Player Discussion Carey Price - 2nd Baby Edition

[groovejuice]

I think people underrate a lot the presence of Andrei Markov in the life of Carey Price.

Yes Markov was a really good defencemen but along the years we heard a lot of stories of him making the rookie goalie accountable.

two example :

Price was playing really a year and the Habs were in a losing streak. Price allowed a bad goal in ot I remember. And in a hard exchange Markov said to Price that he was bad and that there was a reason for it.

Price : "Do you think I don't want to stop the puck ? I care too you know"

Markov : "You don't work like you want to stop it."

I think it was the year Halak stole Carey's spot. The next year Carey came in with a work ethic he never had before.

------

The other example was explained by Martin McGuire :

Price was in the best of his career and he was kind of a *****e and looked like he was above of it all.

Markov went to him and told him that he'll prove him that he is not as good as he thinks.

There was a breakaway drill or a shooting drill I don't remember. Markov had 4 pucks. Price did not stop any.

McGuire said that Price's attitude change after that incident too. That was the year of the Kreider hit.

-----

An other thing is that maybe... just maybe. : Subban's out of this world attitude with a lot of energy was the exact thing that Price needed to spark his slow attitude and make him the goalie he was at the time.

Price's best season were with Markov and Subban in front of him.

I went back to find this post so I could like it.

 

[Milhouse40]

Actually the contract does matter, not for cap reasons though. First off he is paid that huge amount, well in sports you expect a return on your investment. Price is not living up to his contract. It goes for every player in sports. Birsebois was booed out of this city because of his contract. LOLAlzner exsist because of his contract. Dustin Brown was persona non gratta in LA and then the following year he was a key player. Why, because he actually lived up to his contract for that one year.

Also since Price is a goalie and you can only carry 2 of em his contract matters. This means that we can't simply put another player in his spot like with a Gomez. At least with Gomez if he sucked we could put him on the 4th line, you can't bury Price. Maybe Lindgre/McNiven could step up as young goalies and become decent starters, but with Prices 10.5 we can't do that. Even if another goalie stepped in the team is always going to want to get a ROI on Prices 10.5 and try to get him going.

If Price was earning 6 or less it wouldn't be so hard to try something different out. But since Pedestal Price has this huge contract the team is stuck trying to salvage value out of it. Imagine we make him the back up or even worse send him to the AHL that kills his entire value.

Its a rock and a hard place due to that contract. Can't not play because he loses value, but if we play him the team isn't getting the goaltending it needs.

And yes that contract is 100% on MB, he never should of given it out. Said it before it was signed in the old Price threads. But the contract is done so now its on Price to live up to it. He took the big money deal everyone would do it, but that money wasn't free, it comes with strings. Those strings is an insane fanbase and media that will crap on him if he isn't living up to his 10.5 Million dollar price tag.

Is Price costing the Habs too much money? Of course he is.
Is that money costing the Habs other opportunity? Not at this moment

Is Price's play the only thing costing games right now? The answer is no.
There's tons of blame to go around. From the PP and PK units to all the defensive squad collectively and individually.

Is getting Price out of the ice will make the Habs better at this point? The answer is no.
Niemi might win but did not have game that he let in less than 3 goals. Defense is bad for both goalies

Is the team having a terrible season because of Price's play? The answer is no.
In fact they are doing better than anyone expected

That's what bothering me. We all like open hockey where the Habs scores 3-4-5-6 goals a game and we've been asking that for year, but now because of the 10.5M , now the Habs also need to win while Price allow only 2 goals or less....and that's for the team everyone expected to finish in the bottom of the league.

Attitude of team might have changed, but the shitty attitude from the medias and fans on this one is terrible.
Funny how "taxes" is the biggest excuses when it comes to UFA not wanting to comes here or Radulov choosing to go to Dallas but with all the talks about Price's contract, no one talks about those taxes....

 

[scrubadam]

But if your GM signs you to a huge deal and then guts the team it's also on him. Sorry, but it's brain dead stupid how MB has run this team.

