defencemen but along the years we heard a lot of stories of him making the rookie goalie accountable.

two example :

Price was playing really a year and the Habs were in a losing streak. Price allowed a bad goal in ot I remember. And in a hard exchange Markov said to Price that he was bad and that there was a reason for it.

Price : "Do you think I don't want to stop the puck ? I care too you know"

Markov : "You don't work like you want to stop it."

I think it was the year Halak stole Carey's spot. The next year Carey came in with a work ethic he never had before.

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The other example was explained by Martin McGuire :

Price was in the best of his career and he was kind of a douche and looked like he was above of it all.

Markov went to him and told him that he'll prove him that he is not as good as he thinks.

There was a breakaway drill or a shooting drill I don't remember. Markov had 4 pucks. Price did not stop any.

McGuire said that Price's attitude change after that incident too. That was the year of the Kreider hit.

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An other thing is that maybe... just maybe. : Subban's out of this world attitude with a lot of energy was the exact thing that Price needed to spark his slow attitude and make him the goalie he was at the time.

Price's best season were with Markov and Subban in front of him.