Any Doubt who the GOAT is?

[CTHabsfan]

Its the entire package that make him the GOAT. Also you cant compare across sports. Winning the SB in this era is way more difficult than what Russell or Richard did in 6 teams leagues without free agency.

It's the entire package (teammates, coaches, management) that puts Brady in position to win Super Bowls. Do you think anyone would believe Tom Brady was the GOAT if he spent his career with the Cleveland Browns? Archie Manning was a great QB, but he never had a chance to win in New Orleans because he was forced to run for his life.

 

[N o o d l e s]

There must be a lot of salt in those tears

 

[N o o d l e s]

What team wouldnt want to play against the Bills, Jets and Dolphins to win every year? You put the Patriots in any other division and would love to see how they get to where they are. 6 SB's, 2 pretty much given to them (Seattle/Atlanta) seattle runs the ball and they win the SB, Atlanta kicks a fg instead of gunning it game over, i dont know how any one person can be a GOAT, didnt know Brady played 50 years ago? And anyone who is a NE fan, once him and BB are gone and every team destroys you each year and then YOU start whining and complaining and keep talking about (well when TB and BB were here blah blah blah) no one will have any sympathy for you.

Ya the Patriots would have had such a hard time making the playoffs in a division with Cincinnati and Cleveland, Tennessee and Jacksonville or the mid-2000’s NFC West

Since you’re so quick to make this asinine argument, why don’t you go ahead and list all the divisions that you honestly believe the Patriots wouldn’t win every year?

 

[N o o d l e s]

This is probably the dumbest thing I've ever heard Brady does more with less...yet we just saw them win the SB with the other team scoring 3 points and their offense hardly did anything and Brady didn't even come close to winning MVP in that game...hes had a dominant offensive line every year of his career and their running game was dominant the whole playoff run as well."OUTSIDE OF RANDY MOSS" is absolutely hilarious considering Moss is probably the 2nd best receiver in the history of the game yet you claim he hardly had anybody which makes this basically a joke. He's had better receivers than any other QB but the 49ers duo...and Welker was also just as good when he played with Manning when Manning broke the TD record in Denver.

Manning had more elite offensive players around him in one year than Brady has had his entire career

 

[DangleCity]

It's the entire package (teammates, coaches, management) that puts Brady in position to win Super Bowls. Do you think anyone would believe Tom Brady was the GOAT if he spent his career with the Cleveland Browns? Archie Manning was a great QB, but he never had a chance to win in New Orleans because he was forced to run for his life.

Absolutely its the entire package, Brady and Belichick. The two GOATs at their positions. Thats why they have had this unprecedented level of success. Both need each other, but that doesnt take away from their success or greatness.

How would Tom have faired in Cleveland? No idea. Just like you have no idea how Archie Manning would have done in Bradys situation. All we can deal with is facts. We can play the hypothetical game forever and go in circles.

 

[Big Phil]

If Super Bowl wins makes Brady the "GOAT", does that make Yogi Berra, Henri Richard and Bill Russell the "GOAT" of their respective sports, or is it possible that all of the above had some help?

Well for starters, Russell would be no worse than top 5 in the NBA all-time. Berra and Henri Richard were important parts of their tam but never THE most important part of their team. Berra always had either DiMaggio or Mantle there. Henri always had Beliveau, among others, to carry the load. I think with Brady it is a bit different story and altogether the QB position is the most important position in all of sports, so it holds more weight the more championships you win.

 

[CTHabsfan]

the QB position is the most important position in all of sports, so it holds more weight the more championships you win.

If a QB doesn't have a good offensive line, his skill level is irrelevant. Tom Brady has always had plenty of time to make his throws, and it's not because he's mobile. Take a look at Mark Rypien in 1991, a season that ended with him winning the Super Bowl. Rypien, an extremely mediocre QB, put up excellent numbers (for 1991) because he had an outstanding line. When he didn't have a great line, his numbers were less than stellar.

The key to the Patriots' success has been Bill Belichick and the management team. They have been able to replace key players over the years while other teams have not. They have even managed to do well even without Brady playing. Most teams losing a starting QB do horribly (see 2018 Redskins, 2017 Packers).

 

[Big Phil]

If a QB doesn't have a good offensive line, his skill level is irrelevant. Tom Brady has always had plenty of time to make his throws, and it's not because he's mobile. Take a look at Mark Rypien in 1991, a season that ended with him winning the Super Bowl. Rypien, an extremely mediocre QB, put up excellent numbers (for 1991) because he had an outstanding line. When he didn't have a great line, his numbers were less than stellar.

The key to the Patriots' success has been Bill Belichick and the management team. They have been able to replace key players over the years while other teams have not. They have even managed to do well even without Brady playing. Most teams losing a starting QB do horribly (see 2018 Redskins, 2017 Packers).

I think Brady's success goes a bit farther than just having a good offensive line. To me it has always been his vision. It was the same with Montana, same with Manning. Manning wasn't mobile either.

 

[InjuredChoker]

pats also have possibly the best oline coach in the business who should end up in the HOF. the years they didn't have scar, it showed.

 

[DangleCity]

If a QB doesn't have a good offensive line, his skill level is irrelevant. Tom Brady has always had plenty of time to make his throws, and it's not because he's mobile. Take a look at Mark Rypien in 1991, a season that ended with him winning the Super Bowl. Rypien, an extremely mediocre QB, put up excellent numbers (for 1991) because he had an outstanding line. When he didn't have a great line, his numbers were less than stellar.

The key to the Patriots' success has been Bill Belichick and the management team. They have been able to replace key players over the years while other teams have not. They have even managed to do well even without Brady playing. Most teams losing a starting QB do horribly (see 2018 Redskins, 2017 Packers).

Brady helps his offensive line out a ton and makes them look better. He gets rid of the ball so fast that its almost impossible to get to him. He also has unrivaled footwork and ability to slide around in the pocket and avoid the rush. He'll also stand in the pocket to the last second and buy himself an extra split second and take the hit.


Part of the reason they are abke to replace players is because A. Brady takes less money so they can allocate salary cap to other positions. B. Brady is able to make chicken salad out of chicken poo so again they can skimp on parts of the offense and better build up ST, DEF, etc

 

[Big Phil]

Brady helps his offensive line out a ton and makes them look better. He gets rid of the ball so fast that its almost impossible to get to him. He also has unrivaled footwork and ability to slide around in the pocket and avoid the rush. He'll also stand in the pocket to the last second and buy himself an extra split second and take the hit.

This is why I never buy into the whole, "Brady whines every time he gets hit." He doesn't. No QB likes to get hit, but Brady has spent his whole career sacrificing himself to make a great pass.