Ok and so what?

Price is paid big bucks, well there are strings attached to that contract, which is that the fanbase/media will expect him to perform.

He rode the wave of glory of his teams back (and yes he played better for those 3 early years). Now he signed his big money deal so he has to produce. Not deflecting this one onto MB even if it was a colossal error to give Price that contract.

 

[scrubadam]

Is Price costing the Habs too much money? Of course he is.
Is that money costing the Habs other opportunity? Not at this moment

Is Price's play the only thing costing games right now? The answer is no.
There's tons of blame to go around. From the PP and PK units to all the defensive squad collectively and individually.

Is getting Price out of the ice will make the Habs better at this point? The answer is no.
Niemi might win but did not have game that he let in less than 3 goals. Defense is bad for both goalies

Is the team having a terrible season because of Price's play? The answer is no.
In fact they are doing better than anyone expected

That's what bothering me. We all like open hockey where the Habs scores 3-4-5-6 goals a game and we've been asking that for year, but now because of the 10.5M , now the Habs also need to win while Price allow only 2 goals or less....and that's for the team everyone expected to finish in the bottom of the league.

Attitude of team might have changed, but the ****ty attitude from the medias and fans on this one is terrible.
Funny how "taxes" is the biggest excuses when it comes to UFA not wanting to comes here or Radulov choosing to go to Dallas but with all the talks about Price's contract, no one talks about those taxes....

Its sad and unfortunate but when you sign a contract like that the expectations on your play increase 10 fold.

So for me there aren't any excuses. Its MBs fault for giving him the money, and its the D in front of him that maybe aren't All Stars, but I say SO F'N WHAT.

The guy is paid to be a difference maker, he is treated like a difference maker. So he needs to step up. Letting in 5 goals a game regardless of how bad the D is is not what I expect from the teams highest paid player and guy who is supposed to be the teams best player.

Gomez was highly paid and sucked but no one gave him a pass because Sather signed him to that contract and it wasn't Gainey's fault he needed a C and Sundin turned him down.

Maybe its not all on him for costing us games, but with his salary it should be on him to win games and be a guy who will change the momentum of a game, or dig down deep to steal one.

I don't blame the guy for cashing in, everyone in his shoes would try to take a big contract. But the contract is done and signed we can't go back in time on that one. At this point I don't even care for him to play like a 10.5 Million guy, how about a 6 Million guy at least.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

Ok and so what?

So stop with this Price pedestal crap and acknowledge the facts here.

No player is going to be successful on an unsuccessfual team. No goalie is going to put up great numbers with a D as bad as the one we have.

Price is paid big bucks,

We all know this. You continue to repeat it as though it has some kind of meaning... it doesn't.

Him being paid that amount is fine. He earned the contract. And if the GM didn't think he was worth it he shouldn't have signed him. But MB knew that the team was overly dependent on him so he gave him the cash. That's all well and good... except he then went out, got rid of Sergachev, lost Markov, got Karl f***ing Alzner and Weber got hurt. All the while we sat there with 9 mil in cap space and you want to point the finger at the goalie...

Again, we had 9 million in cap space last year. Price's contract is irrelevant right now. We've got a bad team. Price's contract doesn't change this...

well there are strings attached to that contract, which is that the fanbase/media will expect him to perform.

Fine.

But you aren't interested in actual analysis here. Your schtick has consistently been to back the GM no matter what. You don't acknowledge what's plain as day here and you continue to try to give the GM a free pass.

Some of it is on Price... sure. He was inconsistent last year. But it's not unexpected for his numbers to take a hit now behind that D. It was going to happen. So why sign the guy in the first place if you're going to dismantle the D?

He rode the wave of glory of his teams back (and yes he played better for those 3 early years). Now he signed his big money deal so he has to produce. Not deflecting this one onto MB even if it was a colossal error to give Price that contract.

Once again, you come up with this same BS. I'm done with you. Your posts on this subject are a waste of time.

