WC: 2021 Czech Republic Roster Talk

[czechmate]

You do.. he skates like hell and coahces love him.

He played in top 6.. what was his best moment?

The previous 7 games he had a ten bell chance every game.. it's becuase he is a brilliant 4th liner. I'm not saying this to be mean. It's where he belongs. Top 6 in Euro leagues and bottom 6 for us. We benched Spacek and put him in top 6 and didn't score a goal. I need therapy after that move.

Last tourney.. Riha cut Zadina, benched Vrana and benched Chytil for the Zohorna's. This keeps happening.

This.

I don't think that Flek belongs in the top 6 too and obviously, benching Spacek is a foolish move, but you have to admit that Flek played his role very well. I don't expect a top 6 performance from a bottom 6 player. All I'm saying is that Flek delivered a well above-average "bottom 6 performance", he played up to his potential or at least visibly tried to do so.

 

[Czechboy]

This.

I don't think that Flek belongs in the top 6 too and obviously, benching Spacek is a foolish move, but you have to admit that Flek played his role very well. I don't expect a top 6 performance from a bottom 6 player. All I'm saying is that Flek delivered a well above-average "bottom 6 performance", he played up to his potential or at least visibly tried to do so.

Flek was amazing.. so was Smejkal. Zero argument.

To put it in NHL terms.. they are Jujhar Khaira and Patrick Russel. We sat RNH for them.

 

[Elias40]

[QUOTE = "Czechboy, post: 178492154, member: 301685"] Mám rád Pesana .. to je to nejhorší.

Jen si myslím, že byl ohromen a připravil linku komba .. Řekl jsem to před hrou.

Co mě trápí je to, že se mohou ukázat Švýcaři a Finové a OKAMŽITĚ vědí, co mají dělat a mít systém. Máme systém? Bývali jsme, ale co je to teď?

Vím, že se poseru na Pesana, ale je to proto, že dnes byl hloupý, obecně ho mám rád. Tato ztráta je však na něm.

Měl 8 exhibičních her, aby nás připravil ... měl pěkné liny jako Lenc / Stansky / Spacek a pak z nich vystřihl Spaceka? To je kokain ... Nenapadá mě jiný důvod. Lol

Totéž s Flkem a Smejkalem ... takový krásný pár 4. řady .. promiň, nepamatuji si, kdo byl ten třetí.

Totéž s Sekacem, který byl snakebiten, ale nakláněl led na druhou stranu a vytvářel šance. [/ QUOTE]

Pesan is a good coach for the league, not for a short tournament. You can lose 7-8 matches in the league due to your stupidity, but a maximum of one in the tournament. Sweden lost two and did not even advance to QF.

The congress in Breclav was in 2018 and there Pesan said that he had his playbook. All nationals team according to the playbook should play the same system. Is there a playbook and will we ever see Pesan's system?

 

[Czechboy]

[QUOTE = "Czechboy, post: 178492154, member: 301685"] Mám rád Pesana .. to je to nejhorší.

Jen si myslím, že byl ohromen a připravil linku komba .. Řekl jsem to před hrou.

Co mě trápí je to, že se mohou ukázat Švýcaři a Finové a OKAMŽITĚ vědí, co mají dělat a mít systém. Máme systém? Bývali jsme, ale co je to teď?

Vím, že se poseru na Pesana, ale je to proto, že dnes byl hloupý, obecně ho mám rád. Tato ztráta je však na něm.

Měl 8 exhibičních her, aby nás připravil ... měl pěkné liny jako Lenc / Stansky / Spacek a pak z nich vystřihl Spaceka? To je kokain ... Nenapadá mě jiný důvod. Lol

Totéž s Flkem a Smejkalem ... takový krásný pár 4. řady .. promiň, nepamatuji si, kdo byl ten třetí.

Totéž s Sekacem, který byl snakebiten, ale nakláněl led na druhou stranu a vytvářel šance. [/ QUOTE]

Pesan is a good coach for the league, not for a short tournament. You can lose 7-8 matches in the league due to your stupidity, but a maximum of one in the tournament. Sweden lost two and did not even advance to QF.

The congress in Breclav was in 2018 and there Pesan said that he had his playbook. All nationals team according to the playbook should play the same system. Is there a playbook and will we ever see Pesan's system?

FTR.. I love seeing my quotes in Czech. not sure why.

The playbook is based on an old boys club... they will punish creative players for not scoring and reward good skaters for skating (but never scoring).

Varada did at the Juniors with the best roster we've had in a decade.
Pesan did it here.

 

[Jablkon]

I agree BUT

Kovar for this tourney is good.

