Rumor: 2019-2020 Trade Rumours and Free Agent Discussion Part 2

[flyfysher]

Yes it’s a new season, but we’re seeing the exact issues that plagued him since season 1.

He’s just a bad fit with the Avs, he needs to be on a team that can creat more space for him.

I'd agree but Jost improved his play last season after being recalled from the AHL. That is something Kerfoot did not do. I'm not saying Jost should be retained especially if he's dropped to 3C because of competition from Compher, Bowers, Kamenev and Newhook. Nor am I saying he has to stick with the Avs for the entire season. But a couple of months (early-mid December) should reveal where Jost's play is headed and that's plenty of time to work out a trade if need be.

 

[henchman21]

So during Bob’s worst stretch of the season he played at a .901 sv%. Blue Jackets team save percentage this year is .885. So even awful Bobrovsky is an extreme upgrade. The Bobrovsky who carried them to the playoffs is Vezina caliber.

I don’t blame Columbus for not managing to get him extended. His contract is downright ugly. But so is their current goaltending situation. Their current goaltending can’t hold a candle next to Bobrovsky at his worst. They counted on him to carry them into the playoffs. They’ve since lost him and two other super stars.

If you don’t think their current goaltending is a downgrade on the last few years I’m out of words for you.

Korpisalo and Bob were the exact same level goalie until Bob played well down the stretch. Bob was actually worse than that at points... a lot worse. If we want to play the small sample size game on this year... the .885 is .015 up on Bob's.

I agree it is down from previous seasons, but from last year it is not down. He was downright terrible for well over half the season.

 

[Cousin Eddie]

Korpisalo and Bob were the exact same level goalie until Bob played well down the stretch. Bob was actually worse than that at points... a lot worse. If we want to play the small sample size game on this year... the .885 is .015 up on Bob's.

I agree it is down from previous seasons, but from last year it is not down. He was downright terrible for well over half the season.

Bobrovsky’s play this season has absolutely nothing to do with Columbus.

Without that final stretch from Bob the Jackets don’t sniff playoffs. So yeah Korpisalo brought similar play to Bob for a chunk of the season but if Korpisalo was that guy down that stretch he doesn’t bring that elite streak Bob brought so they don’t sniff playoffs. So whether you want to use that as a positive or a negative on Bob is up to you.

- Without that stretch of elite goaltending the Jackets aren’t a playoff team. They’ve since also lost Duchene and Panarin.

- With that stretch of goaltending the Jackets snuck into the playoffs by 2 points. They’ve since lost Duchene, Panarin and that goaltender that brought them that stretch.

Paint whichever of those narratives you want, the point still stands.

 

[henchman21]

Bobrovsky’s play this season has absolutely nothing to do with Columbus.

Without that final stretch from Bob the Jackets don’t sniff playoffs. So yeah Korpisalo brought similar play to Bob for a chunk of the season but if Korpisalo was that guy down that stretch he doesn’t bring that elite streak Bob brought so they don’t sniff playoffs. So whether you want to use that as a positive or a negative on Bob is up to you.

- Without that stretch of elite goaltending the Jackets aren’t a playoff team. They’ve since also lost Duchene and Panarin.

- With that stretch of goaltending the Jackets snuck into the playoffs by 2 points. They’ve since lost Duchene, Panarin and that goaltender that brought them that stretch.

Paint whichever of those narratives you want, the point still stands.

If the Jackets get average goaltending the first half of the season, they don't need the final push. That's my point. They don't need Vezina level goaltending, they just need average or near it. Last year, as a whole, they didn't get average goaltending and still made the playoffs.

They aren't going to replace Bread easily. It just isn't going to happen. Replacing 23 games of Duchene isn't the hurdle you're making it out to be.

 

[Cousin Eddie]

If the Jackets get average goaltending the first half of the season, they don't need the final push. That's my point. They don't need Vezina level goaltending, they just need average or near it. Last year, as a whole, they didn't get average goaltending and still made the playoffs.

They aren't going to replace Bread easily. It just isn't going to happen. Replacing 23 games of Duchene isn't the hurdle you're making it out to be.

The Jackets did get average goaltending though. 16th in the league.

The issue is that Bobrovsky is why it was average. Korpisalo was below .900 why Bob was .913 and lead the entire league with 9 shutouts.

The year prior Bobrovsky was .921 was Korpisalo was once again below .900.

Bobrovsky is no longer there and Korpisalo is their starter.