 

[PaulD]

Well in sports you have to live up to your contract. If you sign a big one the expectation is that you will earn your money. Alzner is paid 5+ Million and he sucks and deserves to have his play being held against his salary. No one would say LOLAlzner if he was playing as well has his salary.

Long line of players not measuring up to dollars. Too many to list.

Price can and will play better.

But he will never be worth 10.5 a year.

10.5 a year should only be for point a game centermen. Sharp shooting 40 goal wingers. Two way PMD with 60 pt potential.

Players who have proved they can bring it in both regular season and play offs.

As rule. Goalies should never be paid 10.5. Goalies should never be your highest paid player either.

 

[scrubadam]

So stop with this Price pedestal crap and acknowledge the facts here.

No player is going to be successful on an unsuccessfual team. No goalie is going to put up great numbers with a D as bad as the one we have.

We all know this. You continue to repeat it as though it has some kind of meaning... it doesn't.

Him being paid that amount is fine. He earned the contract. And if the GM didn't think he was worth it he shouldn't have signed him. But MB knew that the team was overly dependent on him so he gave him the cash. That's all well and good... except he then went out, got rid of Sergachev, lost Markov, got Karl ****ing Alzner and Weber got hurt. All the while we sat there with 9 mil in cap space and you want to point the finger at the goalie...

Again, we had 9 million in cap space last year. Price's contract is irrelevant right now. We've got a bad team. Price's contract doesn't change this...


Fine.

But you aren't interested in actual analysis here. Your schtick has consistently been to back the GM no matter what. You don't acknowledge what's plain as day here and you continue to try to give the GM a free pass.

Some of it is on Price... sure. He was inconsistent last year. But it's not unexpected for his numbers to take a hit now behind that D. It was going to happen. So why sign the guy in the first place if you're going to dismantle the D?

Once again, you come up with this same BS. I'm done with you. Your posts on this subject are a waste of time.

Price needs to be better, and its not on his teammates. If the guy was the man for carrying the team for so many years then he should be a difference maker. And even if I say it was a huge mistake by MB you still try to deflect it back to him. The contract is done, now its up to Price to live up to it. He is paid like an elite superstar and he is playing like a scrub. And I don't care if the team wins or losses I don't put losses on him (just like he shouldn't get credit for all the wins all these past years as we see now its a TEAM game) but he needs to play better.

You can't truly believe he is playing anything better than mediocre this year, if so then you put Price on a pedestal too much.

What happens if Nieme wins against VGK you think we go with him next game? and the game after that? Thats the problem with his 10.5 and if you can't see it well no glasses in the world will help you see it. CJ scratched Alzner at the beginning of the year does he have the balls to do the same to Price?

I am sure you will continue on with your high and mighty opinions, guess what you aren't always right. And you harp on me but you are basically regurgitating my arguments now to defend Price. Habs sucked when they lost Price but back then losing a player shouldn't make your team suck. But now if Price doesn't have his top D men then we should excuse his bad play?

 

[scrubadam]

Long line of players not measuring up to dollars. Too many to list.

Price can and will play better.

But he will never be worth 10.5 a year.

10.5 a year should only be for point a game centermen. Sharp shooting 40 goal wingers. Two way PMD with 60 pt potential.

Players who have proved they can bring it in both regular season and play offs.

As rule. Goalies should never be paid 10.5. Goalies should never be your highest paid player either.

I don't know about that. I thought so at the start of the year, but he hasn't gotten better.

Contract was a mistake, no goalie has that much value.

 

[Milhouse40]

Its sad and unfortunate but when you sign a contract like that the expectations on your play increase 10 fold.

So for me there aren't any excuses. Its MBs fault for giving him the money, and its the D in front of him that maybe aren't All Stars, but I say SO F'N WHAT.

The guy is paid to be a difference maker, he is treated like a difference maker. So he needs to step up. Letting in 5 goals a game regardless of how bad the D is is not what I expect from the teams highest paid player and guy who is supposed to be the teams best player.

Gomez was highly paid and sucked but no one gave him a pass because Sather signed him to that contract and it wasn't Gainey's fault he needed a C and Sundin turned him down.