So is Chytil

So is Zohorna

So is Hanzl

My fear is that we cut big NHL Cs for guys like Kovar and Zohorna. FTR.. splitting up the Zohorna's and cutting one also seems to be Pesan outhinking himself.

We never won medal with such a weak C core. I like them too but I see them as 3rd or 4th WC centers, except for Chytil who is still too young (and maybe Spacek somewhen in the future). Ok, at best Kovar as 2nd one...
He probably overthought it but I just see it as a mission impossible anyway. Zacha and even Kampf would change that for sure

 

[Czechboy]

We never won medal with such a weak C core. I like them too but I see them as 3rd or 4th WC centers, except for Chytil who is still too young (and maybe Spacek somewhen in the future). Ok, at best Kovar as 2nd one...
He probably overthought it but I just see it as a mission impossible anyway. Zacha and even Kampf would change that for sure

I forgot Kampf.. he'll but cut too.lol

Now that I've seen Pesan flex his muscles... I'm genuinely worried.

 

[Czechboy]

THIS!!

We had some established and EXCELLENT lines.. we went back to the shitty ones

 

[Czechboy]

THIS!!

We had some established and EXCELLENT lines.. we went back to the shitty ones

I don't think I'll ever understand how of Spacek/Lenc/Stransky.. the one to get cut was Spacek??????? That is amazing to me. That's up there with Salak/Kovar/Stepanek over Pavelec or Barinka over Hejda.

 

[Elias40]

[QUOTE = "Czechboy, post: 178493077, member: 301685"] [MEDIA = twitter] 1400570982608297986 [/ MEDIA]

TENTO!!

Měli jsme několik zavedených a VÝBORNÝCH linek .. vrátili jsme se ke sračkám [/ QUOTE]

Hadamczik, Jandac or Riha had the same problems. The search for the right attack should end in the tournament after two or three matches. If this continues, the coach signals to the team that he does not know how to do it and transfers nervousness to the player. Experienced tournament coaches believe in their intuition, don't panic and believe what they do. Pesan is a novice, maybe this is the reason his strange decisions.

 

[maclean]

Že jedeme pro zlato? Byla to mediální masáž. Já to brzdil, bilancuje Pešán | Aktuálně.cz

Not a huge fan of some of the quotes coming out of Pešán.. He says he tried to put the brakes on the team's mood and atmosphere, that they were getting too excited about going for gold. Maybe he makes it sound worse than it was, but it seems like a bit of a defeatist attitude. Sure, it's good to stay realistic, but I wouldn't underestimate what that kind of excitement can do to boost a team.

He also says the reason he left out Špaček was to help the PK and defensive play, that there were too many offensive players and they needed to shore up defence. Considering we couldn't manage to score a goal, I'm not so sure about that logic.

 

[Czechboy]

were too many offensive players

We got shutout and he's talking about having too many offensive players.lol

Spacek was our best hidden scorer. Eg. the offence wasn't based on him in anyway but he kept sneaking in points (usually gorgeous assists). Every team needs a secondary scorer like him.

I know he doesn't PK but I don't recall him on the ice for that many goals against? Maybe I have a bias as I'm a big fan but was he that big a D liability?

 

[Goodman68]

I would like this to be the last tournament for Pešan as a coach. Unfortunately, the Czech Hockey Association has made him a person who will raise Czech hockey. So far, I've cheered for him and trusted him. Now he is an incompetent coach for me, who will match Hadamczik and his nomination of Barinka et al. to the Olympics.
I sincerely scare me that this coach will lead us to the next Olympics.

 

[Czechboy]

Je to katastrofa, říká Antoš k výsledkům českých reprezentačních výběrů

They both make really good points!

Antos points out that all 3 major tourneys this year (U18, U20 and WC) we finished 7th.

He mentions that there is no solution waiting it's a catastrophic decline and we're not digging out. I tend to agree because we just don't win anywhere (I blame the jerseys). Germans and Swiss have snuck in a medal here and there... eg germans at Olycmpis and here and both times without their best players.

The other point is also amazing because Pesan had so many games to develop combos and then just went with a brand new lineup and no one had chemistry at all. It was truly maddening.. he had so many good lines with experience and didn't use any of them..

Eg. Lenc/Spacek/Stansky had lots of games together. Flek/Hanzl/Smejkal were an excellent 4th line. Kubalik/Kovar/Zadina looked great.

I think he even messed with the D pairings... only consistent was Musil and Hronek.

8 exhibition games and 7 tournament games and he was still using a line blender.

