Confirmed with Link: [ANA/BOS] Ondrej Kase for 2020 1st round pick, David Backes (25% retained), and Axel Andersson

[Cogsfordogs7]

We'll need your Hazy take on him once he starts playing. See if he goes coast to coast like cold toast or not.

At his age, Smart Balance is a healthier option for Backes. If we can't win, let's just get big guys who hit people.

 

[crowi]

What are you talking about?
Forward prospects: Terry (2015, 5th rd), Jones (2016, 1st), C Steel (2016, 1st), Comtois (2017, 2nd), C Lundestrom (2018, 1st), C Groulx (2018, 2nd), C Zegra (2019, 1st), and Tracey (2019, 1st)... oh and Sprong is somewhere in that mix.

Goalie: Dostal (2018, 3rd)

Defense: Larsson (2015, 1st), Guhle (2015, 2nd - traded for), RHD Andersson (2018, 2nd - traded for today), Benoit (2018, UDFA), LaCombe (2019, 2nd), and Thrun (2019, 4th)

Then we have two first round picks in 2020 draft.

We're already in the rebuild mode. Right now, we're in the "growing pains" era. Here are the following players playing for the NHL club right now: Terry, Jones, Steel, Larsson, and Guhle. Comtois and Lundestrom are in the AHL. Andersson and Groulx will be in the AHL next season. Zegras looks like the crown jewel of the bunch. Getting more picks for this year's draft won't probably come to fruition for probably three years or so.

While you've picked on Bob being retained for quite some time, you haven't picked up on the long game Bob has already implemented.

A lot of picks you mentioned there were late ones. Zegras is obviously the one that stands out as different. He also should've gone like 3-4 picks before we got him.

Also I disagree we have been "rebuilding". We have ended up there for sure, but that wasn't the plan.

 

[bracer028]

A lot of picks you mentioned there were late ones. Zegras is obviously the one that stands out as different. He also should've gone like 3-4 picks before we got him.

Also I disagree we have been "rebuilding". We have ended up there for sure, but that wasn't the plan.

Not being sarcastic...but we didnt see perry and kesler jump off a cliff like that in 3 years time

 

[Hockey Duckie]

A lot of picks you mentioned there were late ones. Zegras is obviously the one that stands out as different. He also should've gone like 3-4 picks before we got him.

Also I disagree we have been "rebuilding". We have ended up there for sure, but that wasn't the plan.

All the late picks were because we were winning the Pacific Division five consecutive years and in the playoffs for six consecutive years.

We're rebuilding now because, as Bracer028 denoted, we weren't expecting Kesler, Perry, nor Eaves to drop out like that. If they were all healthy and productive, then we wouldn't be relying on the youth movement so much, which started last year due to mass injuries where we were forced to started Lundestrom in his draft year onto NHL ice as an 18-year old.

Anyhow, you're deflecting. We're rebuilding now because there was a plan of transition from old to new, but the old decided to drop off far earlier than expected. We have several first round picks, second rounders, and a delightful 5th rounder making churning towards NHL regularity. GM Murray also admitted he's pushing the kids a month or so after the season started.

So trying to accrue more picks for this draft isn't going to help us within the next two seasons just because you feel there needs to start a proper rebuild. Just admit you couldn't pick up on the rebuild already on-going. Why? Because all those extra draft picks you're wanting to accrue will probably in the 2nd round or lower. Not only that, but you're gonna have to wait a few years to see any of them sniff the NHL with great regularity (I'm excluding our own first round pick, of course, since no extra trade is needed for that). After I listed all those prospects, you want to believe we're not already transitioning because "you think" it's not a proper rebuild? And then you mock the org for drafting Zegras?! It's not our fault other teams passed on him that are now regretting it.

hahahhaha "You think" we're not rebuilding because that wasn't the original plan. hahahahhahahahhahahahha So you're the barometer of what should be a rebuild? hahahhahahahhahahahhahaha Oh i needed this laughter after witnessing the ineptness of our offense against Colorado and Lindholm's lavish turnover gift.

 

[Opak]

Super mixed feelings on this one. 1st is nice, RHD prospect is nice, Backes is what it is. Kind of feel like we should've gotten more in the deal, an extra pick/prospect thrown on top just for agreeing to take Backes in the first place.

