Confirmed with Link: [ANA/BOS] Ondrej Kase for 2020 1st round pick, David Backes (25% retained), and Axel Andersson

[cheesymc]

That is a particularly ridiculous take on the trade. Please, do some research on Andersson and then ask yourself what is the biggest area of need in the organization...then ask yourself whether or not Andersson was probably at the top of the Ducks list. And finally, in the OC Register BM was quoted as saying this deal had been brewing for quite a while and Boston was unwilling to give up Andersson. It sounds more like BM waited out the Bruins and got the deal he wanted instead of your sublime take.

You go ahead and tell yourself that if you want to accept his spin if that makes you feel better.

 

[Dr Johnny Fever]

Are you guys really taking his joke in a serious context? Jesus christ

Please explain the joke for those of us who didn't get it.

 

[Hey234]

You go ahead and tell yourself that if you want to accept his spin if that makes you feel better.

Considering the fact that the Ducks had the leverage (as they did not need to move Kase and Boston wanted him for the playoffs), your take seems incorrect. Murray stated that they have been following the player for some time and the scouts wanted him as well. Why would the Ducks waste Kase for a player they are not confident in? Just seems pointless to view it that way because what would be Murray's motivation?

It seems much more plausible that the offer was a 2nd and a prospect. Taking on Backes upgrades the 2nd to a 1st. Ducks wanted Andersson and that's the trade. Often times the simplest answer is the right one. Let's seem him play in San Diego before we decide if this was a mistake.

 

[Static]

Please explain the joke for those of us who didn't get it.

You can't be serious.

What exactly do you think he was trying to say to seriously dunk on himself to the media?

 

[Static]

Did everyone listen to audio of that conversation, or just read it?

 

[Dr Johnny Fever]

You can't be serious.

What exactly do you think he was trying to say to seriously dunk on himself to the media?

I have no idea what his lame attempt at humor was. You're the one who knows it so well you felt the need to talk down to the rest of us for not getting it. Go ahead, explain exactly what he meant. But I do know that Andersson was not that highly regarded by analysis I could find other than Bob.

 

[Static]

I have no idea what his lame attempt at humor was. You're the one who knows it so well you felt the need to talk down to the rest of us for not getting it. Go ahead, explain exactly what he meant. But I do know that Andersson was not that highly regarded by analysis I could find other than Bob.

I don't think I'm on the same page as you. We're talking about the "he took everyone else away" quote, right?

If we are, I don't know what to say. He said the quote while laughing, obviously joking, after saying seriously that the deal was a hard one to complete, that the deal was a hard one to complete. Busting balls.

What is everyone spinning it as, he simply threw his hands in the air and took whatever he could? That he's lying about his scouts liking Andersson? I'm confused here.

 

[Static]

I think everyone is just mad at the state of the team and will find any way to spin whatever Bob says or does into a damning condemnation to justify their feelings.

He's made bad moves and he's made good moves, but every franchise has these cycles. All of them. We aren't a special case.

 

[The Mighty Duck Man]

Listening to that audio kind of makes me wonder if Backes even plays next year. Maybe reading too much into it but if he's thinking about ending things the right way he might be ready to call it quits. Also might not want to uproot his family for a year.

 

[Static]

Listening to that audio kind of makes me wonder if Backes even plays next year. Maybe reading too much into it but if he's thinking about ending things the right way he might be ready to call it quits. Also might not want to uproot his family for a year.

I think he can be bought out for cheap next year as well, can't he?

 

[Dr Johnny Fever]

I don't think I'm on the same page as you. We're talking about the "he took everyone else away" quote, right?

If we are, I don't know what to say. He said the quote while laughing, obviously joking, after saying seriously that the deal was a hard one to complete, that the deal was a hard one to complete. Busting balls.

What is everyone spinning it as, he simply threw his hands in the air and took whatever he could? That he's lying about his scouts liking Andersson? I'm confused here.

Well, I heard what he said, and I know he laughed about it. The joke was never that clear to me but I can see how people would take it to mean that's all he could get while still being serious about his scouts liking Andersson sometime in the past. Given the things I've read about Andersson, I might not be inclined to think Ducks scouts would be that high on him today (among all Bruin prospects). But I could see where the Ducks scouts might have been high on him if they were told their choice of Bruin prospects was severely limited. So, I'm still clear as mud on what the hell Bob was or wasn't saying or implying.

 

[The Mighty Duck Man]

I think he can be bought out for cheap next year as well, can't he?

Actually yeah, also a possibility.

