2023 NHL Entry Draft Discussion

[sting101]

a lot of contradictions on that list? They are comfortable projecting on a lot of guys and then not on others who lack size and strength? Some of them are within the same players write up.

A bit strange how they did that but it's good to read opinions i guess

early U18s report...

Have to like what Willander ASP Dower-Nilsson and Stenberg are doing for Sweden. Getting caught up as ive recorded the games. I'm not as excited about ASP as some of you but he can control the game at this level with a ton of room on a top team and is a top tier talent for sure. Willander is a sleeper too. Really smooth transition player and can really walk the offensive blue line. Shot needs some work though.

Dvorsky is a strong player but skating is definitely not a plus feature. Hands shot and strength are top10 but still have to wonder how much room he has to improve on his speed.

Really liking Wood and Dragicevic so far for Canada. I was down on these 2 a bit because of nasty looking skating but both have made huge strides and have massive potential with their packages of size and skill. Dragicevic in particular has impressed me from what i've seen lately. And to be clear i had been watching a bunch on these 2 leading up to this tourney after seeing some of the latest rankings so i'm building in some of that into what i've seen in the 2 games.

Nick Lardis ia an interesting player too he has a wicked shot and is one of those likely 2nd round guys that could become good goal scorers in the NHL if he can add enough strength to that frame. Barlow looks terrible so far his passing is abysmal.

Just a couple games and not gonna get too over the top as it's big ice and i could care less about all the PP points guys get other than showing creativity and skill. For context Virtanen looked very good in the U18s so i try to keep that in mind as teh time and space is still massive especially on this big ice.

Also the refereeing is pretty comical. It's almost at the point where you just tell the guys to not bother hitting at all and you would probably have more success.

 

[Canucks LB]

a lot of contradictions on that list? They are comfortable projecting on a lot of guys and then not on others who lack size and strength? Some of them are within the same players write up.

A bit strange how they did that but it's good to read opinions i guess

early U18s report...

Have to like what Willander ASP Dower-Nilsson and Stenberg are doing for Sweden. Getting caught up as ive recorded the games. I'm not as excited about ASP as some of you but he can control the game at this level with a ton of room on a top team and is a top tier talent for sure. Willander is a sleeper too. Really smooth transition player and can really walk the offensive blue line. Shot needs some work though.

Dvorsky is a strong player but skating is definitely not a plus feature. Hands shot and strength are top10 but still have to wonder how much room he has to improve on his speed.

Really liking Wood and Dragicevic so far for Canada. I was down on these 2 a bit because of nasty looking skating but both have made huge strides and have massive potential with their packages of size and skill. Dragicevic in particular has impressed me from what i've seen lately. And to be clear i had been watching a bunch on these 2 leading up to this tourney after seeing some of the latest rankings so i'm building in some of that into what i've seen in the 2 games.

Nick Lardis ia an interesting player too he has a wicked shot and is one of those likely 2nd round guys that could become good goal scorers in the NHL if he can add enough strength to that frame. Barlow looks terrible so far his passing is abysmal.

Just a couple games and not gonna get too over the top as it's big ice and i could care less about all the PP points guys get other than showing creativity and skill. For context Virtanen looked very good in the U18s so i try to keep that in mind as teh time and space is still massive especially on this big ice.

Also the refereeing is pretty comical. It's almost at the point where you just tell the guys to not bother hitting at all and you would probably have more success.

To clarify, Do you mean my list or the Article?

 

[sting101]

Not to get too caught up in it but this is what i mean

25 | Brayden Yager​

C | Moose Jaw (WHL) | 6-0 | 166 lbs | Shoots: R​

Sebastian High: It has been a difficult season for Yager, as he has dropped on just about every single board, and ours is no exception. Yager’s shot is a truly high-end tool. He generates great power and accuracy from a variety of releases and he doesn’t need much space to get them off. He has also built on his playmaking game a fair bit this season, flashing moments of impressive lane manipulation and passes through multiple layers of defense. He’s also a plus-level defensive player, dropping low in the defensive zone, scanning for threats, and fluidly switching assignments while keeping his stick in lanes. That said, his defensive game and goalscoring have both stagnated this season. The biggest concerns we have with his projection are his struggle to play through heavy physicality (we are far more concerned with his lack of physicality than with Benson, Cristall, or Perron, for instance) and his average skating and hockey sense. Yager is really slight, and he will need to either build out his frame and lower body significantly and/or develop his skating or hockey sense to be an adaptive tool to circumvent physical pressure. There is certainly second-line upside here, but there is also a possibility that Yager struggles in making the leap to the NHL.