Really reminds me of the Montour trade -- I like that we got some of these things, I hate the fact that Kase had to be sacrificed in order to make it happen. When (yes, I believe when) Kase breaks out in Boston, this deal isn't going to look that great IMO...

More of these trades would be fine we need to stock up assets. Kase injury issues have hurt his value but given where the team is at the trade makes sense.

Now I'd be looking at the market for Rakell and Henrique

Rico yes, Rakell no. The latter mostly because too many teams have already given up their 1st, if Rakell went now IMO the return wouldn't be as good as it could be in the offseason.

Trade Rico to the highest bidder, re-sign Grant would be the name of the game IMO, unless someone is offering something absolutely stupid for Grant in a Paul Gaustad type trade.

 

[duckpuck]

If you say Backes is worth a first then Kase was traded for a guy who is still playing juniors and was a second round pick. Given what I've read it's hard to be enthused about Andersson but given Kase's health I suppose a second round pick isn't terrible. Add in the B's retention on Backes and Bob probably did as good as could be expected for a guy who is one hit away from retirement.

You're ignoring the retention. Backes with a 25% retention is not worth a first IMO. With the retention, the actual cost of Backes contract next year is not much more than Kase was going to make (though Backes has a higher cap hit which is irrelevant to the ducks).

It is not exact, but I think you could analyze the trade as Kase for the first (small win for the ducks) and Backes with retention with a second (Andersson) (small win for Boston). The value doesn't seem awful. Of course, it will hurt if Boston finds a way to keep Kase healthy and he scores 30 goals (which could easily happen).

 

[Dr Johnny Fever]

You're ignoring the retention. Backes with a 25% retention is not worth a first IMO. With the retention, the actual cost of Backes contract next year is not much more than Kase was going to make (though Backes has a higher cap hit which is irrelevant to the ducks).

It is not exact, but I think you could analyze the trade as Kase for the first (small win for the ducks) and Backes with retention with a second (Andersson) (small win for Boston). The value doesn't seem awful. Of course, it will hurt if Boston finds a way to keep Kase healthy and he scores 30 goals (which could easily happen).

Your right the retention is worth something. But why ask for retention at all if you’re trying to weaponize cap space? All he did was dilute his return. Go big or go home.

 

[Lord Flashheart]

So, can Backes still skate? A lot of what makes the 4th line work is that they’re all pretty mobile.

He can, with pride.

Maybe Bob has secretly decided to become Tank Commander?

The only tank he should still be commanding is the one in World of Tanks.

 

[Mortal Wombat]

First take, not much research behind this.

Honestly, I thought Kase would have been worth a bit more.

Taking Backes should have cost the 1st rounder. So you're essentially trading Kase for Andersson and the retention. And it sounds like Andersson has taken a step back this year. Color me unimpressed. That being said, I do like this better than the Faulk deal with that godawful extension.

Can't help but think that Bob really wanted to get rid of Kase and his injury problems. If, and that's a big if, Kase manages to stay healthy, the trade has the potential to look very bad for us.

I do like this deal for the players, though. Kase gets to play for the cup with a legit contender, and Andersson gets a chance he would be unlikely to get in most other teams, because the right side of our defense is...what it is.

 

[Paul4587]

Can you imagine if we had our current centre group between 2009 and 2015. Imagine having prime Getzlaf, Backes and Kesler as your top 3 centres.

 

[KaseMeOutside]

Let's not forget that Kase didn't help his cause this year with only 7 goals in 49 games.

his shooting % is absurdly low, but all his other underlying numbers remain strong

 

[KaseMeOutside]

Super mixed feelings on this one. 1st is nice, RHD prospect is nice, Backes is what it is. Kind of feel like we should've gotten more in the deal, an extra pick/prospect thrown on top just for agreeing to take Backes in the first place.

Really reminds me of the Montour trade -- I like that we got some of these things, I hate the fact that Kase had to be sacrificed in order to make it happen. When (yes, I believe when) Kase breaks out in Boston, this deal isn't going to look that great IMO...




Rico yes, Rakell no. The latter mostly because too many teams have already given up their 1st, if Rakell went now IMO the return wouldn't be as good as it could be in the offseason.