I’m done arguing. If you think Korpisalo and Elvis can provide was Bobrovsky has, again I’m lost for words.

 

[Cousin Eddie]

How would you Gus perceive Ryan Suter’s trade value? Negative? Neutral? Still holds value?

Contract is an albatross but holy hell what a partner that would be a for Makar. Avs wouldn’t be stuck with any type of recapture if he retires either.

 

[Balthazar]

The first is Josh Anderson. Bednar loves him. He does all the things I like. Still young, RFA. It’s pretty self explanatory.

He's more than likely untouchable but he's exactly the player we'd want to take the next step. He's a friggin' beast, especially in the playoffs.

 

[Cousin Eddie]

He's more than likely untouchable but he's exactly the player we'd want to take the next step. He's a friggin' beast, especially in the playoffs.

One long RFA process already went somewhat sideways. He’s due for another contract next summer. I wouldn’t be shocked if was potential trade bait.

And yes he’s a f***ing beast. One of my many man crushes and he’s probably the closest thing (though still nowhere close) to Tom Wilson (my number 1 man crush) in the NHL.

 

[Balthazar]

One long RFA process already went somewhat sideways. He’s due for another contract next summer. I wouldn’t be shocked if was potential trade bait.

And yes he’s a ****ing beast. One of my many man crushes and he’s probably the closest thing (though still nowhere close) to Tom Wilson (my number 1 man crush) in the NHL.

I wonder how much value Sakic sees in this kind of player. He did make an offer to Ferland last summer so he's obviously aware.

GM's see how the last 2 cups were won. Caps = heaviest team in the NHL w/ Wilson punishing everyone then Blues being overly physical w/ Berube going for "old style hockey".

 

[Foppa2118]

Actually the difference is in the criticism. When we saw 'Meh type play' from both players, our commentary was essentially,

Kerfoot is a bad player. Trade him.
Jost is a horrible player and human being! Draw and quarter him!

Just kidding. But part of the criticism is the position that Jost was drafted at and his failure to break out so far despite repeated chances so I get where people are coming from.

Except no one reacted this way to Siemens being drafted 11th, and he was a much worse pick.

 

[Cousin Eddie]

I wonder how much value Sakic sees in this kind of player. He did make an offer to Ferland last summer so he's obviously aware.

GM's obviously see how the last 2 cup were won. Caps = heaviest team in the NHL w/ Wilson punishing everyone then Blues being overly physical w/ Berube going for "old style hockey".

Bednar f***ing loves him. Remember him being interviewed about coaching him in the AHL. Bednar is smart. Sakic is smart. They know what this team needs. The Columbus history is there. I think it’s a real fit.

 

[hockeyviking]

How would you Gus perceive Ryan Suter’s trade value? Negative? Neutral? Still holds value?

Contract is an albatross but holy hell what a partner that would be a for Makar. Avs wouldn’t be stuck with any type of recapture if he retires either.

He wont play the 3 last years they pay 2/1/1 millions....

 

[flyfysher]

Except no one reacted this way to Siemens being drafted 11th, and he was a much worse pick.

Yeah, but no one was willing to badmouth Siemens like Jost because he's one big mean dude with an attitude and hands of stone and it wasn't beyond imagination that he might come teach his critic a lesson.

 

[Pokecheque]

Except no one reacted this way to Siemens being drafted 11th, and he was a much worse pick.

Kinda hard to criticize a player when you never see him play. Of course he was a bad pick, but everyone kinda knew that from the onset.

 

[Foppa2118]

Kinda hard to criticize a player when you never see him play. Of course he was a bad pick, but everyone kinda knew that from the onset.

No, Siemens had some doubters, but he had more people hyping him up along with Elliott as a future pairing that would play a big part for the Avs, who were desperate for defenseman. It wasn't until later that most realized Siemens was picked too high.

Plenty of people saw him play, and he played in the NHL. Even if a high pick never plays in the NHL, that wouldn't cause people to be less negative about them than someone they did see play in the NHL. That would cause people to be more negative because they didn't play in the NHL.

 

[shadow1]

How would you Gus perceive Ryan Suter’s trade value? Negative? Neutral? Still holds value?

Contract is an albatross but holy hell what a partner that would be a for Makar. Avs wouldn’t be stuck with any type of recapture if he retires either.

Suter is clearly better than any of Colorado’s defensemen, but I don’t think the Avs can chance it due to his age.

