Any Doubt who the GOAT is?

[HellebuyckOurSaviour]

Yeah, you're right. Everyone on that 2001 team is still with Brady. Charlie Weis did a great job as the OC last night, though he did call some bonehead plays. Did you see that Troy Brown catch, though?

Oh yah i keep forgetting your a Bruins fan lol

 

[YoSoyLalo]

Playing in an easy division inflates his chances.

 

[Tecumseh]

I guess that's the conversation now -

Is Bill Belichick the greatest coach in the history of all sports?

I’d put John Wooden at the top IMO

 

[Voight]

I guess that's the conversation now -

Is Bill Belichick the greatest coach in the history of all sports?

Thing with him is he's got those 2 rings as the mastermind of the Giants defence and even with the Browns he did OK there.

 

[Panthaz89]

Literally wouldn't survive in earlier eras without all the rules to protect QBs he would of been snapped in half...no there are plenty who don't think he's the goat just because he got lucky and ended up on a team that literally went 11-5 without him even playing. Sorry but Brady would be dead behind any team with a shotty Oline to people who understand how football works.

 

[Panthaz89]

I disagree, and I'm a Packers fan.

Brady has done more with less than any QB in recent history. Outside of Randy Moss for 3 years and a couple healthy Gronk seasons, hes never had any elite players on offence. He's managed to turn guys like Branch, Welker, Edelman and White into significant players. Yes, Belichick is the one who saw them as diamonds in the rough but Brady has also been a significant factor in their development.



Are you ignoring the fact that Peyton on the Colts had some amazing offensive weapons? Or that in SB 50 he literally didnt have to do much, that Broncos defence was super elite and one of the best units ever? Peyton also only left Indy because they no longer wanted him.

This is probably the dumbest thing I've ever heard Brady does more with less...yet we just saw them win the SB with the other team scoring 3 points and their offense hardly did anything and Brady didn't even come close to winning MVP in that game...hes had a dominant offensive line every year of his career and their running game was dominant the whole playoff run as well."OUTSIDE OF RANDY MOSS" is absolutely hilarious considering Moss is probably the 2nd best receiver in the history of the game yet you claim he hardly had anybody which makes this basically a joke. He's had better receivers than any other QB but the 49ers duo...and Welker was also just as good when he played with Manning when Manning broke the TD record in Denver.

 

[DangleCity]

This is probably the dumbest thing I've ever heard Brady does more with less...yet we just saw them win the SB with the other team scoring 3 points and their offense hardly did anything and Brady didn't even come close to winning MVP in that game...hes had a dominant offensive line every year of his career and their running game was dominant the whole playoff run as well."OUTSIDE OF RANDY MOSS" is absolutely hilarious considering Moss is probably the 2nd best receiver in the history of the game yet you claim he hardly had anybody which makes this basically a joke. He's had better receivers than any other QB but the 49ers duo...and Welker was also just as good when he played with Manning when Manning broke the TD record in Denver.

Damn you're bitter. Wrong as well. But so so bitter.

 

[jgatie]

This is probably the dumbest thing I've ever heard Brady does more with less...yet we just saw them win the SB with the other team scoring 3 points and their offense hardly did anything and Brady didn't even come close to winning MVP in that game...hes had a dominant offensive line every year of his career and their running game was dominant the whole playoff run as well."OUTSIDE OF RANDY MOSS" is absolutely hilarious considering Moss is probably the 2nd best receiver in the history of the game yet you claim he hardly had anybody which makes this basically a joke. He's had better receivers than any other QB but the 49ers duo...and Welker was also just as good when he played with Manning when Manning broke the TD record in Denver.

Aside from Moss, name one receiver Brady ever had that was better than Reggie Wayne and Marvin Harrison.

 

[Panthaz89]

Damn you're bitter. Wrong as well. But so so bitter.

you can't even tell me why i'm wrong because you can't with the cold hard truth right there.....next you'll tell me how Brady stopped the GSOT in the first SB win even though they only scored 17 points against the Rams with Warner and won because the defense stopped one of the best offenses of all time.

 

[member 157595]

I live near Boston but was born and raised in central NY, and will never cheer for the Patriots out of principle. However, Tom Brady was the best QB to ever play before, during and after this game. His legacy is secured.

What Brady has accomplished in a league with a hard salary cap is absolutely unfathomable. He has both endless personal accolades and team achievements, and there's simply no one else that compares. Obviously he and Belichick have a symbiotic relationship; Belichick has never won a Super Bowl as head coach without Brady as his QB, and vice versa. Games are won and lost as a team; otherwise, Trent Dilfer would be more highly regarded than Dan Marino. But Brady has made a career out of elite play when it matters, and he's still been incredible during the regular season. He's not the best passer of all time; I'd personally put Aaron Rodgers and Dan Marino at the top of that list. But he is the best quarterback of all time.

