Rumor: 2019-2020 Trade Rumours and Free Agent Discussion Version 7 | Post-Deadline Ed.

[McMetal]

So probably a good guy to be the #4 for a few years until Timmins is ready to take over.

Yeah. Once Byram gets established he will be the third LD on the depth chart and go from being a capable #4 to an elite #5. Or else maybe we move him to a team to be their #4 to rearrange assets. Either way, he's going to be a valuable player and is a real feather in the cap of Sakic and the pro scouts for turning a prospect swap into a top 4 D.

 

[Richard88]

I'll be curious to see how Graves does in the playoffs. Seeing him doing well after such a long break would give me hope for the next couple of years.

There's a lot of guys with a lot at stake in this playoff season heading into contract negotiations soon...

Burakovsky
Nichuskin
Zadorov
Graves
Jost
Kamenev
Nieto
Wilson
Grubauer

 

[henchman21]

Bigras’ first 25ish games for the Avs were very promising. His willingness to get crushed to make a play unfortunately started the concussion trend.

Yeah that played a role. He wasn't quick enough with his decisions and not enough skill to avoid some bad situations... which lead to concussion ville and it was done for. I think he will eventually catch on like a Cameron Guance... a 9/10D who gets called up once in a while and good team use as depth in their AHL org. Certainly not to our expectations of him.

 

[Freudian]

When I watch Graves, it seems to me like he gambles way too much but it's possible he's got good instincts because he doesn't get caught out too often.

If he can be a solid #4-5 for a while, Avs will have done well.

 

[Balthazar]

When I watch Graves, it seems to me like he gambles way too much but it's possible he's got good instincts because he doesn't get caught out too often.

If he can be a solid #4-5 for a while, Avs will have done well.

Thing is, you don't want your #4 or #5 dman to take wild gambles all the time.

That's the problem with Graves...you'd prefer him to be better on the PK and rock solid in the dzone than excelling in the way he plays the game now. He's good but he's sitting on the wrong chair.

 

[Pokecheque]

When I watch Graves, it seems to me like he gambles way too much but it's possible he's got good instincts because he doesn't get caught out too often.

If he can be a solid #4-5 for a while, Avs will have done well.

I think he was quite reckless to start, and AJ noted he was pretty lucky he didn't get burned a few times there. But I also think he's better when he plays aggressive, and I think turning him into a shot-blocker was a huge mistake.

EDIT: I used "I think" way too many times in this post...I think.

 

[henchman21]

Trying to turn Graves into Nemeth isn't going to work out. He's got enough offense and puck movement to his game that he isn't a liability there.. and we'd all like Makar to get more of that puck time, but Makar has the skating and mindset to let Graves to his thing. It isn't ideal, but frankly ideal isn't going to happen. If Byram-Makar end up being a pairing and Byram plays the way he does now, Makar will do more covering and have the puck less than he does with Graves.

 

[shadow1]

Unlike some other recent defensemen who've blown in and out of town, Graves doesn't have a big fatal flaw in his game. He's big, physical, can skate, sound positionally, and has offensive touch (9 goals and on pace for more than 30 points, 100% at even strength).

Where I think we'll see the Avs lose Graves down the road is if he prices himself out, or he's dealt for an upgrade after being pushed down the depth chart. Either way, I don't think his game will suddenly unravel.

 

[Foppa2118]

Unlike some other recent defensemen who've blown in and out of town, Graves doesn't have a big fatal flaw in his game. He's big, physical, can skate, sound positionally, and has offensive touch (9 goals and on pace for more than 30 points, 100% at even strength).

Where I think we'll see the Avs lose Graves down the road is if he prices himself out, or he's dealt for an upgrade after being pushed down the depth chart. Either way, I don't think his game will suddenly unravel.

Similar to Holden. Neither were sound all the time positionally, or in their coverage IMO though. That's their flaw. They also make puck mistakes and unforced turnovers every once in a while too.

 

[dahrougem2]

Unlike some other recent defensemen who've blown in and out of town, Graves doesn't have a big fatal flaw in his game. He's big, physical, can skate, sound positionally, and has offensive touch (9 goals and on pace for more than 30 points, 100% at even strength).