 

[Czechboy]

I would like this to be the last tournament for Pešan as a coach. Unfortunately, the Czech Hockey Association has made him a person who will raise Czech hockey. So far, I've cheered for him and trusted him. Now he is an incompetent coach for me, who will match Hadamczik and his nomination of Barinka et al. to the Olympics.
I sincerely scare me that this coach will lead us to the next Olympics.

I like Pesan but he really left me with my head shaking here. The Spacek benching didn't even to occur to me as an option.

He was going with a nice youth movement and then reverted back and panicked.

I'm also terrified to see who he picks.. I know some of the Czechs don't like to hear this from me and I"m sorry, but that team should be all NHL. Not ONE Extraliga guy should be allowed withing 1000kms of China. Something tells me our 1C will be Kovar (which will bump out a Zacha, Faksa etc). Something tells me we will be cutting NHL D for someone in Europe. Same with the goalies...

I'm expecting at least 5 non NHL guys on the roster and then really weird combos. Eg. Kubalik and Vrana was a silly combo that lost all 3 games we tried it.. weren't the first 2 losses enough to realize they are better apart?

There is this constant Czechs know better than the rest of the world decision making that keeps backfiring...

Sitting NHL goalies in favor of Euro ones has failed everytime (Salak, Kovar, Bartosak, Francous, Stepanek)
Putting 4th line grinders like Flek in Top 6 and NHL forwards like Chytil to 3rd line has never worked (remember we benched both Chytil and Vrana last tournament)
Basing our Top 6 around a Euro based C like Kovar or Cervus has not worked.

To me the Olympic team should be blatanly obvious and should leave behind 2 or 3 good players but I think we'll probably leave behind 10 good players and then say 2010 and 1998 worked without our stars. Honeslty, those 2 gold medals have been to our detriment as it really shaped this mentality. When, in reality, the big difference for those golds was 2 unbelievable goalie performances.

I honestly think he had 2 many options and got totally overwhelmed. I still am not sure what kind of team he was going for? Eg. the Finns are clearly here to trap and win. Canada is running one line and dumping it in deep and skating like hell. Germans essentially play like the Finns. Russians were there to score (their coaching decision to bring in ringers never works, they need to stop that.. they sat a goalie with a .930 save percentage).

 

[Elias40]

Je to katastrofa, říká Antoš k výsledkům českých reprezentačních výběrů

They both make really good points!

Antos points out that all 3 major tourneys this year (U18, U20 and WC) we finished 7th.

He mentions that there is no solution waiting it's a catastrophic decline and we're not digging out. I tend to agree because we just don't win anywhere (I blame the jerseys). Germans and Swiss have snuck in a medal here and there... eg germans at Olycmpis and here and both times without their best players.

The other point is also amazing because Pesan had so many games to develop combos and then just went with a brand new lineup and no one had chemistry at all. It was truly maddening.. he had so many good lines with experience and didn't use any of them..

Eg. Lenc/Spacek/Stansky had lots of games together. Flek/Hanzl/Smejkal were an excellent 4th line. Kubalik/Kovar/Zadina looked great.

I think he even messed with the D pairings... only consistent was Musil and Hronek.

8 exhibition games and 7 tournament games and he was still using a line blender.

Antos describes what you and I do. But it does not come with up a solution to the problem. See how Finland took advantage of the profit as a tournament consultant in 2012. They took the money and hired 12 coaches paid by their hockey federation. When someone from TPS call that I need a coach for two weeks in September to teach the children some exercises, the coach will come to Turku for a fee. But the coach from the federation does not train for two weeks only small boys for TPS but also from the surrouding teams around Turku. This preserves quality and education not only in large teams but also small ones. So even a small clubs has the opportunity to capture world trends and train like the best in the worlds.

Czech reality? The association with Pesan made ten videos about a skills trainer named Pacina. He is a good person, he has the quality of something little boys can teach, but he is alone. And the czech federation has no idea like Finland. Do you see the difference? It's not all about money, it's about how you handle. If you have a vision and specific ideas and thoughts that can you apply, do it. I like Nordic hockey, not because they have great players and good results in youth and in the adult team. It impresses me to think about how to move my hockey forward. In the Czech Republic people responsible for solving problems only create new ones.

 

[Voodoozz]

I would like this to be the last tournament for Pešan as a coach. Unfortunately, the Czech Hockey Association has made him a person who will raise Czech hockey. So far, I've cheered for him and trusted him. Now he is an incompetent coach for me, who will match Hadamczik and his nomination of Barinka et al. to the Olympics.
I sincerely scare me that this coach will lead us to the next Olympics.