Maybe its not all on him for costing us games, but with his salary it should be on him to win games and be a guy who will change the momentum of a game, or dig down deep to steal one.

I don't blame the guy for cashing in, everyone in his shoes would try to take a big contract. But the contract is done and signed we can't go back in time on that one. At this point I don't even care for him to play like a 10.5 Million guy, how about a 6 Million guy at least.

And how's that going for Kopitar and Doughty in LA?
Do everyone in LA are trying to trade away Kopitar and Doughty because the teams sucks and they have giant contract and are not making a difference?
Do everyone in Chicago wants to trade Toews because the team sucks and he produce less?
Do everyone in Philly still thinks Giroux is done and declining because he had 2 bad seasons?
You know Crosby and Benn doesn't produce more than Domi despites they're paid way much and they are supposed to be a "bigger difference maker".

You keep saying that Price's 10.5M is forcing him to deliver better performance and be a difference maker....which is true in a way.

But then again, you don't give a shit about a 7.8M defensemen being on the sideline.
He TOO has to be a difference maker for the team and deliver a lot for that money.
5th best paid Defenseman in the league and the difference is mostly in the D-zone.....where Price and Niemi play 60 minutes.

Everybody who knows hockey won't argue that the quality of the center will affect the result of his wingers, just like the quality of the defensive squad will affect the goaltenders.

Price's played 12 games and 7 of them were against a team in the top 10 offensively. (4-1-2)
He was a difference maker against Toronto in the first game and was also a difference maker against Boston.
In Washington he also made a difference with 3 big key saves in the 2nd and 3rd.

A goalie has to make 1 or 2 key saves a game, repairing 1 or 2 turnovers/mistakes.
Now we're expecting Price to make 6 or 7 key saves a games because there's so many mistakes and turnovers.
Niemi also made big saves in almost all of his games and also allowed at least 3 goals every games. That's not normal.

Despites all of that and even despite getting the flu, Price's ended the month of October with 0.915/2.24.....
We're not the 10th of November and he should be traded or sacrifice and he's been terrible all season long.

 

[icerocket]

Paying this much for a goalie just doesnt work. No 1c, no 1d and now no goalie.

 

[Milhouse40]

Very curious to see what Bob gets. $9M AAV max? And he is as good or better than Price when you look in the past.

Regardless, I've moved passed the fact Price is $2M overpaid. It's not good for our team or Price to dwell on it. What's done is done. Bergevin caved and gave him what he wanted to avoid any further distractions (Losing Markov, Radulov, and walking into the season with UFA Pending Price).

I just hope it don't turn into another Roy situation. We liquidate him (retain salary in his case) and he goes on to winning cups with another team while we look like idiots.

Habs need to improve the team D or Price and the Habs are in for a rough ride with this contract. His confidence is shattered and he is well aware of the Hero or Zero mentality in Montreal.

Year 1/8! Brutal

I don't know about Bob but Fleury just got 3 years at 7M and that contract kicks in next year when he'll be 34.
Except for last year, he never posted more than .921 in his career.

 

[Habs]

What if the new equipment rules and regs exposed CP flaws? Is the book out now? Pierre?

 

[BehindTheTimes]

I don't know about Bob but Fleury just got 3 years at 7M and that contract kicks in next year when he'll be 34.
Except for last year, he never posted more than .921 in his career.

All that matters are what the numbers will look during the contract signed, what happened last year and 2,3,4 years ago means very little. Price might never post 921 again.

 

[Milhouse40]

All that matters are what the numbers will look during the contract signed, what happened last year and 2,3,4 years ago means very little. Price might never post 921 again.

You can't pay for the future since nobody knows what will happens.
You get paid for what you did with the idea that nothing will changes much.

 

[BehindTheTimes]

You can't pay for the future since nobody knows what will happens.
You get paid for what you did with the idea that nothing will changes much.

