Rumor: Avs Proposals/Rumors/Free Agents 18-19 part XIX|Never Stop (Losing) Never Stopping (The Losing)

[henchman21]

So about this thing that the defensemen are getting smaller....

TB:

Victor Hedman - 6'6, 225
Dan Girardi - 6'1, 215
Ryan McDonough - 6'1, 215
Erik Cernak - 6'4, 225
Braydon Colbourn - 6'5, 225
Mikhael Sergachev - 6'3, 215
Antone Stralman - 5'11, 190

Jets:

Buff- 6'5, 260
Josh Morrisey- 6'0, 195
Jacob Trouba- 6'3, 210
Tyler Myers- 6'8, 230
Ben Chiarot- 6'3, 220
Joe Morrow- 6'0, 200
Dmitri Kulikov- 6'1, 205

Caps just won a Cup with 3 of their regular defensemen 6' and under

My point is that Makar and Girard aren't going anywhere and we will be seriously screwed with those 2 and Barrie in the same group.

Then illustrate it without being hyperbolic and making statements like Yanick Weber is better defensively than Girard and Barrie. It really hurts your credibility when you go off the deep end like that.

 

[Avs_19]

The earlier tweets don't even do the Dreger/Ceci talk justice. This was hilarious.

LeBrun thinks Panarin is getting traded.

 

[Foppberg]

The earlier tweets don't even do the Dreger/Ceci talk justice. This was hilarious.

LeBrun thinks Panarin is getting traded.

No mention of Zadorov either. Outside of one off chirps from Friedman there's been nothing.

You'd think if they were talking available defensemen, and he was being shopped, that he would've been mentioned.

 

[Foppa2118]

Friedman

Pretty vague wording though, if this is what you're referring to.

19. Colorado, however, will see what Nikita Zadorov can return.

31 Thoughts: What’s next for Oilers after Chiarelli firing - Sportsnet.ca

 

[Avs_19]

No mention of Zadorov either. Outside of one off chirps from Friedman there's been nothing.

You'd think if they were talking available defensemen, and he was being shopped, that he would've been mentioned.

TSN isn't going to talk about bottom pairing defensemen being available. Maybe if it's from a Canadian team because they just spent a few minutes on Ceci.

 

[Foppa2118]

If the Avs lose Barrie, Makar does not have to replace him by himself. I don't know why the conversation is always framed this way. Makar could put up 30 points, and they could almost duplicate the expected production this year by committee.

To do this, they would need EJ to return to a 30 point level, Girard to reach his 30 point potential, Zadorov to return to a 20 point level, and to replace Nemeth with a more skilled defenseman capable of chipping in more. All of which are certainly doable.

The more Makar can chip in, the better the blueline would be. If Timmins eventually becomes the Nemeth replacement, he's easily got 20+ point potential.


2018-19 pts/gm pace

Barrie - 66 points in 78 games
EJ - 23 points in 80 games
Girard - 23 points in 82 games
Cole - 17 points in 82 games
Zadorov - 11 points in 71 games
Nemeth - 9 points in 74 games

Total = 149 points


2019-20 - hypothetical production

Makar - 30 points
EJ - 30 points
Girard - 30 points
Zadorov - 20 points
Nemeth Replacement - 20 points
Cole - 17 points

Total = 147 points


If the Avs can't come to a deal with Barrie, the return in trade could include a lesser defenaman that could help with this as well. The blueline will not be the doom and gloom scenario some paint it out to be.

 

[Hasbro]

So about this thing that the defensemen are getting smaller....

TB:

Victor Hedman - 6'6, 225
Dan Girardi - 6'1, 215
Ryan McDonough - 6'1, 215
Erik Cernak - 6'4, 225
Braydon Colbourn - 6'5, 225
Mikhael Sergachev - 6'3, 215
Antone Stralman - 5'11, 190

Jets:

Buff- 6'5, 260
Josh Morrisey- 6'0, 195
Jacob Trouba- 6'3, 210
Tyler Myers- 6'8, 230
Ben Chiarot- 6'3, 220
Joe Morrow- 6'0, 200
Dmitri Kulikov- 6'1, 205

Size Queen.

 

[CB Joe]

The Avs don't need to replace all of Barrie's defense. They just need to be better in the defensive zone.

 

[Avs_19]

I just don't get the Ceci thing at all. It's not just about analytics either since he doesn't meet the eye test or the stat geek test. Who cares if he's a 25 year old 6'2" RHD if he's really bad? There are dumb teams out there and there were even reports of the Avs wanting Ceci in the Duchene talks at one point but I'd still be shocked if he returned anything close to Muzzin. If the trade itself isn't enough, a team that values him that highly will likely give him a long-term extension too.

 

[henchman21]

I just don't get the Ceci thing at all. It's not just about analytics either since he doesn't meet the eye test or the stat geek test. Who cares if he's a 25 year old 6'2" RHD if he's really bad? There are dumb teams out there and there were even reports of the Avs wanting Ceci in the Duchene talks at one point but I'd still be shocked if he returned anything close to Muzzin. If the trade itself isn't enough, a team that values him that highly will likely give him a long-term extension too.

