Rumor: Avs Proposals/Rumors/Free Agents 18-19 part XXXII|Deadline to Disappointment Impending

[lonelybadger]

If the avs are going to trade away every player that wants market value we are going to have a bad time.

 

[UncleRisto]

Think for a minute...Barrie wants $8M after next season.

Makar, Byram, Girard, Timmins & Meloche would all be on ELC and the combined salaries would be less than Barrie...

Of course Girard wouldn't be on his ELC and neither would Meloche, but Meloche might still be in the AHL. Byram and Timmins aren't locks to be on the team either, but at least Makar is great.

 

[Lonewolfe2015]

Why would it be so?

Because you're playing at a disadvantage in your own zone for some major minutes each game, it catches up in the playoffs. I personally at least don't believe in having a meh defense in their own zone and hoping for an elite offense / goaltending to bail them out.

 

[Hornstar]

Because you're playing at a disadvantage in your own zone for some major minutes each game, it catches up in the playoffs. I personally at least don't believe in having a meh defense in their own zone and hoping for an elite offense / goaltending to bail them out.

Agreed. But your solution is EJ. That's the problem. I hope Joe doesn't feel like he owes EJ the world and let's Seattle take a good defender away while we pay him dearly. It's Joe's job to build a cup winning team. Signing Barrie is going to happen. Maybe if EJ slips another notch this year he'll get bought out like phaneuf

 

[Patagonia]

Of course Girard wouldn't be on his ELC and neither would Meloche, but Meloche might still be in the AHL. Byram and Timmins aren't locks to be on the team either, but at least Makar is great.

I just added those players to justify the ridiculous comment about the cost of a Makar, Girard etc. Added more names regardless if they play to support the cost of Barrie alone will be more expensive than all the prospects combined.

 

[ABasin]

......you have......Bowers, Kaut, Greer, Kamenev who can all play at the NHL level...

They can?

 

[SoundwaveIsCharisma]

If the avs are going to trade away every player that wants market value we are going to have a bad time.

Nah, we will just be where we are now, possibly slightly further ahead or behind depending on the replacements. The eternal rebuild continues

 

[UncleRisto]

I just added those players to justify the ridiculous comment about the cost of a Makar, Girard etc. Added more names regardless if they play to support the cost of Barrie alone will be more expensive than all the prospects combined.

Yeah, and the average salary in the AHL is $90 000, 23 of those guys make about 2 million bucks.

It's a 2.5 mil increase to 8. If they can't come to terms or whatever, fine move him, but they'll be perfectly capable cap wise.

They can?

Well Kamenev probably can...

 

[Lonewolfe2015]

Agreed. But your solution is EJ. That's the problem. I hope Joe doesn't feel like he owes EJ the world and let's Seattle take a good defender away while we pay him dearly. It's Joe's job to build a cup winning team. Signing Barrie is going to happen. Maybe if EJ slips another notch this year he'll get bought out like phaneuf

Never mentioned there's a solution in EJ either. I see two 2nd pairing defenders in EJ/Barrie longer term, only one will likely stick around (especially due to cost). The real question IMO is who will be on that top pairing. If EJ or Barrie are bumped up, not thrilled with our cup contention potential.

 

[AvsRobin]

I think this whole idea of looking at d-man as 1st pair, 2nd pair, 3rd pair and putting them is those folders is a bit old school way of looking at it.

Some teams put their best three defenseman on three different pair in order to have one of their best guys out there at all times. I don't understand why Barrie would hurt is playing "normal" 5v5 minutes and a ton on the PP. If a guy is a liability, you can minimize his time in the d zone. I think the defense coach is more important than ever now. The days of just rolling out your pairs is long gone. It requires constant coaching and manuvering. Who you put out there with who at what time, and against who. Not a single coach in the league would say no to having Barrie in their arsenal.

 

[Wintersun]

They can?

Eventually, they will all be capable NHL players, but I don't know if any of them have top 6 potential. Probably half of them are 4th liners and the other half 3rd liners, but I do think those are NHL level players in a year or two.

 

[cgf]

My expansion preference is still to try and have EJ waive

He’s been a great defenseman during his time here but in 2-3 years when we’re favourites we’re going to need guys like Zadorov and Compher for long Cup runs and EJ will be 2-3 years worse

What is there to try? If he won't waive you buy him out and enjoy the extra 4M in cap space.

 

[cgf]

It's like groundhog day around here when it comes to Barrie. The conversation has been had a billion times, and nobodies changed their opinions whatsoever. Why even bother having this discussion anymore?

Don't worry, we'll be debating when to trade Mikko & Landy instead, soon enough.

If the avs are going to trade away every player that wants market value we are going to have a bad time.

Nonsense, imagine all of the prospects *drools*

Winning games is for losers

 

[dahrougem2]

Because you're playing at a disadvantage in your own zone for some major minutes each game, it catches up in the playoffs. I personally at least don't believe in having a meh defense in their own zone and hoping for an elite offense / goaltending to bail them out.

Ok, but by that line of thinking, you're also going to be playing at an advantage in the offensive zone for some major minutes each game.

 

[lonelybadger]

Cullens offseason game plan had the Avs taking Marleau and Johnsson from the Leafs.

 

[CB Joe]

I think the Avs would have to exhaust 5 or more free agent options and a handful of trade options before taking on Marleau.

It's not a terrible back up to the back up plan but I don't see it happening. My money is on Marleau going to Arizona or maybe even LA.