Where I think we'll see the Avs lose Graves down the road is if he prices himself out, or he's dealt for an upgrade after being pushed down the depth chart. Either way, I don't think his game will suddenly unravel.

A defensemen without a big, fatal flaw in his game is a top-3 type of defensemen.

Graves is a 3rd pairing defensemen to me.

 

[Hasbro]

When I watch Graves, it seems to me like he gambles way too much but it's possible he's got good instincts because he doesn't get caught out too often.

If he can be a solid #4-5 for a while, Avs will have done well.

And he is Bergeron catnip. Always the tantalizing possibility he'd overpay for him.

 

[Northern Avs Fan]

Unlike some other recent defensemen who've blown in and out of town, Graves doesn't have a big fatal flaw in his game. He's big, physical, can skate, sound positionally, and has offensive touch (9 goals and on pace for more than 30 points, 100% at even strength).

Where I think we'll see the Avs lose Graves down the road is if he prices himself out, or he's dealt for an upgrade after being pushed down the depth chart. Either way, I don't think his game will suddenly unravel.

I like Graves so I don’t want to take too much credit away from him, but his stats are always going to get a bit of a boost if he’s paired with Makar. He does have a good shot though and pretty good instincts on the pinch.

Agree on him pricing himself out of Colorado. If his stays at this level, or improves the Avs probably won’t be able to keep him beyond his next contract. Need to see more from him though to know what he’s going to be long term.

 

[Metallo]

Yeah that played a role. He wasn't quick enough with his decisions and not enough skill to avoid some bad situations... which lead to concussion ville and it was done for. I think he will eventually catch on like a Cameron Guance... a 9/10D who gets called up once in a while and good team use as depth in their AHL org. Certainly not to our expectations of him.

Just realized that Cameron Gaunce got a Stanley Cup ring (that got stolen) but didn’t even play one playoff game for the Pens. In fact he doesn’t even have a career NHL playoff game. Talk about giving out rings like candy.

 

[Hasbro]

I like Graves so I don’t want to take too much credit away from him, but his stats are always going to get a bit of a boost if he’s paired with Makar. He does have a good shot though and pretty good instincts on the pinch.

Agree on him pricing himself out of Colorado. If his stays at this level, or improves the Avs probably won’t be able to keep him beyond his next contract. Need to see more from him though to know what he’s going to be long term.

The Bergy be like:

 

[UncleRisto]

The Bergy be like:

It's a yolked grey-haired guy in a suit, this must be a live reaction.

 

[shadow1]

Similar to Holden. Neither were sound all the time positionally, or in their coverage IMO though. That's their flaw. They also make puck mistakes and unforced turnovers every once in a while too.

I would argue Holden's positioning was much, much worse. With the exception of Jack Johnson, I don't know if I've ever seen a full time NHL defenseman take more awkward positioning than Holden.

 

[shadow1]

A defensemen without a big, fatal flaw in his game is a top-3 type of defensemen.

Graves is a 3rd pairing defensemen to me.

I disagree. Some guys are just solid but aren't talented enough to be the star on the back end.

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

My money would be on losing Graves to expansion before we lose him to any contract related issues.


Make no mistake about it, the dude was a legit Top 4 Defender this past season. You dont put up almost 10 Goals and 30 points, and play ~19 minutes a night as a bottom pairing Defender.


But... With Girard and Makar certainly being protected in expansion, and tentatively EJ needing protection, as well as the unknown of Timmins expansion status, there's a pretty good chance Graves will be exposed for Seattle and I dont see how they dont take him, assuming he has another good year next year at least. You're looking at a big, mobile defender with a booming shot that can kill penalties, is solid defensively, and competent enough offensively to make his shot a legit weapon on the ice. That's a very valuable player(Oddly enough it is basically exactly what the Avs hoped Zadorov would develop into).

 

[schelstatic]

My money would be on losing Graves to expansion before we lose him to any contract related issues.


Make no mistake about it, the dude was a legit Top 4 Defender this past season. You dont put up almost 10 Goals and 30 points, and play ~19 minutes a night as a bottom pairing Defender.