1 - Difficult season? Hlinka was one of Canadas best players, Warriors are 2-2 with Winnipeg and his playoff has been excellent, Improved his playmaking immensely which was the criticism going into his year which they touched on, Improved his scoring by 25% yet?

2 - They highlight his defensive game accurately and then turn it into a negative saying it has stagnated? One of the reasons i love Yager is due to his 200ft game the fact he doesnt cheat which so many junior players do (ahem Cristall) and has not only taken the top match against the WHL's best but excelled at it. He fairly gets criticized for a lot of meh games but he's a bit like a Ryan Kesler in that against Savoie Bedard Danielson he's at his best and takes it up a couple notches.

3 - More concerned about physicality than Perron Cristall Brindley Cagnoni Gulyayev?? This one is confusing. I guess there just predicting he wont be able to gain as easily then? Idk. Anyhow it is a concern but most of these guys have this concern.

4 - And average skating?? Yager can fly. yes like all these guys he needs more endurance and power and consistency in his tempo but i just dont get this one at all he's upper tier for his peers and his first steps are what you want for todays NHL.

Anyway i'm with Malloy....kid looks like a potential steal if he falls like some are predicting

To clarify, Do you mean my list or the Article?

No the Dobberprospects list

 

[ChilliBilly]

That moment when the palyers being drafted are born after you graduated Highschool

how about not one player in the league playing drafted 20 years after you graduated?

 

[Raistlin]

i'm loving how ASP is shooting up the rankings.

I ask myself, why would canucks pick a D this draft? to fill a positional need.

why draft Reinbacher? To add size and defensive presence to the top 4.

why draft ASP? for puck movement, for PP, for RHD

fact is, we have enough of ASPs, the glaring need is a Reinbacher for the org. As long as ASP keeps this up through the U18, someone will move him ahead of a safe mid ceiling/high floor pick in Reinbacher.

I think if this team misses out on Reinbacher, its better to draft one of the Cs that drops. Its just so Canucks that halfway through the season we are talking about Bedard/Carlsson, then its Benson, then on draft day after the crap year we get ASP and pat ourselves in the back for getting exactly what we wanted.

 

[DFAC]

i'm loving how ASP is shooting up the rankings.

I ask myself, why would canucks pick a D this draft? to fill a positional need.

why draft Reinbacher? To add size and defensive presence to the top 4.

why draft ASP? for puck movement, for PP, for RHD

fact is, we have enough of ASPs, the glaring need is a Reinbacher for the org. As long as ASP keeps this up through the U18, someone will move him ahead of a safe mid ceiling/high floor pick in Reinbacher.

I think if this team misses out on Reinbacher, its better to draft one of the Cs that drops. Its just so Canucks that halfway through the season we are talking about Bedard/Carlsson, then its Benson, then on draft day after the crap year we get ASP and pat ourselves in the back for getting exactly what we wanted.

I get where youre coming from with the need for C or D but I think the Canucks most glaring need is an elite blue chip prospect… if thats a winger come draft then so be it. We should still be drafting BPA.

Eg. If a player like Benson falls due to his size concerns (very possible) to us, I will be furious is we pass on him for a C or D

 

[Raistlin]

fat chance Benson falls to 11. Someone was mentioning Pettersson's draft year in one of the threads, reminds me that year when NYR tried to do everything to move up to draft EP. Ended up moving Stepan and Raata to 7 and still missed him. In a fit of panic, drafted Lias Andersson and is still looking for that top end 2C to this day.

EP to Lias Andersson, thats how much these little decisions can change the course of your franchise. understand EP was expected to be drafted in the 6-9 hole in a "weak" year.

That is why everyone tanks. Not to win the lottery, its to simply get the guy you want. To get Reinbacher, who fits your needs to a tee, not to get the next best RHD or the next targeted blue chipper. Who knows if that guy will work out, all you know is that 10 scouting teams passed on him for their reasons.