Let's not overreact. You don't call someone an incompetent coach based on 1 quarterfinal game, you just don't. I honestly don't get why there has been such a commotion after we lost the QF. We got the exact same result as we had gotten in the previous 7 tournaments - no medal. Whether you finish 4th or 7th makes zero difference in my mind.

We had a tough start to the championship, faced Russia and Switzerland in the first two days, we lost both games. After that every game was a must win for us to avoid elimination. We managed that and finished 3rd in the group stage. Then we weren't able to score a single goal in a playoff game, which already happened to us in the 'recent' past - 2017 0:3 vs Russia in QF. End of story.

It's a one game tournament, we lost that game. Yes you can speculate whether player A should have played over player B or player C over player E, but would that change the outcome of the quarterfinal ? Nobody knows.

I like Filip Pesan, he is willing to make his own decisions, whether they are popular or not with the media or Facebook/Twitter/Instagram/CT Sport experts. I liked the roster he picked - by far the least experienced team we have ever dressed but very skilled and talented - especially the forwards. They weren't able to win when it mattered most, but again that isn't anything new. Pesan is as good as any other coach before him who wasn't able to get a medal, be it Vujtek, Jandac or Riha.

Ultimately, winning a medal at the World Championship doesn't solve our problems. When we are able to produce at least 10-15 players for the NHL draft EVERY YEAR, ON REGULAR BASIS, then I'll be happy. Then the medals shall come...

 

[Czechboy]

Let's not overreact. You don't call someone an incompetent coach based on 1 quarterfinal game, you just don't. I honestly don't get why there has been such a commotion after we lost the QF. We got the exact same result as we had gotten in the previous 7 tournaments - no medal. Whether you finish 4th or 7th makes zero difference in my mind.

We had a tough start to the championship, faced Russia and Switzerland in two first two days, we lost both games. After that every game was a must win for us to avoid elimination. We managed that and finished 3rd in the group stage. Then we weren't able to score a single goal in a playoff game, which already happened to us in the 'recent' past - 2017 0:3 vs Russia in QF. End of story.

It's a one game tournament, we lost that game. Yes you can speculate whether player A should have played over player B or player C over player E, but would that change the outcome of the quarterfinal ? Nobody knows.

I like Filip Pesan, he is willing to make his own decisions, whether they are popular or not with the media or Facebook/Twitter/Instagram/CT Sport experts. I liked the roster he picked - by far the least experienced team we have ever dressed but very skilled and talented - especially the forwards. They weren't able to win when it mattered most, but again that isn't anything new. Pesan is as good as any other coach before him who wasn't able to get a medal, be it Vujtek, Jandac or Riha.

Ultimately, winning a medal at the World Championship doesn't solve our problems. When we are able to produce at least 10-15 players for the NHL draft EVERY YEAR, ON REGULAR BASIS, then I'll be happy. Then the medals shall come...

I think there are 2 things here....

1. we did lose a lot of quarters in a row but this was the best roster we've had a tourney since 2012. Eg. Sweden didn't even advance, barely any NHL players and only 2 NHL goalies (unless you count the Bob appearance as 3). This one was wide open a golden opportunity. Instead, the Germans cashed in on it.

2. we made it past the quarters last time (also with a strong team)

As far as coaching... we keep making silly decisions. If we win then fine but it's hard when we lose and you see one or two blatant coaching errors before the game even begins In this case that'd be coming up with brand new combinations and brining in guys that you healthy scratched for 5 straight games.

I agree... we don' tknow if we would've won if Spacek was in for instance. But it'd be nice to look at the lineup before the match and think 'yeah, this is our best possible chance'. I felt that way when I went to bed before the quarter.. then I woke up and saw the lines and couldn't believe it.lol

FTR... I like Pesan too but he screwed up.

You are right though... losing a 1 goal game in a quarter isn't awful. And you're also right, if he had won the whole thing it still wouldn't change the fact that Czech hockey is in trouble.

 

[Czechboy]

Antos describes what you and I do. But it does not come with up a solution to the problem. See how Finland took advantage of the profit as a tournament consultant in 2012. They took the money and hired 12 coaches paid by their hockey federation. When someone from TPS call that I need a coach for two weeks in September to teach the children some exercises, the coach will come to Turku for a fee. But the coach from the federation does not train for two weeks only small boys for TPS but also from the surrouding teams around Turku. This preserves quality and education not only in large teams but also small ones. So even a small clubs has the opportunity to capture world trends and train like the best in the worlds.

Czech reality? The association with Pesan made ten videos about a skills trainer named Pacina. He is a good person, he has the quality of something little boys can teach, but he is alone. And the czech federation has no idea like Finland. Do you see the difference? It's not all about money, it's about how you handle. If you have a vision and specific ideas and thoughts that can you apply, do it. I like Nordic hockey, not because they have great players and good results in youth and in the adult team. It impresses me to think about how to move my hockey forward. In the Czech Republic people responsible for solving problems only create new ones.

