Around the NHL 2014-15 part V

[Norduck]

They (LA) must be fairly confident that they won't be taking much if any cap penalty from the Richards situation, and/or that Voynov won't be playing for them to start the year.

 

[Sojourn]

They (LA) must be fairly confident that they won't be taking much if any cap penalty from the Richards situation, and/or that Voynov won't be playing for them to start the year.

I don't think there is any real possibility of Voynov starting the year. Unless I'm mistaken, he's been sentenced, and he was injured. Assuming LA allows him back(I'm guessing they do, even if I think it's ******), he'll need to get some training and conditioning in before he gets out there.

Edit: Thats also not considering the possibility of future suspension by the league. I don't think being suspended -with- pay really qualifies. The league should certainly be considering further punishment.

 

[AngelDuck]

Voynov is coming off a torn achilles. I heard late November at the earliest but he also has all those legal troubles, so I don't think we'll see him until December. All speculation though

 

[mightyquack]

Depends what Ehrhoff they're getting really, and if last season was just a blip or start of a decline. Ehrhoff of last season won't be very useful, but if he can bounce back to how he played in Buffalo (or somewhat close to it) then it could really pay off.

This feels similar to the Heatley deal to me, hoping that an aging player who put together some solid seasons later in their career can bounce back to that level or similar after a career worst year.

Hopefully it has the same result for them as it had for us

 

[HanSolo]

Boy is Voynov ever gonna have a target on his back if he rejoins the league.

 

[Quack Shot]

If Lindolm beat his gf I would not want him on the Ducks. I would not buy any tix to see the ducks play until he'd be off the team. I don't see how any kings fans justify Voynov or would want him back. It's more than just a business or a sport.

 

[Sojourn]

They can justify it by saying he'll go to therapy, and he won't do it again, and because he's a good player. But really, they'll go through those motions because he's a good player, and they are a better team with him. It is a business.

I'm not saying I like it, but I'm also not sure if it were one of our players there would be no second chance. I'd probably never respect the player again, no matter what jersey he wears, but I'm also not a GM.

And if Kane did what he's being accused of, that's even worse.

 

[AngelDuck]

If Lindolm beat his gf I would not want him on the Ducks. I would not buy any tix to see the ducks play until he'd be off the team. I don't see how any kings fans justify Voynov or would want him back. It's more than just a business or a sport.

Let's not get too crazy now...he didn't kill or rape anyone.

He did his time in jail and suspension.

I really don't have a problem with the Kings bringing Voynov back. I have a problem with the Richards situation because it makes no sense. How a team can void a contract because a player had oxy on him and crossed the boarder is mind boggling, which is why I expect the PA to win the fight easily

What he did was wrong and he might very well be a bad person, but you can't say he should never be given a 2nd chance in the league because of that. Maybe the guy learned his lesson (hopefully). If not he will be on a very short leash and if he repeat offends I expect him to be thrown out of the league and possibly deported

Disclaimer: I'm not excusing him of anything. He's an idiot. So is Michael Vick. But they did their time for the crime and deserve a chance to see if they're rehabilitated.

 

[Sojourn]

Voynov didn't serve a suspension. Not an official one, as a form of punishment. You don't get paid for suspensions.

 

[Quack Shot]

Voynov didn't serve a suspension. Not an official one, as a form of punishment. You don't get paid for suspensions.

Yeah a paid vacation is not a suspension.

 

[Nurmagomedov]

Disclaimer: I'm not excusing him of anything. He's an idiot. So is Michael Vick. But they did their time for the crime and deserve a chance to see if they're rehabilitated.

I'm on the side that first you show you've rehabilitated, then you get to play in the NHL again.

 

[Duck Off]

Let's not get too crazy now...he didn't kill or rape anyone.

He did his time in jail and suspension.

I really don't have a problem with the Kings bringing Voynov back. I have a problem with the Richards situation because it makes no sense. How a team can void a contract because a player had oxy on him and crossed the boarder is mind boggling, which is why I expect the PA to win the fight easily

What he did was wrong and he might very well be a bad person, but you can't say he should never be given a 2nd chance in the league because of that. Maybe the guy learned his lesson (hopefully). If not he will be on a very short leash and if he repeat offends I expect him to be thrown out of the league and possibly deported

Disclaimer: I'm not excusing him of anything. He's an idiot. So is Michael Vick. But they did their time for the crime and deserve a chance to see if they're rehabilitated.

That's fair.

