Tidbits: Around the League: NHL News

[GuerinUp]

Its alot easier to fix an attitude, than teach a skill.

 

[HotDish]

I think Laine's issue is coaching and not effort. Effort on the D side was lacking in his first few season, but I'd argue in the past few it has gone up. Plus someone pointed out on reddit that it didn't look like he wasn't trying on the goal surrendered . It looked more like he didn't know what to do in that situation. I agree with that observation and think Torts should've used it as a teaching moment between periods instead of just benching him.

Gotta remember he is 22. Still learning the game at a pro level. He is younger than players like Greenway and Ek. When it clicks for Laine he could be devastating.

 

[AKL]

I am usually the guy who is arguing for "character", and gets pilloried for it. What is going on here?

It's not "character", it's "effort". I don't care if he's not a Nick Lidstrom or Jonathan Toews, but it does matter that Fiala gives 100% more effort than Laine does.

Both of your arguments rely on:
1) People closing their eyes to the fact that Fiala is not the same player now that he was even two years ago, let alone his rookie and sophomore seasons (you want to compare career stats)
2) People ignoring that Laine has had the privilege of playing with star players in Scheifele and Connor, Wheeler has been great during Laine's time there, Ehlers has been really good, and Fiala has played on, as you pointed out, teams that are starved for offense

So no one is saying that Fiala is a better player than Laine, but as Minnewildsota pointed out, attitude matters. And further consider that Guerin has put that kind of trait at the forefront of what he's looking for, and it's virtually a moot point. I don't think Guerin is interested in trading fair value for a lazy floater.

 

[57special]

Just hire Koivu as a coach. He'll either scare Laine straight, or turn him into a two way monster who scores 17g per year.

 

[BagHead]

I think 57special is right about his arguments, that Laine is the more talented scorer in spite of being less engaged. That said, I certainly wouldn't want a guy that wasn't really trying very hard to be on my team. If one guy is allowed to slack and gets rewarded with ice time, it's easy for others who do try hard to get resentful, and the locker room goes to shit.

Also, Laine has been trending downward in terms of production. I saw someone earlier say he could put up 50 goals (and I agree he could), but at this point I wouldn't even feel comfortable calling him a 40 goal scorer. He needs to re-engage in hockey, or he's not worth the price it would take to get him.

 

[AKL]

I think Laine's issue is coaching and not effort. Effort on the D side was lacking in his first few season, but I'd argue in the past few it has gone up. Plus someone pointed out on reddit that it didn't look like he wasn't trying on the goal surrendered . It looked more like he didn't know what to do in that situation. I agree with that observation and think Torts should've used it as a teaching moment between periods instead of just benching him.

Coaching? Scheifele, Connor, Ehlers are all young stars for the same coach Laine played for, and have had zero problems with character, effort, whatever you want to categorize Laine's problems as.

I think 57special is right about his arguments, that Laine is the more talented scorer in spite of being less engaged. That said, I certainly wouldn't want a guy that wasn't really trying very hard to be on my team. If one guy is allowed to slack and gets rewarded with ice time, it's easy for others who do try hard to get resentful, and the locker room goes to shit.

Also, Laine has been trending downward in terms of production. I saw someone earlier say he could put up 50 goals, but at this point I wouldn't even feel comfortable calling him a 40 goal scorer. He needs to re-engage in hockey, or he's not worth the price it would take to get him.

I don't think anyone has said Fiala is the more talented scorer. As for the rest of the post, I agree.

 

[GuerinUp]

Your guys's arguments are understandable, but also a reason we are a team with no championships, and the same reason koivu kept getting signed here well past his prime. effort doesnt equal skill.

 

[BagHead]

I don't think anyone has said Fiala is the more talented scorer. As for the rest of the post, I agree.

He was making that argument. It does seem he was making it unopposed.

 

[GuerinUp]

koivu announced his retirement in other news

 

[HotDish]

Coaching? Scheifele, Connor, Ehlers are all young stars for the same coach Laine played for, and have had zero problems with character, effort, whatever you want to categorize Laine's problems as.

Laine was never put on a good line with a center since the WCF season. Laine should've been in wheelers spot. This is akin to doing something like having Parise play over Fiala/Kaprizov. That isn't to mention that Winnipeg's top forwards sit around the top the league for multiple seasons in empty net goals/points inflating their numbers(mostly put in here because it made Wheeler look better than he actually is).

Paul Maurice is probably one of the worse coaches in the league when it comes to player management. The guy loves his vets and lets the younger talent flounder.

You put Laine on another team with a coach that will value him and teach you got yourself a star. Not saying CBJ can't do that, but I have my own thoughts about Torts. I think Scheifele and Wheeler are at fault for Winnipeg's issues too since it sounded like they only wanted to play with each other and even Wheeler admitted he should've handled the situation better.

His attitude and defense are way overblown compared to stupid lineups Maurice threw out there.

 

[AKL]

Laine was never put on a good line with a center since the WCF season. Laine should've been in wheelers spot. This is akin to doing something like having Parise play over Fiala/Kaprizov. That isn't to mention that Winnipeg's top forwards sit around the top the league for multiple seasons in empty net goals/points inflating their numbers(mostly put in here because it made Wheeler look better than he actually is).

Paul Maurice is probably one of the worse coaches in the league when it comes to player management. The guy loves his vets and lets the younger talent flounder.

