Rumor: Avs Proposals/Rumors/Free Agents 2017-18 Part III

[Cousin Eddie]

How about a mega-deal:

To Boston: Duchene, Landy, Bigras

To Colorado: Pastrnak, McAvoy, Heinen, 1st, Cap Dump

If the Avs add Makar Boston still laughs.

 

[lonelybadger]

Barrie + Lando for pasta and that d man.

 

[Cousin Eddie]

Barrie + Lando for pasta and that d man.

I'm not much of a Carlo fan but I'd sign off on that deal pretty quick.

 

[the_fan]

If i was Sakic I'd call Edmonton and offer Duchene + Barrie for Draisaitl + 2nd. I know Sakic wants a top 4 D for Duchene but I'd put my faith in Makar to become a stud in the NHL and get a guy like Draisaitl. Edmonton might do it too since they have trouble signing Draisaitl

 

[Balthazar]

If i was Sakic I'd call Edmonton and offer Duchene + Barrie for Draisaitl + 2nd. I know Sakic wants a top 4 D for Duchene but I'd put my faith in Makar to become a stud in the NHL and get a guy like Draisaitl. Edmonton might do it too since they have trouble signing Draisaitl

That's 11+ Million going their way. Might as well sign Draisaitl.

 

[Avs44]

How about a mega-deal:

To Boston: Duchene, Landy, Bigras

To Colorado: Pastrnak, McAvoy, Heinen, 1st, Cap Dump

Pastrnak>Duchene, McAvoy>Landeskog (at least to Bruins), Heinen+1st>Bigras....come on.

 

[JoemAvs]

Pastrnak does not make any sense for the Avs..

We would have to add quite a bit to Duchene for a winger. Does not make much sense from an Avs POV.

Only thing that could make sense is if Boston trades Pastrnak for a young, quality D and trade futures for Duchene. Too bad that Sakic won't do that.

I today listened to the BSN Portzline thing in full length and lets just say that I want Sakic fired but if the alternative would be AJ and Dater running the Avs, I might have to give him a lifetime extension...

Jesus...

 

[chet1926]

Pastrnak>Duchene, McAvoy>Landeskog (at least to Bruins), Heinen+1st>Bigras....come on.

Well if Pastrnak is being a pain to sign then his value decreases slightly. Not sure what is going on there. It sounds like they'd almost prefer to move him than sign him.

You could change McAvoy to Carlo and make the deal essentially:

Carlo+Heinen+1st for Duchene (IMO that is reasonable for Duchene, a decent young dman, a B prospect, and a first)
Then...
Pastrnak for Landy+Bigras (Maybe in favor of the Avs, but they could do a lot worse than getting Landy and a decent prospect if they were trading Pastrnak)

 

[tigervixxxen]

Would the Avs even pay him close to that much? I don't think they have any interest in such a big ticket player even if he doesn't get paid quite as much as he's asking.

 

[Avs44]

Well if Pastrnak is being a pain to sign then his value decreases slightly. Not sure what is going on there. It sounds like they'd almost prefer to move him than sign him.

You could change McAvoy to Carlo and make the deal essentially:

Carlo+Heinen+1st for Duchene (IMO that is reasonable for Duchene, a decent young dman, a B prospect, and a first)
Then...
Pastrnak for Landy+Bigras (Maybe in favor of the Avs, but they could do a lot worse than getting Landy and a decent prospect if they were trading Pastrnak)

The guy hit 70 points...at 21. He's worth MacKinnon (taking into account his contract issues). I know he's a winger, but 35 goals and 70 point is sort of where we are now hoping MacKinnon can hopefully max out as. I wouldn't trade MacK for him, but that's what Sweeney should gun for, in all honesty. Ignoring the first bit of your proposal, Pastrnak for Landeskog+Bigras...Boston has several young D clearly better or equivalent (McAvoy, Zboril, Lauzon), and Landeskog is a very clear downgrade. Put yourself in Boston's shoes...that would be awful.

 

[Balthazar]

Sakic doesn't have nearly enough proactiveness to even think about maybe trying to get him.

 

[JoemAvs]

The guy hit 70 points...at 21. He's worth MacKinnon (taking into account his contract issues). I know he's a winger, but 35 goals and 70 point is sort of where we are now hoping MacKinnon can hopefully max out as. I wouldn't trade MacK for him, but that's what Sweeney should gun for, in all honesty. Ignoring the first bit of your proposal, Pastrnak for Landeskog+Bigras...Boston has several young D clearly better or equivalent (McAvoy, Zboril, Lauzon), and Landeskog is a very clear downgrade. Put yourself in Boston's shoes...that would be awful.

No he is a goddamn winger wanting a giant contract..
He is not worth MacKinnon...

Everything else on the Avs?
Sure but does not make any sense for the Avs...