The man turns 35 in two months, and though he doesn’t look like he’s slowing down, he probably will at some point in the next (5)+ seasons.

If Colorado continues to look like a cup contender, I’d be down for them splurging on a high end defenseman - just as long as it’s someone younger, though.

 

[Cousin Eddie]

Nico Hischier makes 1M more than Nathan Mackinnon

 

[Gatorbait19]

They are going to be close to a playoff team, if not a playoff team this year. I think people see what they spent and think they sent their best prospects away. They kept Foudy, Texier, Bemstrom, Marchenko, Gavrikov, Tarasov, and Elvis. Who are all better than anybody they gave up, they gave up a 1st, a couple 2nds, late picks, and some prospects who were lost in the shuffle there. Personally I'd take Texier over any Avs' forward prospect and Bemstrom would be right up there with Newhook for me. Elvis has to adjust to NA ice, but he's been the best goalie outside of the NHL for a bit now. Marchenko is a boom or bust sort of player, but there are not many 6'3" forwards with his skating/hands combo. They are an excellent team at finding depth in the draft too. Hjorth this past year will prove to be a steal

I think they’ll be close, but fall short. Even if they make it though they’ll get swept outta the first round.

And while they didn’t send out any of their top prospects, losing panarin, bob and Duchene for nothing is a killer.

 

[henchman21]

Kinda hard to criticize a player when you never see him play. Of course he was a bad pick, but everyone kinda knew that from the onset.

Yeah his 'offense' was purely a product of Elliott in his draft year. There was a lot of hope he'd put it all together, but that dwindled with each passing year. Most anybody really hoped for after his first pro year was a guy who could partner a much better player in the top 4, and that was really a fool's errand. Some semblance of skill is needed in today's NHL from defensemen... and he literally had none. Also never a good sign when a +1 player gets their leadership stripped.

 

[Pokecheque]

No, Siemens had some doubters, but he had more people hyping him up along with Elliott as a future pairing that would play a big part for the Avs, who were desperate for defenseman. It wasn't until later that most realized Siemens was picked too high.

Plenty of people saw him play, and he played in the NHL. Even if a high pick never plays in the NHL, that wouldn't cause people to be less negative about them than someone they did see play in the NHL. That would cause people to be more negative because they didn't play in the NHL.

I just don't think the reaction was quite as visceral or extreme as you're seeing with Jost because Siemens was shuttered away in the minors. Also, Siemens got two pretty major injuries his first two years in the pros, so he had that excuse going for him. And yeah, I know Jost has been hurt too, but bottom line we held out a little more hope for Siemens because we were not seeing the failure firsthand.

Oh, and also, it makes a big difference, fair or not, that Siemens had both size and speed. Jost does not.

 

[AllAboutAvs]

Yeah his 'offense' was purely a product of Elliott in his draft year. There was a lot of hope he'd put it all together, but that dwindled with each passing year. Most anybody really hoped for after his first pro year was a guy who could partner a much better player in the top 4, and that was really a fool's errand. Some semblance of skill is needed in today's NHL from defensemen... and he literally had none. Also never a good sign when a +1 player gets their leadership stripped.

Let's blame Elliott for making Siemens look good and fooling the Avs into thinking he was worth a #11 overall pick. Well ok...let's blame the Avs' scouts as well for not seeing it through the smoke screen.

 

[henchman21]

Let's blame Elliott for making Siemens look good and fooling the Avs into thinking he was worth a #11 overall pick. Well ok...let's blame the Avs' scouts as well for not seeing it through the smoke screen.

I'm certainly not the person to defend Avs' amateur scouting.

 

[Eltuna]

It’s a shame Zacha has started out playing really well for the Devils I’ve never really liked the Jost for Puljujarvi tradethat often heat floated around here but have always wanted a Jost for Zacha trade, he has all the makings of a great 3C one day.

 

[Cousin Eddie]

It’s a shame Zacha has started out playing really well for the Devils I’ve never really liked the Jost for Puljujarvi tradethat often heat floated around here but have always wanted a Jost for Zacha trade, he has all the makings of a great 3C one day.

Not sure if anything’s changed but his attitude as a teenager was the worst. Tony DeAngelo who has forever been criticized for his attitude was a treat in Sarnia compared to Zacha.

 

[henchman21]

Not sure if anything’s changed but his attitude as a teenager was the worst. Tony DeAngelo who has forever been criticized for his attitude was a treat in Sarnia compared to Zacha.

Throw in an awesome helicopter parent too!