 

[SoundwaveIsCharisma]

Cullens offseason game plan had the Avs taking Marleau and Johnsson from the Leafs.

Ah yes, the old “everyone is the Leafs farm team” strategy. I wouldn’t mind Johnson, at least he likes to shoot. But if that’s Sakic’s version of helping out the team he may as well not

 

[AvsRobin]

Ah yes, the old “everyone is the Leafs farm team” strategy. I wouldn’t mind Johnson, at least he likes to shoot. But if that’s Sakic’s version of helping out the team he may as well not

What would be wrong with it? We are trying to improve our bottom nine. I'm not sure why everyone is tied into the "We are in win now mode, we can't trade for a project"-thing. Just cause we are looking to win doesn't mean we cant trade for someone with potential. I think Johnsson would take another step given a bigger role.

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

I'm also not taking on Marleau unless the piece attached is Kapanen. Johnsson is essentially more of what we already have in JTC/Kerfoot/Jost in that he hasn't proven to be a legit Top 6 option yet and doesn't bring a tonne to the table.


Kapanen on the other hand to me is a legit Top 6 forward, and his speed and tenacity on the forecheck as well as on the PK would fit in damn near perfectly to what this teams image is.


I can already see all the trouble Compher/Kapanen would cause other teams when PKing together.

 

[SoundwaveIsCharisma]

What would be wrong with it? We are trying to improve our bottom nine. I'm not sure why everyone is tied into the "We are in win now mode, we can't trade for a project"-thing. Just cause we are looking to win doesn't mean we cant trade for someone with potential. I think Johnsson would take another step given a bigger role.

He could, but he is an RFA and may think he’s going to take that next step as well. Essentially, if the Avs do this trade they are adding 10 million against the cap. That with our own FAs likely means we aren’t looking outside for help. So at the end of the day we are walking into next season with the same strategy of “don’t worry guys, the young guys will take that next step!” yet again.

Plus, does marleau take another step back?

 

[avsfan09]

What would be wrong with it? We are trying to improve our bottom nine. I'm not sure why everyone is tied into the "We are in win now mode, we can't trade for a project"-thing. Just cause we are looking to win doesn't mean we cant trade for someone with potential. I think Johnsson would take another step given a bigger role.

If we took on Marleau I'd want Kapanen.

 

[BKarchitect]

If we took Marleau I’d want Kadri (obviously they aren’t going to just give us Kadri for taking on the Marleau contract but the financial aspect would be part of the “asset” package coming back to TML).

Maybe there is a larger deal to be made including Marleau, Kadri and EJ. Don’t misunderstand I’m not saying we should be looking to dump EJ but smart organizations look to deal assets a year too early versus a year too late. If healthy of course I still love what EJ brings to the table - he’s not “old” by any means and it’s easy to see him bouncing back into a super valuable top notch RHD defensive leader. But if continued injury concerns and an overall decline this year worry you for a guy signed thru 2023 with a modified NTC and NMC means maybe you cut bait now for the right deal.

 

[AvsRobin]

He could, but he is an RFA and may think he’s going to take that next step as well. Essentially, if the Avs do this trade they are adding 10 million against the cap. That with our own FAs likely means we aren’t looking outside for help. So at the end of the day we are walking into next season with the same strategy of “don’t worry guys, the young guys will take that next step!” yet again.

Plus, does marleau take another step back?

Doesn't sound too bad to me, the likelyhood of going wrong on July 1st is much bigger.

 

[Foppberg]

Apparently Frolik is available, wouldn't mind getting in on that if he comes cheap enough.

 

[Foxtail]

I mean, let's say we keep Barrie. How can we improve the team?

We can draft two forwards at 4 and 16, let's say Turcotte + one of Lavoie, Poulin, Newhook, Caufield, Kaliyev or whatever.

We keep on developing our kids, you have Compher, Kerfoot, Jost, Bowers, Kaut, Greer, Kamenev who can all play at the NHL level + our top line.

You can go and sign a top 6 free agent as well in UFA, we have plenty of money. You can also trade the 16th overall with a guy like Kerfoot for an offensive upgrade, say Kadri.

You can then go all-in and sign a guy like Nyquist or Hayes if you want to.

Let's just sign Nyquist short term like 5.5M$ x 2 or 3 years and trade Kerfoot and pick #16 for Kadri in this example.

Landy - Mack - Rantanen
Nyquist - Kadri - Turcotte
Jost - Soderberg - Compher
Calvert - Kamenev - Nieto

You still have Kaut, Bowers to replace Soderberg and Nyquist in a few years in middle 6 roles. You've got Soderberg and Nyquist going off the books in a few years, leaving space to resign Makar and guys like that.

Zadorov - Barrie
Girard - Makar
Cole - Johnson

you can do whatever pairing you want, Timmins and Meloche can eventually replace Cole and Johnson.

As for the expansion draft, we'll lose one of Zadorov, Compher, Jost whether we trade Barrie or not if you ask me.

AND if the Avs were to pick Byram, you can still decide to sign Barrie for now and move him later if need be.

I get the idea behind moving Barrie, but I don't think there's evidence that it's needed, nor that it really makes us better short and long term.

Right now the set for the XD is pretty good.

Mack
Jost
Compher
Rantanen
Kaut

Girard
Makar
Zadorov
Johnson

Whatever goalie ( Grubaeur contract up)
Landeskog ( contract up just delay the re signing ?)

Everyone else contracts will be up

Depending on free agents and if /will Johnson waive his no trade

Free agent like you said Nyquist or Johannsen type , 2 year deal