Personally I don't think players like this should be allowed back into leagues. Whether professional players like it or not, they're often idolized. If they are proven guilty of something like Vick or Kane were, they should be kicked out of the league permanently IMO.

 

[Duck Off]

Depends what Ehrhoff they're getting really, and if last season was just a blip or start of a decline. Ehrhoff of last season won't be very useful, but if he can bounce back to how he played in Buffalo (or somewhat close to it) then it could really pay off.

This feels similar to the Heatley deal to me, hoping that an aging player who put together some solid seasons later in their career can bounce back to that level or similar after a career worst year.

Hopefully it has the same result for them as it had for us

Erhoff was solid last year. Just note the top 3 defenseman that he's been prior. He battled injuries last year as well. This is a very good signing for LA. At worst you've got a 4/5 guy who is solid on the PP at 1.5 million. I wish we could have got him for that.

 

[AngelDuck]

I'm on the side that first you show you've rehabilitated, then you get to play in the NHL again.

And how do you expect him to show you that? What's your cutoff for amount of time he needs to go without getting in trouble to be allowed to play again? 2 years? 5 years?

He served his sentence off the ice and now it's time for him to show he can get back to the way things were before this incident like Michael Vick was able to do (hasn't been in trouble since IIRC). I agree, if he does it again he should be thrown out of the league and country no questions asked

 

[AngelDuck]

Voynov didn't serve a suspension. Not an official one, as a form of punishment. You don't get paid for suspensions.

That's the NHL's fault, not his IMO.

I'd have no problem with the league giving him a legit suspension now that he's been found guilty.

Hell, he shouldn't have been getting paid while all this was going on last year. The evidence against him should have been enough to suspend him w/o pay for the remainder of the year. I know, I know, innocent until proven guilty...but still

 

[Sojourn]

That's the NHL's fault, not his IMO.

I'd have no problem with the league giving him a legit suspension now that he's been found guilty.

Hell, he shouldn't have been getting paid while all this was going on last year. The evidence against him should have been enough to suspend him w/o pay for the remainder of the year. I know, I know, innocent until proven guilty...but still

I don't think you understand how the punishment system works. Being accused of a crime isn't justification for a non-paid suspension. Now, being found guilty? That is. Had the NHL suspended him without pay, the NHLPA would have filed a grievance, and they would have been justified to do so.

That isn't the fault of the NHL. They are simply following the rules. If they decide a punishment is forthcoming, it will be completely separate to the paid suspension last season. You're assuming they dropped the ball, when the opposite is true. They did exactly what they should have. There is no "but still" here. The NHL had no cause for an unpaid suspension.

Edit: I'm sure there is some provision in the CBA that allows the NHL to do what is in their best interest, but that's a slippery slope, and it simply makes more sense to take the proper steps. They saved themselves a lot of potential hassle by handling it this way, and even that took some balls, because even with a paid suspension there may have been issues if Voynov had been found not guilty.

 

[AngelDuck]

I don't think you understand how the punishment system works. Being accused of a crime isn't justification for a non-paid suspension. Now, being found guilty? That is. Had the NHL suspended him without pay, the NHLPA would have filed a grievance, and they would have been justified to do so.

That isn't the fault of the NHL. They are simply following the rules. If they decide a punishment is forthcoming, it will be completely separate to the paid suspension last season. You're assuming they dropped the ball, when the opposite is true. They did exactly what they should have. There is no "but still" here. The NHL had no cause for an unpaid suspension.

Edit: I'm sure there is some provision in the CBA that allows the NHL to do what is in their best interest, but that's a slippery slope, and it simply makes more sense to take the proper steps. They saved themselves a lot of potential hassle by handling it this way, and even that took some balls, because even with a paid suspension there may have been issues if Voynov had been found not guilty.

So then suspend him for half of this season without pay. Whatever. It doesn't even matter. He followed the punishment the league saw fit and served his jail time. This idea that he should be unable to re-enter the league for years and years without being given a 2nd chance is a bit harsh. We don't know the full details so I won't get into it too far but **** happens. You should never snap like he did but hopefully he learned that. Some people want to treat this like rape or murder which is taking it too far. If a guy gets a DUI, he's not going to be thrown out of the league (even though he's putting other lives at risk).

If Bettman throws VOynov out of the league he'd be setting the precedence for many future players being kicked out. I don't think he's comfortable with that unless it's much more serious than this incident (not that domestic violence is not serious).