 

[Static]

Well, I heard what he said, and I know he laughed about it. The joke was never that clear to me but I can see how people would take it to mean that's all he could get while still being serious about his scouts liking Andersson sometime in the past. Given the things I've read about Andersson, I might not be inclined to think Ducks scouts would be that high on him today (among all Bruin prospects). But I could see where the Ducks scouts might have been high on him if they were told their choice of Bruin prospects was severely limited. So, I'm still clear as mud on what the hell Bob was or wasn't saying or implying.

Well, come on, what are we really thinking was his intention, to pants himself to the public or bust the balls of a rival GM that he just completed a drawn out deal with? I don't know why it's being so overanalyzed. Bob is, by all accounts, a pretty tough nut to crack. I seriously doubt he suddenly lays down in trade negotiations.

 

[Dr Johnny Fever]

Well, come on, what are we really thinking was his intention, to pants himself to the public or bust the balls of a rival GM that he just completed a drawn out deal with? I don't know why it's being so overanalyzed. Bob is, by all accounts, a pretty tough nut to crack. I seriously doubt he suddenly lays down in trade negotiations.

We'll never know all the talks that go on in any deal. But it isn't outside the realm of possibility Bob wanted that 1st and decided to settle for what he got in Andersson. It's not a terrible trade, but it's not a great one either. I still have no idea what his lame attempt at humor accomplished and it doesn't sound like anybody else does either.

 

[Static]

We'll never know all the talks that go on in any deal. But it isn't outside the realm of possibility Bob wanted that 1st and decided to settle for what he got in Andersson. It's not a terrible trade, but it's not a great one either. I still have no idea what his lame attempt at humor accomplished and it doesn't sound like anybody else does either.

Not every attempt at humor has to accomplish anything.

 

[The Mighty Duck Man]

Did all y'all overanalyzing that quote miss the part where Sweeney was pissed off about giving him up?

 

[Static]

Did all y'all overanalyzing that quote miss the part where Sweeney was pissed off about giving him up?

It doesn't fit into the narrative.

 

[nbducksfan19]

It doesn't fit into the narrative.

I think the point is that bob alluded that he was targeting other bruins prospects, but Sweeney said no, then the only one he could get was axel. Also, that means don also valued other other his prospect more than axel. Quote just would have read better if bob stated axel was the guy they wanted and they needed him included to make a deal.

 

[The Mighty Duck Man]

I think the point is that bob alluded that he was targeting other bruins prospects, but Sweeney said no, then the only one he could get was axel. Also, that means don also valued other other his prospect more than axel. Quote just would have read better if bob stated axel was the guy they wanted and they needed him included to make a deal.

I'm sure he was, I don't see how that's a bad thing. Hes not doing his job if he's not asking for their top guys, and Sweeney rightfully said no. That's just negotiating.

IIRC in the Bobby Ryan deal Bob had to "settle" for Silf, Noesen and a first because he asked for Silf, Mika Zibanejad and Jared Cowen. Theres not many trades made where you're not settling in some form.

 

[duckpuck]

Actually yeah, also a possibility.

The ducks can buy him out and save $1M of the $3M they'd be paying (after Boston retention). To be honest, I'm not sure if part of the $1M savings goes to Boston ($250,000). In any event, the ducks save some $$ but end up deferring cap space to the next year so its arguably not worth it. A big question is whether Backes is happy next year being a 12/13. If not, better to buy him out.

 

[The Mighty Duck Man]

The ducks can buy him out and save $1M of the $3M they'd be paying (after Boston retention). To be honest, I'm not sure if part of the $1M savings goes to Boston ($250,000). In any event, the ducks save some $$ but end up deferring cap space to the next year so its arguably not worth it. A big question is whether Backes is happy next year being a 12/13. If not, better to buy him out.

The deferred cap space part is actually what makes it intriguing IMO. According to CapFriendly it'd only be a $3 million hit(vs $4.5) in year one and $750k in year two(vs obviously 0). From strictly a cap perspective it makes all the sense in the world, that $750k doesn't make or break you in 21-22 but the $1.5 million in savings in 20-21 could be huge, especially with how the Perry buyout jumps up next season. Bigger question is if the Samueli's would spend another $2.25 million to make someone go away vs. $3 million and get something out of him.

 

[Hockey Duckie]

Yeah, is it the leadership groups fault there is a massive lack of talent on the roster? Because that's what is losing us games...