He's seen as a bigger 2 way RD that can log heavy minutes without hurting you on either end. Basically a reliable plug and play #4 on the right side. I don't agree with that assessment, but that is how he is viewed in hockey circles.

On the Ceci/Zadorov note though... when you talk about comparables in arbitration. Ceci's 4.3m is would be a name/contract brought up a lot.

 

[CB Joe]

Gardiner - Ceci top line. Calling it now

 

[CB Joe]

He's seen as a bigger 2 way RD that can log heavy minutes without hurting you on either end. Basically a reliable plug and play #4 on the right side. I don't agree with that assessment, but that is how he is viewed in hockey circles.

On the Ceci/Zadorov note though... when you talk about comparables in arbitration. Ceci's 4.3m is would be a name/contract brought up a lot.

I thought so too until I looked at the minutes they played. Ceci contract is best case scenario for Zadorov but likely unachievable.

 

[The Abusement Park]

If the Avs lose Barrie, Makar does not have to replace him by himself. I don't know why the conversation is always framed this way. Makar could put up 30 points, and they could almost duplicate the expected production this year by committee.

To do this, they would need EJ to return to a 30 point level, Girard to reach his 30 point potential, Zadorov to return to a 20 point level, and to replace Nemeth with a more skilled defenseman capable of chipping in more. All of which are certainly doable.

The more Makar can chip in, the better the blueline would be. If Timmins eventually becomes the Nemeth replacement, he's easily got 20+ point potential.


2018-19 pts/gm pace

Barrie - 66 points in 78 games
EJ - 23 points in 80 games
Girard - 23 points in 82 games
Cole - 17 points in 82 games
Zadorov - 11 points in 71 games
Nemeth - 9 points in 74 games

Total = 149 points


2019-20 - hypothetical production

Makar - 30 points
EJ - 30 points
Girard - 30 points
Zadorov - 20 points
Nemeth Replacement - 20 points
Cole - 17 points

Total = 147 points


If the Avs can't come to a deal with Barrie, the return in trade could include a lesser defenaman that could help with this as well. The blueline will not be the doom and gloom scenario some paint it out to be.

That’s like saying the Blue Jackets can replace Panarin’s production by the player/s he returns, PLD improving and Wennberg going back to being a 55 point guy. Sure in a vacuum they might make up for the ~80 points lost but there’s more to it than that.

 

[henchman21]

I thought so too until I looked at the minutes they played. Ceci contract is best case scenario for Zadorov but likely unachievable.

I wouldn't say best case, but it would be a good turnout for Z. There is just a solid comparison to be made there and Z's agent will use that.

 

[CB Joe]

I wouldn't say best case, but it would be a good turnout for Z. There is just a solid comparison to be made there and Z's agent will use that.

Yeah I meant best case for Zadorov not the Avs.

Zadorov's agent can try but Ceci plays a much bigger role on his team.

 

[henchman21]

Yeah I meant best case for Zadorov not the Avs.

Zadorov's agent can try but Ceci plays a much bigger role on his team.

He does, but is arguably worse at playing that role and less effective than Z. It doesn't have to be 100% match to impact the process.

 

[CB Joe]

He does, but is arguably worse at playing that role and less effective than Z. It doesn't have to be 100% match to impact the process.

I just don't think Ceci is a good comparable. Ceci playing a top pair role and Zadorov playing a bottom pairing role.

 

[Foppberg]

Draisaitl for Toews E5

 

[Foppa2118]

That’s like saying the Blue Jackets can replace Panarin’s production by the player/s he returns, PLD improving and Wennberg going back to being a 55 point guy. Sure in a vacuum they might make up for the ~80 points lost but there’s more to it than that.

No that's a much different situation and Panarin's production is much harder to replace that way than what I proposed. Panarin is on pace for 90+ points. PLD might be maxed out at the point per game pace he's on now. That 20 point difference in Wennberg won't be enough to make up for Panarin's loss.

Difference being there's room for EJ, Girard, and Zadorov to chip in 5-10 more points, and they can find a more offensive Nemeth replacement from either within or UFA/trade.

Those goals are very reasonable and reachable, and it's with Makar pretty far below his potential at 30 points.

 

[Hornstar]

Like who? I mean would trading for someone like Brodin make this team better? Not really.

I mean if a legit #1 2 way guy becomes available that’s one thing. B

Trouba!!!! Very few D guys I'd trade Barrie for straight across but this is one

 

[Foppberg]

 

[The Abusement Park]

Wonder where he'll get traded?

 

[shadow1]

Draisaitl for Toews E5

I'd love it if Sakic acquired Brandon Saad.

Saad - Hayes - Kakko

 

[dahrougem2]

Size Queen.

I liken him more to a Super Snowflake

 

[Balthazar]

For those who can read French:



For those who can't: The 2 Russians are holding Kekalainen by the balls.