Before Super Bowl XIX, John Madden was asked his opinion on Marino v.s. Montana, and he said: "Marino is the best passer I've ever seen, but if I want to win one game, I'm going with Montana." That throne now belongs to Brady. Brady's a Northern California kid that probably idolized Montana growing up...it's pretty incredible when you go on to exceed the exploits of your childhood idol, and that's exactly what happened.

 

[Panthaz89]

Aside from Moss, name one receiver Brady ever had that was better than Reggie Wayne and Marvin Harrison.

What's the point of this....he had Moss so its irrelevant to talk about anything like that and Gronk despite being a TE is better than Wayne easily. Manning had his best season with DT, Welker and Sanders with Denver so clearly Harrison and Wayne weren't that great. Aside from Jerry Rice who did Montana have? You see how bad that sounds when trying to argue that a QB did more with less and you try to pull out one of the best receivers in the history of the game to argue that he played with nobody?

 

[jgatie]

What's the point of this....he had Moss so its irrelevant to talk about anything like that and Gronk despite being a TE is better than Wayne easily. Manning had his best season with DT, Welker and Sanders with Denver so clearly Harrison and Wayne weren't that great.

You stated that he had better receivers since the 49ers duo, then mention Gronk and Moss, who were never a duo? And ignore Wayne and Harrison, who most certainly were a duo?

Harrison not that good? He's in freaking Canton, and Wayne will be in 2020.

 

[DangleCity]

you can't even tell me why i'm wrong because you can't with the cold hard truth right there.....next you'll tell me how Brady stopped the GSOT in the first SB win even though they only scored 17 points against the Rams with Warner and won because the defense stopped one of the best offenses of all time.

Please keep enlightening me with cold hard truth bombs

 

[Panthaz89]

You stated that he had better receivers since the 49ers duo, then mention Gronk and Moss, who were never a duo? And ignore Wayne and Harrison, who most certainly were a duo?

49ers duo was a reference to Montana and Young both having Rice.

 

[Panthaz89]

You stated that he had better receivers since the 49ers duo, then mention Gronk and Moss, who were never a duo? And ignore Wayne and Harrison, who most certainly were a duo?

Harrison not that good? He's in freaking Canton, and Wayne will be in 2020.

So will Gronk and Moss is the 2nd best receiver in the history of the game outside of MAYBE T.O........are you trying to make a point here because its clear having Moss and Welker is significantly better than the former. Manning had his best season by far with DT, Welker, and Sanders and its not even close. Point is this garbage about Brady not having much around him is hilarious. I'm a Panthers fan and i've never seen any Panthers QB have anything close to what Brady had around him at any point yet people bring up shit like he does more with less when he has significant team around him compared to nearly every QB in the league and the team went 11-5 without him even playing one year with Matt f***ing Cassell as QB. When Cam won the MVP his best receiver was Ted Ginn now that's doing "more with less" if anything.

 

[jgatie]

So will Gronk and Moss is the 2nd best receiver in the history of the game outside of MAYBE T.O........are you trying to make a point here because its clear having Moss and Welker is significantly better than the former. Manning had his best season by far with DT, Welker, and Sanders and its not even close.

So Moss is second to TO, but Brady has had the best receivers since the 49er duo had Jerry Rice? So is Rice better or worse than TO, and if so, where exactly does Moss fall?

Seems your hatred is screwing with your logic. I love the way the haters get all tangled after yet another Brady SB win puts yet another nail in the coffin of the GOAT debate.

 

[Panthaz89]

So Moss is second to TO, but Brady has had the best receivers since the 49er duo had Jerry Rice? So is Rice better or worse than TO, and if so, where exactly does Moss fall?

Seems your hatred is screwing with your logic. I love the way the haters get all tangled after yet another Brady SB win puts yet another nail in the coffin of the GOAT debate.

Oh I get it now you don't listen to anyone who doesn't agree with you because there is no "debate" to you. The topic of the post was to debate whether or not Brady is the goat sorry if wasn't supposed to argue against it.

 

[jgatie]

Oh I get it now you don't listen to anyone who doesn't agree with you because there is no "debate" to you. The topic of the post was to debate whether or not Brady is the goat sorry if wasn't supposed to argue against it.

Go ahead and argue against it. I find exercises in futility extremely entertaining.

Tell me again how Moss is second only to TO, but Brady has had the best receivers since Rice.