 

[chet1926]

The guy hit 70 points...at 21. He's worth MacKinnon (taking into account his contract issues). I know he's a winger, but 35 goals and 70 point is sort of where we are now hoping MacKinnon can hopefully max out as. I wouldn't trade MacK for him, but that's what Sweeney should gun for, in all honesty. Ignoring the first bit of your proposal, Pastrnak for Landeskog+Bigras...Boston has several young D clearly better or equivalent (McAvoy, Zboril, Lauzon), and Landeskog is a very clear downgrade. Put yourself in Boston's shoes...that would be awful.

So one good year now, equals superstar status?

Sure he had a good season last year, now he wants a load of cash. Who knows if he ever gets to that status again. It very well could have been his career season. Not to mention he is a one dimensional winger. The only reason I really want him is because we need a goal scoring winger.

I can see why Boston doesn't want to pay out the ass. It's the exact same reason why the Avs were leery of paying ROR big bucks after his ELC where he had two OK seasons and one good one.

As for the proposal, you can say what you want but Landy at 5.5M for 4 years is better than whatever ridiculous amount Pastrnak and his one good season wants to be paid. Landy is probably good for around 50pts and good two way play. Pastrnak is probably going to be a 55-60pts at best one-way goal scorer.

 

[Cousin Eddie]

So one good year now, equals superstar status?

Sure he had a good season last year, now he wants a load of cash. Who knows if he ever gets to that status again. It very well could have been his career season. Not to mention he is a one dimensional winger. The only reason I really want him is because we need a goal scoring winger.

I can see why Boston doesn't want to pay out the ass. It's the exact same reason why the Avs were leery of paying ROR big bucks after his ELC where he had two OK seasons and one good one.

As for the proposal, you can say what you want but Landy at 5.5M for 4 years is better than whatever ridiculous amount Pastrnak and his one good season wants to be paid. Landy is probably good for around 50pts and good two way play. Pastrnak is probably going to be a 55-60pts at best one-way goal scorer.

For every point Landeskog scored last year, Pastrnak scored two, and then some. If for some dumb reason Pastrnak gets a contract worth 8m a year (which is much too much) I'd dump Landeskog for him so fast it wouldn't even be funny. Losing Landeskog's two way game would hurt but let's get real here, this team can't score goals. And even though Landeskog might be the best forward we have at attributing to preventing goals, let's not act like he's world class at it. He's a better than average defensive winger, who couldn't even score half the points Pastrnak scored last year.

 

[the_fan]

That's 11+ Million going their way. Might as well sign Draisaitl.

Yeah but they're getting Barrie and they do need a d-man like that

 

[JoemAvs]

I guess I will never understand why people want to build their team through the wings and happily tie up so much money there..

It never works but eh... They look fun I guess and score a lot of points?


Avs have so many questionmarks on defense and even down the middle and in goal.

The last thing I have any interest in personally is giving up a ton of assets for wingers...

 

[Avs44]

So one good year now, equals superstar status?

Sure he had a good season last year, now he wants a load of cash. Who knows if he ever gets to that status again. It very well could have been his career season. Not to mention he is a one dimensional winger. The only reason I really want him is because we need a goal scoring winger.

I can see why Boston doesn't want to pay out the ass. It's the exact same reason why the Avs were leery of paying ROR big bucks after his ELC where he had two OK seasons and one good one.

As for the proposal, you can say what you want but Landy at 5.5M for 4 years is better than whatever ridiculous amount Pastrnak and his one good season wants to be paid. Landy is probably good for around 50pts and good two way play. Pastrnak is probably going to be a 55-60pts at best one-way goal scorer.

You clearly don't watch David Pastrnak...One of his best attributes is his work ethic. To illustrate him as a "one dimensional" winger like he's Jordan Eberle 2.0 is ridiculous. His shot is excellent, but he's every bit as good at playmaking. This isn't someone who floats around and waits for the puck - he's an incredibly exciting player to watch, he drives the play. To suggest that, at 21 years old, Pastrnak is going to settle in as a 55-60 points player "AT BEST," and be just a one way goal scorer, after literally just hitting 70 points, is crazy illogical talk. You basically took Pastrnak's great season at only 21, said "it's a fluke," downgraded him by 10-15 points (and you apparently think it's generous to only downgrade him that little since you said "at best"), and said that's probably what he's going to be from here on out. Landeskog isn't freakin Patrice Bergeron - he's a good two way player, but his non-offensive aspects of the game don't make up for the talent of Pastrnak. Your evaluation of what Pastrnak is...well, I don't even know how you justify that one. Joem has a completely fair argument about tying up money / investment in wingers, but I'm not spending more time on this one with you. Hopefully no poor Bruins fan wanders over here and sees post 875 and this.

 

[agentblack]

Great post.

Noooooooooo
I hope he either resigns in Bos or goes somewhere else just so we don't have to have that conversation

 

[Goulet17]

To suggest that, at 21 years old, Pastrnak is going to settle in as a 55-60 points player "AT BEST," and be just a one way goal scorer, after literally just hitting 70 points, is crazy illogical talk. You basically took Pastrnak's great season at only 21, said "it's a fluke," downgraded him by 10-15 points (and you apparently think it's generous to only downgrade him that little since you said "at best"), and said that's probably what he's going to be from here on out.