 

[Raistlin]

edit* 7-10 hole. It was the top 4, Hischier/Patrick/Heiskanen/Makar,

then Glass/Vilardi.

 

[DFAC]

fat chance Benson falls to 11. Someone was mentioning Pettersson's draft year in one of the threads, reminds me that year when NYR tried to do everything to move up to draft EP. Ended up moving Stepan and Raata to 7 and still missed him. In a fit of panic, drafted Lias Andersson and is still looking for that top end 2C to this day.

EP to Lias Andersson, thats how much these little decisions can change the course of your franchise. understand EP was expected to be drafted in the 6-9 hole in a "weak" year.

That is why everyone tanks. Not to win the lottery, its to simply get the guy you want. To get Reinbacher, who fits your needs to a tee, not to get the next best RHD or the next targeted blue chipper. Who knows if that guy will work out, all you know is that 10 scouting teams passed on him for their reasons.

While I completely agree with the sentiment of tanking for a higher draft pick, I don't know if the NYR example really applies here. Sure they may have really liked EP but if they're scouting was better, they could found their high end Cs in Suzuki and Necas who were drafted a few picks later.

If anything, pickling Lias Andersson just seems like a massive scouting bust. There are always good players in the ~10 range, but your organization just has to be able to identify it (which Carolina and Vegas were able to do and NYR wasn't)

 

[Raistlin]

While I completely agree with the sentiment of tanking for a higher draft pick, I don't know if the NYR example really applies here. Sure they may have really liked EP but if they're scouting was better, they could found their high end Cs in Suzuki and Necas who were drafted a few picks later.

If anything, pickling Lias Andersson just seems like a massive scouting bust. There are always good players in the ~10 range, but your organization just has to be able to identify it (which Carolina and Vegas were able to do and NYR wasn't)

no doubt it was a scouting fail, but no one knew about Lias' mental illness that developed once he left Sweden. He was a bit of a reach, but not by much, the reason he failed was because they brought him in from SHL too early and didnt give him the right linemates to succeed with.

I think its very risky to pick ASP this year because we just need a RHD and we missed "our guy" in Reinbacher, so we jump to the other RHD with potential, even if there are better BPAs, esp Cs.

I dont have an issue with wingers, but this market is toxic AF. if they draft anotehr winger after Lekk, the media will eat him alive if he so makes a bad play.

 

[Vector]

While I’m a very vocal Reinbacher supporter, it’s entirely because I love players with his profile. Defencemen like him tend to be very underrated but worth a fortune as they develop. Much like in other sports (football and baseball most obviously) I strongly believe that some positions hold more value than. It’s not about all-things-being equal from the start as defenceman, particularly righties, and centre hold much more value than wingers. I also hold the same belief for types of players. Using Reinbacher as an example, one of the knocks on him is that he can’t quarterback a power play yet I don’t see that as a negative at all.

In general, I’m extremely wary of small offensive defencemen in the draft. Sometimes this makes me a damn fool (ex: Quinn Hughes). However, those are players that typically require lots of power play time and a specific role to be successful. Less tools to work with in order to be an NHLer.

It has to be said, I’m the furtherest thing from a professional scout. I’m not even an amateur. There are profiles that I’ve identified as being more commonly successful and just stick to those when evaluating players. So while I’ll be ecstatic if the Canucks draft Reinbacher, I’m not going to be all that upset if they go, or have to go, in a different direction.

 

[LemonSauceD]

ASP would be a fantastic pick. He’s a lot better than Drysdale was at the same age. He’s got top 4 written all over him.

We need to walk away with either Reinbacher or ASP. I do prefer Reinbacher due to his size but ASP seems like the higher potential defenseman.