Anyway, I hate "defending" this piece of trash so this is going to be my last comment.

I'll end it with: **** the Kings

 

[Sojourn]

I'm with you on the returning thing. If a player serves his punishment, I don't think you should keep him out. Of the league.

Moving him off the team is a bit different, and I'd fully support any decision by our GM to ditch a player if he did something like that. Of course, that isn't Bettman at all, and that's a different type of decision. I'd probably be unhappy with a decision to keep him on the team. Like it or not, you represent the team you play for, and I think you forever tarnish your time with that team when you do something like that. I'd want them gone. Yeah, it probably means the team takes a hit, but I'd accept that.

I do think you can move past it at some point, but it takes time, and you need to prove you are a better person than you were. How can the fans respect the player? How can the players respect their teammate? At that point, I think everyone needs to move on and get a fresh start.

 

[Ducks DVM]

So then suspend him for half of this season without pay. Whatever. It doesn't even matter. He followed the punishment the league saw fit and served his jail time. This idea that he should be unable to re-enter the league for years and years without being given a 2nd chance is a bit harsh. We don't know the full details so I won't get into it too far but **** happens. You should never snap like he did but hopefully he learned that. Some people want to treat this like rape or murder which is taking it too far. If a guy gets a DUI, he's not going to be thrown out of the league (even though he's putting other lives at risk).

If Bettman throws VOynov out of the league he'd be setting the precedence for many future players being kicked out. I don't think he's comfortable with that unless it's much more serious than this incident (not that domestic violence is not serious).

Anyway, I hate "defending" this piece of trash so this is going to be my last comment.

I'll end it with: **** the Kings

This wasn't "just" a tiny slap, this was very ugly abuse.

Marta Varlamova, Voynov’s wife, told police the couple started arguing during a Halloween party. Voynov removed her costume glasses and stomped on them, then, outside the venue, he punched her in the left jaw, according to the report.

When asked by police what the argument was about, Varlamova “stated that she could not remember,†the report said.

The dispute continued in the bedroom of the couple’s Redondo Beach home, Varlamova told police. Voynov, she said, choked her with both hands three times.

“Voynov pushed her to the ground approximately six to seven times with both hands, telling her that he wanted a divorce and to ‘Get out,’ “ the report said.

Varlamova told police that Voynov then kicked her five to six times while on the ground. She said she screamed for him to stop.

When she rose, the report said, Voynov pushed her into the corner of a flat-screen television mounted on the wall, opening a gash above Varlamova’s left eye. Varlamova said the couple’s bedroom was “covered in her blood.â€

I don't know what I think he deserves, but I know that I'm sure that a month or two of a stay in a minimum security luxury pay to stay prison sure as hell hasn't left him "rehabilitated".

 

[tomd]

At the very least, the league cannot allow a situation where a player's contract can be terminated despite no charges being filed (Richards) while at the same time allowing players with criminal behavior (Voynov and possibly Kane) to be allowed to have their contracts honored.

Really bad optics especially considering that the criminal activity is directed violently against women.

 

[snarktacular]

Guy beats stranger.
Guy beats friend (guy).
Guy beats friend (girl, not romantically involved).
Guy beats girlfriend.
Guy beats live-in girlfriend.
Guy beats wife.
Guy beats gay husband.

Are these punished differently?

 

[tomd]

Guy beats stranger.
Guy beats friend (guy).
Guy beats friend (girl, not romantically involved).
Guy beats girlfriend.
Guy beats live-in girlfriend.
Guy beats wife.
Guy beats gay husband.

Are these punished differently?

I can almost guarantee that you will serve less time if you beat up your [straight male] neighbor than if you beat up your girlfriend or [gay male] neighbor.

 

[salsa man]

I don't know what I think he deserves, but I know that I'm sure that a month or two of a stay in a minimum security luxury pay to stay prison sure as hell hasn't left him "rehabilitated".

It's not like US maximum security prisons actually rehabilitate anyone, anyways (most people come out in an even worse mental state than the one they went in with), but that's a conversation for another forum...

 

[salsa man]

I can almost guarantee that you will serve less time if you beat up your [straight male] neighbor than if you beat up your girlfriend or [gay male] neighbor.

It also depends on how severe the damage is. If you put your male neighbor into a coma you'll probably see more time than if you broke your wife's nose.

 

[tomd]

It also depends on how severe the damage is. If you put your male neighbor into a coma you'll probably see more time than if you broke your wife's nose.

clearly.