You may want to be careful with your statements quoted above. Nathan MacKinnon scored 64 points as an 18 year old rookie and tied a 30+ year old NHL rookie record for most points in a playoff series. People would have thought it was crazy to suggest that he would not continue his ascension. (For the record, I do believe it is crazy to believe that a player has had his best season as an 18 year old rookie).

The recency bias has always been very strong on these boards.

 

[Avs44]

You may want to be careful with your statements quoted above. Nathan MacKinnon scored 64 points as an 18 year old rookie and tied a 30+ year old NHL rookie record for most points in a playoff series. People would have thought it was crazy to suggest that he would not continue his ascension. (For the record, I do believe it is crazy to believe that a player has had his best season as an 18 year old rookie).

The recency bias has always been very strong on these boards.

It's not like Pastrnak's going to lose his playmaking centre and be switched to a different position with a boatload of new responsibilities. Nor was he playing on a flukily good team last year. And arguing MacKinnon's point totals would go backwards after his 18 year old season would have been just as crazy as definitively saying Pastrnak's will now. Just because it happened once doesn't mean its justified, and its certainly not fair to predict "Pastrnak will be a long term one dimensional 55-60 point player."

 

[chet1926]

You clearly don't watch David Pastrnak...One of his best attributes is his work ethic. To illustrate him as a "one dimensional" winger like he's Jordan Eberle 2.0 is ridiculous. His shot is excellent, but he's every bit as good at playmaking. This isn't someone who floats around and waits for the puck - he's an incredibly exciting player to watch, he drives the play. To suggest that, at 21 years old, Pastrnak is going to settle in as a 55-60 points player "AT BEST," and be just a one way goal scorer, after literally just hitting 70 points, is crazy illogical talk. You basically took Pastrnak's great season at only 21, said "it's a fluke," downgraded him by 10-15 points (and you apparently think it's generous to only downgrade him that little since you said "at best"), and said that's probably what he's going to be from here on out. Landeskog isn't freakin Patrice Bergeron - he's a good two way player, but his non-offensive aspects of the game don't make up for the talent of Pastrnak. Your evaluation of what Pastrnak is...well, I don't even know how you justify that one. Joem has a completely fair argument about tying up money / investment in wingers, but I'm not spending more time on this one with you. Hopefully no poor Bruins fan wanders over here and sees post 875 and this.

Well Duchene once had a 70pts in 70 games season, these things happen. The fact is Pastrnak had 1 productive season to this point and two partial seasons that he did alright in. Stop acting like the guy has 3 straight 30+ goal seasons and 70+pts. If that was the case I wouldn't even argue what you are saying as you'd be spot on.

It's no different that what ROR did during his ELC. Now Pastrnak wants a huge payday for one year of quality work. If he wants a 8M per + contract that's a joke for a guy with one season to make his case on. As who knows what the next few years have in store.

And for the record my description of Pastrnak is pretty spot on. He is a goal scoring winger first and that is his best quality. He is also a decent playmaker but he is a goal scorer first and foremost much like Hejduk. But unlike Hejduk, his two way game at this point in time leaves something to be desired. He looks better than he is due to playing a lot with Bergeron who is a two way god.

 

[avsfan09]

I guess I will never understand why people want to build their team through the wings and happily tie up so much money there..

It never works but eh... They look fun I guess and score a lot of points?r


Avs have so many questionmarks on defense and even down the middle and in goal.

The last thing I have any interest in personally is giving up a ton of assets for wingers...

Obviously you don't build your team through the wings but Kane and Hossa were irreplaceable for the Hawks.

You need balance in every position. Hopefully we can develope that depth over the next few seasons. If not it's back to square one.

 

[Freudian]

Avs enjoy negotiating problems so much they are supposed to trade for other teams problems?

 

[Taak19]

I don't understand what the Avs even have to do with this. WestJet is a Canadian airline. The troll job by the Avs twitter has taken new heights.

Colborne is from Calgary playing hockey in Denver.

 

[cgf]

Ghetto wasn't a waiver pickup--the Avs traded for him (Martinsen went the other way). But yes, the other two were.

By no means should one ignore the waiver wire. One should always look at all available options to upgrade the roster. But I'm sick of the continual string of mediocre-to-bad stopgaps parading through here.

My point is, if the Avs really thought there was no chance whatsoever Duncan Siemens was NHL-caliber, they'd have cut him loose long ago. There was zero, absolutely ZERO reason not to call him up after the bottom dropped out in December. And while it's a ridiculously small sample size, he didn't look out of place during his oh-so-brief callup.

And I'm not sure why you're using Aggz and Grimaldi as your examples, if they end up being the callups either the Avs are banged up all to hell or the Rampage are. The first forward callup (assuming both Jost and Compher make the team out of camp) would be A.J. Greer (assuming he doesn't). The first defensive callup would likely be someone like Bigras, or Mironov, or even Lindholm if none of them make the team.

Those are all better options than what will likely be on the waiver wire here in a few weeks.

Dunk is a high grade AHL defender, that's the reason to keep him even though he has no chance whatsoever of an NHL future.