This is wrong, GM's should be paying on what they expect to happen during the contract, not for what has already happened. This is why you see so many terrible deals signed. I would pay a bit of a premium for someone who is in a bit of a decline but has had consistent sustained success. There needs to be some sort of projections when signing long term deals, if their not doing this then they shouldn't be employed.

 

[bsl]

Regardless of what you were "asking of him"

I was reffering to the reality of this team. I repeat, "if Price is not fantastic this team aint winning ****"

Thats a fact, has been for along time.

so what.

 

[Garbageyuk]

Price is just making a joke out of himself at this point. Just completely mailed it in as soon as he signed that contract. He literally just stopped trying. I refuse to believe he is physically no longer capable of being a good goalie. He just doesn't give a crap. Says a lot about his character...

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

Paying this much for a goalie just doesnt work. No 1c, no 1d and now no goalie.

I disagree. I'm fine paying a goalie 10 mil. But I'm not fine paying him 10 mil and then putting a crappy team in front of him.

Paying this much for a goalie just doesnt work. No 1c, no 1d and now no goalie.

No. 1 blueliner and goalie go hand in hand.

 

[bsl]

Is Price costing the Habs too much money? Of course he is.
Is that money costing the Habs other opportunity? Not at this moment

Is Price's play the only thing costing games right now? The answer is no.
There's tons of blame to go around. From the PP and PK units to all the defensive squad collectively and individually.

Is getting Price out of the ice will make the Habs better at this point? The answer is no.
Niemi might win but did not have game that he let in less than 3 goals. Defense is bad for both goalies

Is the team having a terrible season because of Price's play? The answer is no.
In fact they are doing better than anyone expected

That's what bothering me. We all like open hockey where the Habs scores 3-4-5-6 goals a game and we've been asking that for year, but now because of the 10.5M , now the Habs also need to win while Price allow only 2 goals or less....and that's for the team everyone expected to finish in the bottom of the league.

Attitude of team might have changed, but the ****ty attitude from the medias and fans on this one is terrible.
Funny how "taxes" is the biggest excuses when it comes to UFA not wanting to comes here or Radulov choosing to go to Dallas but with all the talks about Price's contract, no one talks about those taxes....

yeah blame the fans. LOL Price defenders reach a new low.

 

[jaffy27]

Price is a very good and talented goalie that doesn’t want to compete for this team anymore.

Doesn’t make him bad, it just makes him useless for our team moving forward.

His body language is telling me he wants out. My guess is St-Louis or Edmonton in a mega transaction.

 

[Garbageyuk]

Price is a very good and talented goalie that doesn’t want to compete for this team anymore.

Doesn’t make him bad, it just makes him useless for our team moving forward.

His body language is telling me he wants out. My guess is St-Louis or Edmonton in a mega transaction.

Yeah...not gonna happen. Price is worth absolutely nothing now. Any GM would be crazy to even take him for free. If that was his plan, he isn't very smart. The right answer is usually the simplest one: he signed a big contract, and now he just doesn't give a shit.

 

[jaffy27]

Yeah...not gonna happen. Price is worth absolutely nothing now. Any GM would be crazy to even take him for free. If that was his plan, he isn't very smart. The right answer is usually the simplest one: he signed a big contract, and now he just doesn't give a ****.

You’re entitled to think he’s untradeable...I on the other hand think that he’ll be traded.

He’s still a very good goalie, he just has a crap défense in front of him and he’s mentally checked out.

It least it appears that way

 

[Genesis76]

What if the new equipment rules and regs exposed CP flaws? Is the book out now? Pierre?

Lol.

 

[Garbageyuk]

You’re entitled to think he’s untradeable...I on the other hand think that he’ll be traded.

He’s still a very good goalie, he just has a crap défense in front of him and he’s mentally checked out.

It least it appears that way

We don't know that. The big problem is we don't know why he is garbage now. If you are a rival GM, why would you take the risk? Also, if he's the type of guy to "mentally check out" after signing the most lucrative contract in the history of NHL goaltenders, why the hell would anyone want him on their team?

 

[MaxDummy]

Emelin & Markov can't get NHL jobs.

False