But... With Girard and Makar certainly being protected in expansion, and tentatively EJ needing protection, as well as the unknown of Timmins expansion status, there's a pretty good chance Graves will be exposed for Seattle and I dont see how they dont take him, assuming he has another good year next year at least. You're looking at a big, mobile defender with a booming shot that can kill penalties, is solid defensively, and competent enough offensively to make his shot a legit weapon on the ice. That's a very valuable player(Oddly enough it is basically exactly what the Avs hoped Zadorov would develop into).

Probably a topic for another thread, but why are we not just protecting 8 skaters instead of 3 and 7? Mac, Rants and 5 defensemen if need be (Makar, Girard, Graves, Johnson, Timmins) and your choice of another forward (assuming we haven't already re-signed Landeskog. If Graves has another good year, I personally keep him over the remaining forwards as I believe they would be easier to replace.

 

[Richard88]

Probably a topic for another thread, but why are we not just protecting 8 skaters instead of 3 and 7? Mac, Rants and 5 defensemen if need be (Makar, Girard, Graves, Johnson, Timmins) and your choice of another forward (assuming we haven't already re-signed Landeskog. If Graves has another good year, I personally keep him over the remaining forwards as I believe they would be easier to replace.

Graves will be on our 3rd pair beyond 2021 (assuming Byram becomes a top 4 D). It's much easier to replace a 3rd pairing Dman than it is to replace a 2C like Kadri or young 60 point winger like Burakovsky. 7+3+1 seems like the obvious route to go.

I'm curious to see if Sakic ends up using the "UFA loophole" with Grubauer in order to effectively protect both our goalies. Basically protect Francouz, and expose Grubauer as an UFA, but then resign him on July 1st.

 

[henchman21]

I think Holden gets a lot of unfair hate... he wasn't great, but he has ended up having a solid career. Played in top 4 roles elsewhere and is liked by all the coaches he's played for. Graves is a bit better than Holden, but not extremely so. Right now, I think he is a good fit for this team and can buy the right time until Byram is ready for a top 4 role. And as @Pierce Hawthorne states, good expansion fodder (Compher and Frank are too though).

 

[Hasbro]

It will be an act of supreme negligence to not request EJ waive his NMC for the expansion draft. Seattle won't have any desire for EJ over JTC, Donskoi or Jost.

It should be an easy sell to EJ. Promise not to buy him out, he keeps a shot at getting his name on the Cup and at least one guy in the locker room (Graves) is happy he kept him on the team.

 

[Balthazar]

I don't mind losing Graves to Seattle but I'm not sure they'd pick him if he's one year away from becoming UFA which is likely to be the case.

 

[schelstatic]

Graves will be on our 3rd pair beyond 2021 (assuming Byram becomes a top 4 D). It's much easier to replace a 3rd pairing Dman than it is to replace a 2C like Kadri or young 60 point winger like Burakovsky. 7+3+1 seems like the obvious route to go.

I'm curious to see if Sakic ends up using the "UFA loophole" with Grubauer in order to effectively protect both our goalies. Basically protect Francouz, and expose Grubauer as an UFA, but then resign him on July 1st.

For me personally, I keep Graves over I year of Kadri. Burakovsky I can see an argument for, but I would still keep Graves if he puts in another season like last year. I valued his contribution to the team more than I did for Burakovsky.

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

Probably a topic for another thread, but why are we not just protecting 8 skaters instead of 3 and 7? Mac, Rants and 5 defensemen if need be (Makar, Girard, Graves, Johnson, Timmins) and your choice of another forward (assuming we haven't already re-signed Landeskog. If Graves has another good year, I personally keep him over the remaining forwards as I believe they would be easier to replace.

It could be a possibility I guess... Though they probably go 4 and 4 rather than 5D and 3F.

Kadri will certainly be protected, Landeskog will also.


Nate
Mikko
Gabe
Kadri



Makar
Girard
EJ
Graves/Timmins



Could very well prove to be the direction they ultimately go in. Though in that situation you're potentially exposing a very good Burakovsky, but that may not be a bad thing depending on his performance next season and his contract situation.



But we also have to account for any potential UFA signings this summer as well.


Long story short. We're gonna lose a pretty good player this time around with expansion. But they can only take 1 player which is the nice thing.


Also worth noting that Francouz or Gruby will be exposed as well. Seattle could very well go in that direction as well.