That's the crux. Bob did coach virtually this same group of players and they produced better. He had to go through an early rough patch, but then turned things around. Bob got the effort from them last year, but now he's not seeing it, I guess. Leadership also means setting good examples. Throwing pucks into the middle of the ice isn't a great strategy, but we've had Getz, Lindholm, Manson, Rico, Terry, etc... all do it. But we all are enraged when Holzer constantly rims the puck around the boards, which is the most prudent thing to do.

I think it's coaching and leadership. Sometimes it clicks and sometimes it's not there. For example, we hung with Colorado with the exception of Lindholm's absurd blunder that eventually cost us a point. But that's just my opinion.

 

[Bergey37]

That's the crux. Bob did coach virtually this same group of players and they produced better. He had to go through an early rough patch, but then turned things around. Bob got the effort from them last year, but now he's not seeing it, I guess. Leadership also means setting good examples. Throwing pucks into the middle of the ice isn't a great strategy, but we've had Getz, Lindholm, Manson, Rico, Terry, etc... all do it. But we all are enraged when Holzer constantly rims the puck around the boards, which is the most prudent thing to do.

I think it's coaching and leadership. Sometimes it clicks and sometimes it's not there. For example, we hung with Colorado with the exception of Lindholm's absurd blunder that eventually cost us a point. But that's just my opinion.

First off Duckie, I think you have to be really cautious about how much of last season's late success might have been due to Bob. The whole team got a shot of adrenaline when RC was dismissed - the "chains were off" so to speak, and they could play. Yes, the move to a zone defense was a thing and other coaching decisions also helped I'm sure. But I think there were two major factors at work that weren't directly Murray: 1) the whole team could relish in the role of "spoiler," and they took to it with gusto; 2) they kids were brought up and allowed to play with virtually no downside for their mistakes - you could see how free and easy they were on the ice. Contrast that with this season, when Jones, Steel and Terry ALL looked tentative and indecisive, even though they were playing for a coach they knew and LIKED. The difference was there was real downside for them this year. They're getting it figured out, and anyone who looks at them honestly and doesn't just count points can see it.

Leadership is a big catch-all term that encompasses a whole lotta stuff. There's a really good (I think) article in the Athletic by Stephens about Backes, that talks a lot about leadership, and has some good quotes in it from Adam Henrique. Rico talks about how as a young player he came onto a veteran team in NJ, and then came to a veteran team here; he talked about how much he learned from watching those guys in practice, how they trained, how they prepared, how they handled themselves off the ice. This is the type of influence that Murray (and I) are hoping that Backes can have on the kids. Stephens wondered aloud in that piece if there were too many people who'd become complacent after we'd lost the "hate to lose" guys like Kesler, Cogs and Perry. I and others have openly wondered about whether Rakell is just mailing it in now; but I've noticed other players, including Kase, who seem to want to do it all themselves. That's not teamwork, and it doesn't lead to wins.

I'm not saying that Backes will suddenly jumpstart the room; but I DO hope that his experience, work ethic and professionalism will help bring the TEAM mentality back into the Ducks, because I think it's slipping.

Sorry for the length, but I'm not to good with hot takes like most others around here. GO DUCKS!

 

[Paul4587]

That's the crux. Bob did coach virtually this same group of players and they produced better. He had to go through an early rough patch, but then turned things around. Bob got the effort from them last year, but now he's not seeing it, I guess. Leadership also means setting good examples. Throwing pucks into the middle of the ice isn't a great strategy, but we've had Getz, Lindholm, Manson, Rico, Terry, etc... all do it. But we all are enraged when Holzer constantly rims the puck around the boards, which is the most prudent thing to do.

I think it's coaching and leadership. Sometimes it clicks and sometimes it's not there. For example, we hung with Colorado with the exception of Lindholm's absurd blunder that eventually cost us a point. But that's just my opinion.

I’ve seen Scott Niedermayer turn over pucks through the middle of the ice multiple times. Hell he did it in OT of the gold medal game against the US in 2010 (lucky for him Luongo bailed him out). And Nieds is considered one of the best leaders of all time. Ray Bourque as good as he was had a habit of turning the puck over every few games in his own zone.

Turning the puck over is a mistake, it’s not a lack of leadership that causes it. Yes we have seen our best players make egregious errors and they should be setting a better example but they’re also the guys who are making countless good plays to make up for the occasional glaring errors they make. Holzer on the other hand does not play well enough to make up for constantly rimming the puck around the boards. Guhle also doesn’t do enough to make up for the pizzas he throws through the middle twice a game.

Anyway if we had enough talent to be winning games our leadership wouldn’t be questioned. Bob had a good run last year but the sample size is way too small to draw any conclusions from.

 

[Kalv]

Kase looks like 37 year old Corey Perry