 

[Panthaz89]

Go ahead and argue against it. I find exercises in futility extremely entertaining.

Tell me again how Moss is second only to TO, but Brady has had the best receivers since Rice.

You seriously need to read better if that's what you came up with Moss is a clear 2 behind Rice with T.O being the only other receiver that's even close to Moss. What would be better is if you could name a QB who has had better receivers than Brady....only thing people ever say is that Manning had Harrison and Wayne yet his best season was with DT, Welker, and Sanders. Romo is probably the next with T.O and Witten together...other than that every other QB has had substantially less than Brady and its not even close. Rodgers has had some pretty good receiving groups but nothing that great and I don't believe anybody he has had even touches the HOF and his Oline has been beyond bad for several years now.

 

[member 157595]

Oh I get it now you don't listen to anyone who doesn't agree with you because there is no "debate" to you.

If you look at the situation objectively there really isn't a debate.

I don't like the Patriots either. I was born and raised in Giants/Bills country and nowhere are the Patriots more hated. But he's dominated so thoroughly for so long in a hard-capped league with varying degrees of talent around him. He plays better when the stakes are higher and has extended his career far beyond the lifespan of his peers despite being thin and a very unexceptional athlete. Many very average players became anywhere from key contributors to Pro Bowl-level talents when playing with Brady.

...and Jesus Christ, Terrell freaking Owens is most certainly NOT the greatest WR in the history of the game. Come on. EDIT: If you meant that Owens is arguably the 2nd best (it's not clear in your post) then I disagree but won't argue the point.

 

[Panthaz89]

If you look at the situation objectively there really isn't a debate.

I don't like the Patriots either. I was born and raised in Giants/Bills country and nowhere are the Patriots more hated. But he's dominated so thoroughly for so long in a hard-capped league with varying degrees of talent around him. He plays better when the stakes are higher and has extended his career far beyond the lifespan of his peers despite being thin and a very unexceptional athlete. Many very average players became anywhere from key contributors to Pro Bowl-level talents when playing with Brady.

...and Jesus Christ, Terrell freaking Owens is most certainly NOT the greatest WR in the history of the game. Come on. EDIT: If you meant that Owens is arguably the 2nd best (it's not clear in your post) then I disagree but won't argue the point.

the Patriots have dominated but the team has gone through stretches of great play without Brady....they went 3-1 with Garropolo and Brisset when they won the SB before...that's not a sign of a QB "carrying his team" at all when you can win more than lose without him even playing. They even shutout the Texans with Brisset playing. I don't know how the T.O part is that confusing when i state Moss is the 2nd best receiver in the history of the game outside of T.O possibly being better than him for the no.2 spot when Moss and T.O are respectively top 5 in receiving yards all time...Fitz just passed them both but he's not the 2nd best receiver of all time.

 

[Habs 4 Life]

You are right. Montana lost before SB.

Brady: 29-10 playoff record (74%)
Montana: 16-7 (69%)

Keep spinning your bull****.

Gotta love the people who think not making the playoffs or losing in a divisional game is a better accomplishment than losing in the SuperBowl lol

 

[BigBadBruins7708]

Gotta love the people who think not making the playoffs or losing in a divisional game is a better accomplishment than losing in the SuperBowl lol

yup, its pretty simple.

Tom Brady has more Superbowl appearances than every NFL franchise (other than NE)

 

[JRull86]

Montana never lost a SB. Never threw a INT.

Seriously, Hoyer could have won this SB. Hell, Hoyer/Jimmy G could have won this Rams game behind that Belichick defense.

Ah you're one of those people. The one's who spew endless nonsense to try to prop up a terrible argument. Reading from the good book of Rob Parker, Max Kellerman, and Shannon Sharpe.

6-3 > 4-0 in the cap era. The case is closed, and has been since they beat ATL. It's okay to respect a player and organization you hate.

Also, to the bolded, no he couldn't have. It doesn't matter how poor Brady played there, Hoyer isn't making that throw to Gronk down the seem in triple coverage to essentially win the game. Don't be dumb.

 

[BigT2002]

Do I feel it is more coaching than player? Absolutely. BB has shown time and time again that if he can prepare his defense to play a certain way, they will most likely win the game. He just needs Tom to go out there for basically 3 drives to seal the deal. Where Brady earns his stripes is 1 of those typically ends up being a late-game series where he has 2:25 left and 1 timeout. And somehow gets them in a position to score the GW FG/TD.

Brady needs Bill much more than Bill needs Brady. The one key factor that Brady gives Bill is what I mentioned above, the ability to play call a key drive with precision.