Trade Rico to the highest bidder, re-sign Grant would be the name of the game IMO, unless someone is offering something absolutely stupid for Grant in a Paul Gaustad type trade.

Why would Rakell be more valuable later? I would be fine getting a 2021 first, you might get lucky like Ottawa has with the SJ pick. Teams overpay more often at the deadline when they feel the pressure, now is a great time to look at the market, it doesn't make sense to hold onto him much longer

 

[Anaheim4ever]

Kase gets to go to a team that has 2 other Czechs in Kreji and Pasternak, he has to be stoked to play on team with them.
Boston is team Czech(Pasternak, Kreji, Kase)-o-Slovakia(Chara, Halak)

 

[Opak]

Why would Rakell be more valuable later? I would be fine getting a 2021 first, you might get lucky like Ottawa has with the SJ pick. Teams overpay more often at the deadline when they feel the pressure, now is a great time to look at the market, it doesn't make sense to hold onto him much longer

More potential buyers in the offseason, more available assets, more available cap space, more opportunities, more bidding -> higher price. At the TDL you're eliminating all non-contenders and bubble teams from your list of buyers, as they're either selling (competing against you for the TDL returns) or simply not buying. And now that several buyers have already lost their first rounders, the returns start to be somewhat limited already.

On the bolded part -- Rakell wouldn't be an expiring commodity, he's got 2 full seasons after this one. The argument that he needs to go now, instead of waiting for the offseason, doesn't exactly seem sensible to me. The 2021 1st that you covet wouldn't be going anywhere either (which, by itself, would be an extremely underwhelming return BTW).

Funny that you would use the Ottawa-SJ situation as an example, as Ottawa gained that pick from a deal that went down in the offseason. Karlsson was rumored to be on the block at the TDL already, but Ottawa didn't make the deal, because they felt the return just wasn't there. Another guy who recently stuck around with their team only to get dealt in the offseason: Max Pacioretty. The guys who move during the TDL are mostly the rentals, simply because they are expiring merchandise to a seller. This TDL has been a bit of an anomaly in that sense, mostly due to the rental market being really bad this year.

Finally, I must emphasize that the only way I would move Rakell in a deal is if the return is too good to pass up. I still think that guys like Rico and Silf are the ones we should look to move in trades. Doesn't make sense to me that the first roster pieces we trade are Montour and Kase, what kind of seller starts their rebuild from pieces aged 24-25..?

 

[Kalv]

I'd be really curious to know if Andersson is a guy we actively targeted or was a "scrap" that Boston threw in. Would change my opinion of the deal drastically.

Athletic reported that Murray has been scouting him from when Axel was 16

 

[nbducksfan19]

I don’t know what to think in terms of how the ducks view axel. On one side they say they watched him a long time and that the scouts were targeting him in a trade. Then you have Bob say “Donny and I had a few laughs over this. He's got some good prospects, and he was [upset] because I took his one right-hand shot defenseman. He took away everybody else, for God's sake, so I had to have something.” That quote seems like the ducks settled on axel after Sweeney wouldn’t give him his he really wanted.

 

[bumperkisser]

More potential buyers in the offseason, more available assets, more available cap space, more opportunities, more bidding -> higher price. At the TDL you're eliminating all non-contenders and bubble teams from your list of buyers, as they're either selling (competing against you for the TDL returns) or simply not buying. And now that several buyers have already lost their first rounders, the returns start to be somewhat limited already.

On the bolded part -- Rakell wouldn't be an expiring commodity, he's got 2 full seasons after this one. The argument that he needs to go now, instead of waiting for the offseason, doesn't exactly seem sensible to me. The 2021 1st that you covet wouldn't be going anywhere either (which, by itself, would be an extremely underwhelming return BTW).

Funny that you would use the Ottawa-SJ situation as an example, as Ottawa gained that pick from a deal that went down in the offseason. Karlsson was rumored to be on the block at the TDL already, but Ottawa didn't make the deal, because they felt the return just wasn't there. Another guy who recently stuck around with their team only to get dealt in the offseason: Max Pacioretty. The guys who move during the TDL are mostly the rentals, simply because they are expiring merchandise to a seller. This TDL has been a bit of an anomaly in that sense, mostly due to the rental market being really bad this year.