 

[sting101]

Would love to take Egor Sidorov with one of our 3rd or 4th rounders. Kid has a shot and pretty good wheels

 

[Izzy Goodenough]

Not a Granlund in sight:

A right-handed defenceman the Canucks could pick in every round of the 2023 NHL Draft

The Vancouver Canucks enter this offseason with a few huge holes acros...

canucksarmy.com

 

[TryamkinPleaseReturn]

Would love to take Egor Sidorov with one of our 3rd or 4th rounders. Kid has a shot and pretty good wheels

Has good stats, passed over last year right? I would use one of those picks on him if he passes the eye test

 

[sting101]

Has good stats, passed over last year right? I would use one of those picks on him if he passes the eye test

Yes he was passed over last year but he also jumped from 35 pts to 76 with 40 goals in 5 less games. He's been impressive this playoff has a wicked release on his shot and is pretty quick as well. Caught my eye a few months ago when i did some Molendyk scouting.

Another Belorussian player like Klimovich who needed some time to learn the North American game and is making a mark right now that might pay off for someone willing to be patient

 

[Canucks LB]

I’m going to give my updated top 10 rankings soon, there’s at least one name that’s gonna be surprising for everybody.

I’ve been reluctant to have a tournament affect my opinion, too much, but I’ve been so impressed with somebody. Specifically, it’s time to make some noise.

 

[FlowMaster]

We need a RHD or a RHC with a complete game. This player should fit immediately in the roster after this season.

 

[canuckking1]

I'm Moore or bust tbh

 

[Izzy Goodenough]

Though Moore is a faster skater, Leonard appears to a more projectable NHL prospect than Moore:

 

[MarkusNaslund19]

And you are not taking into account there are 2 lottery spots. And I still think its a decent jump. And I suspect I would very much enjoy playing poker against you.

While I have never played for big money, I did win over $2000 US in a tournament at Caesars Palace. (53 players, I won the tourney, and there were some grinders playing). My only other time playing there I came in 7th out of 45. No money.

I really wish there was some way to redo the lottery so that playing well in the last 20 games (after the trade deadline) was rewarded. So teams like Chicago putting up basically a AHL squad wouldn't get a better shot at a getting a top player like Bedard.

I love that when someone brings up experience playing hockey as a reason that perhaps their insight might be more in-depth compared to someone who can't skate it gets poopooed on these boards. But please tell me more about your gambling and how that means you're an expert on the NHL draft.

 

[Canucks LB]

Here’s something interesting, I don’t know the value.

But I wonder if you could package every third rounder we have, with our first, and move up into the 7-8 Range.

And guarantee one of the stars.

 

[Luck 6]

Here’s something interesting, I don’t know the value.

But I wonder if you could package every third rounder we have, with our first, and move up into the 7-8 Range.

And guarantee one of the stars.

I think that’s pretty doubtful. Usually you can move up from 20s to 15 or so, but top 10 picks in deep drafts when premium prospects are guaranteed to be on the board won’t come cheap.

 

[ChilliBilly]

I love that when someone brings up experience playing hockey as a reason that perhaps their insight might be more in-depth compared to someone who can't skate it gets poopooed on these boards. But please tell me more about your gambling and how that means you're an expert on the NHL draft.

sarcasm noted. But I have won awards in math, and my arguments have been about the difference the draft position makes on your odds. Which is the same reason why I win at poker. And I don't gamble, other than some time buying lottery tickets. I will never play against the house. I play poker for entertainment, and as I stated, for the stuff I have tracked, I win.

I have played hockey on and off for over 60 years. I am not a great player, but decent enough that I have played with ex-NHLers and not totally embarrassed myself (13 of them I think).

And I am obviously not an expert on the draft. Didn't claim to be. I have simply stated two facts. Overplaying your top players to win meaningless games that lower your draft position is stupid. And that there is a serious difference between having say a 9% chance of moving up in the draft vs the 3% chance we presently hold. (double those numbers for the fact that the lottery is a double tap).

I have played, watched, coached and reffed hockey for a long long time. I am getting old ... okay I am old. I have never once claimed that I am better at judging players or teams. I just think that the Canucks have done a lot of dumb things in their 53 years, and none were worse than Benning's reign. And I freely express my opinion on those things, which is sort of the point of HF boards.

 

[PuckMunchkin]

I love that when someone brings up experience playing hockey as a reason that perhaps their insight might be more in-depth compared to someone who can't skate it gets poopooed on these boards. But please tell me more about your gambling and how that means you're an expert on the NHL draft.

Your takes are a pretty good example why that is.