You put Laine on another team with a coach that will value him and teach you got yourself a star. Not saying CBJ can't do that, but I have my own thoughts about Torts. I think Scheifele and Wheeler are at fault for Winnipeg's issues too since it sounded like they only wanted to play with each other and even Wheeler admitted he should've handled the situation better.

His attitude and defense are way overblown compared to stupid lineups Maurice threw out there.

Yeah what a damn shame that he spent most of his time playing with Scheifele and Connor last season. And Connor, Wheeler, Scheifele the year before that. 2017-18 you might have a point though because while Ehlers was his most common linemates, he did spend significant time with Little and Stastny as his centers. Except, wait, 2017-18 was his 44 goal season? But anyway, his rookie year he spent most of his time with Scheifele and Ehlers so I don't know.

I don't know, maybe he's being held back by his coach playing him with guys like Connor, Scheifele and Wheeler on the PP?

You have a coach in Tortorella who is known for benching players who show poor attitude and work ethic.
You have a player who is notorious for his low effort, lazy play and being disengaged.
3-4 games into their time together, the player is already benched.
And you still think there's no merit to Laine's reputation? You still think it's all Maurice's fault?

Tortorella has certain issues, Maurice has certain issues, but let's not pretend Laine doesn't have issues that have contributed to his usage.

 

[GuerinUp]

Its FINE guys, Captain Spurg can straighten him out.

Made a proposal in the trade boards

fiala + min 2021 1st + rask.

well see what the columbus thoughts are.

 

[Victorious Secret]

koivu announced his retirement in other news

Columbus Blue Jackets F Mikko Koivu retires seven games into 16th NHL season - TSN.ca

 

[16thOverallSaveUs]

Man Nashville stinks this year. I really don’t get it either. That’s not a bad roster at all.

 

[HotDish]

Its FINE guys, Captain Spurg can straighten him out.

Made a proposal in the trade boards

fiala + min 2021 1st + rask.

well see what the columbus thoughts are.

I'm a Laine fan, but I would take Fiala just because I don't think his pay day will be as large as Laine. Laine - Rossi - Kaprizov does make me drool, but at this point I rather save a bit in the cap than give it all to a wing. If the Wild didn't have a massive hole at center I would entertain it. If the Wild needed to pay Kaprizov + Laine. You are left bargain bin shopping for the rest of the offseason.

 

[GuerinUp]

I'm a Laine fan, but I would take Fiala just because I don't think his pay day will be as large as Laine. Laine - Rossi - Kaprizov does make me drool, but at this point I rather save a bit in the cap than give it all to a wing. If the Wild didn't have a massive hole at center I would entertain it. If the Wild needed to pay Kaprizov + Laine. You are left bargain bin shopping for the rest of the offseason.

gives me spezza alfredsson heatley vibes

 

[57special]

Man Nashville stinks this year. I really don’t get it either. That’s not a bad roster at all.

It's all about their top two C's, who are being paid like they are #1's, but playing like number two. Duchene and Johansen are two of the most disappointing players in the NHL relative to expectations. They can't blame age, or injury.

They are similar to us, except they don't have much in the way of prospects. I actually think we play harder, too.

 

[16thOverallSaveUs]

Pretty big blow fo BCs championship hopes that he’s out

 

[AKL]

Pretty big blow fo BCs championship hopes that he’s out

That's a real shame. He could have went pro last year too, but wanted to stay one more year to play for a championship and be a leader on that team.

 

[AKL]

Haven't been watching any Sharks games, but Donato is t-4th on the team with 7 points. Burns and Hertl also have 7, Meier has 6, Labanc has 5. Kane has 9 and Couture has 10. Pretty crazy what can happen when you give him minutes and linemates. Not sure why Guerin thought we couldn't use offense on this team.

 

[GuerinUp]

Haven't been watching any Sharks games, but Donato is t-4th on the team with 7 points. Burns and Hertl also have 7, Meier has 6, Labanc has 5. Kane has 9 and Couture has 10. Pretty crazy what can happen when you give him minutes and linemates. Not sure why Guerin thought we couldn't use offense on this team.

no room for him, gave us pittburghs 3rd rounder as well. well see how it pans out.

 

[AKL]

no room for him, gave us pittburghs 3rd rounder as well. well see how it pans out.

No room? The only player in our "top 6" with more points than Donato is Kaprizov. Parise is garbage, Johansson hasn't been great. We went out and acquired Bjugstad for a pick, so that entirely offsets.

There was plenty of room for a guy like Donato to get a real chance this year.

 

[GuerinUp]

No room? The only player in our "top 6" with more points than Donato is Kaprizov. Parise is garbage, Johansson hasn't been great. We went out and acquired Bjugstad for a pick, so that entirely offsets.

There was plenty of room for a guy like Donato to get a real chance this year.

How many wingers are on our roster? We didnt sign any FA's. i rest my case, no room. Bjugstad isnt playing wing. Johansson wasnt brought here to play wing. We quite literally had no room for him to play.

 

[AKL]

How many wingers are on our roster? We didnt sign any FA's. i rest my case, no room. Bjugstad isnt playing wing. Johansson wasnt brought here to play wing. We quite literally had no room for him to play.

We easily could have given him a top 6 opportunity if we kept him.

 

[GuerinUp]

We easily could have given him a top 6 opportunity if we kept him.

Where? Zucc is coming back. Fiala, Kap, Greenway, parise (who i wouldnt mind being benched even) Johansson. Thats 6 wingers that can play top 6.