Finally, I must emphasize that the only way I would move Rakell in a deal is if the return is too good to pass up. I still think that guys like Rico and Silf are the ones we should look to move in trades. Doesn't make sense to me that the first roster pieces we trade are Montour and Kase, what kind of seller starts their rebuild from pieces aged 24-25..?

Everyone wants to trade the expiring older guys but I really believe in a rebuild it makes more sense to do what BM is doing. You keep the good vets that are displaying great leadership on decent contracts so that the young guys have people to look up to. By the time this team is a contender, then you have to your grizzled vets who are now hopefully playing 2/3rd line roles or lower in your lineup with the young guys just about to enter their prime still on good contracts because they haven't hit that 3rd contract yet.

 

[chizzler]

I don’t know what to think in terms of how the ducks view axel. On one side they say they watched him a long time and that the scouts were targeting him in a trade. Then you have Bob say “Donny and I had a few laughs over this. He's got some good prospects, and he was [upset] because I took his one right-hand shot defenseman. He took away everybody else, for God's sake, so I had to have something.” That quote seems like the ducks settled on axel after Sweeney wouldn’t give him his he really wanted.

Axellsson wasn’t a throw in. He’s just too far in the depth for the Bruins. He’s going to be a player for you guys. As far as the trade, everyone has their opinion. I think both teams did ok. I’ve always thought that Backes can still play. You’ll be surprised that he has value. He’s going to be a great locker room guy for your kids.

 

[The Midnight Burrito]

I don’t know what to think in terms of how the ducks view axel. On one side they say they watched him a long time and that the scouts were targeting him in a trade. Then you have Bob say “Donny and I had a few laughs over this. He's got some good prospects, and he was [upset] because I took his one right-hand shot defenseman. He took away everybody else, for God's sake, so I had to have something.” That quote seems like the ducks settled on axel after Sweeney wouldn’t give him his he really wanted.

It seems clear he was just sharing a joke.

 

[tomd]

Axellsson wasn’t a throw in. He’s just too far in the depth for the Bruins. He’s going to be a player for you guys. As far as the trade, everyone has their opinion. I think both teams did ok. I’ve always thought that Backes can still play. You’ll be surprised that he has value. He’s going to be a great locker room guy for your kids.

Yeah, I agree. If you look at the Bruins prospect list and what the Ducks needs are, Andersson was clearly the best option. Studnicka and Vaakaneinen were probably the only ones that were on the same level. All their other prospects are either a bit older or don't really fit a need in the Ducks system.

 

[The Duck Knight]

Everyone wants to trade the expiring older guys but I really believe in a rebuild it makes more sense to do what BM is doing. You keep the good vets that are displaying great leadership on decent contracts so that the young guys have people to look up to. By the time this team is a contender, then you have to your grizzled vets who are now hopefully playing 2/3rd line roles or lower in your lineup with the young guys just about to enter their prime still on good contracts because they haven't hit that 3rd contract yet.

Which is who exactly? Because Murray himself isn't happy with the current leadership group.

 

[MMC]

Lol @ everyone on the main boards acting like Backes is going to screw us cap wise. It’s obvious he was simply included because we had to pay $3 million to get a 1st in a Kase trade instead of a 2nd

 

[The Mighty Duck Man]

Which is who exactly? Because Murray himself isn't happy with the current leadership group.

I dont know if its Intel or speculation but Stephens mentioned today that it's not Getzlaf or Silfverberg he means but moreso that next group that isn't stepping up, and specifically mentioned Rakell, Lindholm, Manson and Henrique as the other guys who he's disappointed in.

 

[Leonardo87]

I dont know if its Intel or speculation but Stephens mentioned today that it's not Getzlaf or Silfverberg he means but moreso that next group that isn't stepping up, and specifically mentioned Rakell, Lindholm, Manson and Henrique as the other guys who he's disappointed in.

Henrique is having a very good season. But I do get Lindholm, Manson, and Rakell. All three have been inconsistent and seem off a lot of times.

 

[Ducks DVM]

Henrique is having a very good season. But I do get Lindholm, Manson, and Rakell. All three have been inconsistent and seem off a lot of times.

There’s a lot of nights he’s invisible though, or where he gets a point or two but is otherwise just bad on the ice.