The lack of direction or planning is shocking.

It's even stranger because the Germans are clearly doing things right. 10 years ago.. both Finland and us hadn' tmedalled at the WJHC since 2005... Finland spun it around spectacularly! Why didn't we.. what did they do different?

Someone needs to either

A: use another countries bluepring (like Finland)
B: look at the Swedes, Finns and US programs and come up with a hybrid model of it
C: come up with a new solution that is entirely Czech that will get us out of this

 

[Voodoozz]

I'm gonna say the 2019 roster was by far the strongest we've had since like 2011. We had like 9 NHL forwards including Voracek nad Palat, 3 NHL defenseman and Francouz in net. Home crowd in Bratislava. That was the "year to win" imo.

 

[Czechboy]

I'm gonna say the 2019 roster was by far the strongest we've had since like 2011. We had like 9 NHL forwards including Voracek nad Palat, 3 NHL defenseman and Francouz in net. Home crowd in Bratislava. That was the "year to win" imo.

I agree but the competiiton in 2019 was much stronger than it was here. So we were stronger but so was everyone else.

FTR.. we also benched our NHLers from that team including Francouz.

I will say though (and I didn't like the roster decisions there) that Riha had a very distinct system going..

He had a scoring line from Day 1 that worked.
He was getting great secondary scoring from Kubalik and Kovar.
He had the Zohorna's agitating.. I think with Jaskin.

The lines were very identifiable.

Great team though...

Those NHLers and Kovar and Kubalik were scoring.

 

[Czechboy]

Antos describes what you and I do. But it does not come with up a solution to the problem. See how Finland took advantage of the profit as a tournament consultant in 2012. They took the money and hired 12 coaches paid by their hockey federation. When someone from TPS call that I need a coach for two weeks in September to teach the children some exercises, the coach will come to Turku for a fee. But the coach from the federation does not train for two weeks only small boys for TPS but also from the surrouding teams around Turku. This preserves quality and education not only in large teams but also small ones. So even a small clubs has the opportunity to capture world trends and train like the best in the worlds.

Czech reality? The association with Pesan made ten videos about a skills trainer named Pacina. He is a good person, he has the quality of something little boys can teach, but he is alone. And the czech federation has no idea like Finland. Do you see the difference? It's not all about money, it's about how you handle. If you have a vision and specific ideas and thoughts that can you apply, do it. I like Nordic hockey, not because they have great players and good results in youth and in the adult team. It impresses me to think about how to move my hockey forward. In the Czech Republic people responsible for solving problems only create new ones.

BTW.. you mentioned Necas somewhere today.. he's been outstanding... getting a tonne of minutes.

Elite passer and Elite skater but he also penalty kills.

he is going to be huge for us for the next decade:

 

[Elias40]

[QUOTE = "Czechboy, post: 178537129, člen: 301685"] BTW .. dnes jste někde zmínil Necase ... vyniká ... získává tunu minut.

Elitní přihrávka a elitní bruslař, ale také trestá zabití.

bude pro nás v příštím desetiletí obrovský:

[ATTACH = plný] 443699 [/ ATTACH] [/ QUOTE]

Yes it was in the thread about the Finnish team at the olympics. In Necas I see the greatest potential of young czech players. Carolina's coach deserves a lot of credit for that, Necas progress is incredible. I don't see so much potential with Zadina or Chytil, they will probably be stable NHl players, but nothing more.

 

[ORRFForever]

Flek was amazing.. so was Smejkal. Zero argument.

To put it in NHL terms.. they are Jujhar Khaira and Patrick Russel. We sat RNH for them.

Do you think the Czechs can ever get back to your past greatness or was splitting from Slovakia just too much of a step back?

 

[Czechboy]

Do you think the Czechs can ever get back to your past greatness or was splitting from Slovakia just too much of a step back?

We won a lot of gold after splitting from Slovakia. They had a few great tourneys as well!

I'm not sure.. it's all so streaky! I keep waiting to see some kind of consistency but every year is an adventure.

I blame the ugly jerseys.lol

We are like the Oilers.. just need 3 more players

 

[ORRFForever]

We won a lot of gold after splitting from Slovakia. They had a few great tourneys as well!

I'm not sure.. it's all so streaky! I keep waiting to see some kind of consistency but every year is an adventure.

I blame the ugly jerseys.lol

We are like the Oilers.. just need 3 more players

At least you are good natured about it.