Speculation: 2019-2020 Sharks Roster Discussion Part 8

[The Ice Hockey Dude]

Vlasic’s contract is looking more and more like the worst in the league.

i wanted to trade him this past off season.

 

[rangerssharks414]

Vlasic’s contract is looking more and more like the worst in the league.

Not gonna lie... I was thinking about this the other day.

 

[Pistol Pete]

Vlasic strikes me as a very proud guy. If there’s any chance of getting him to waive his NMC, they need to start cutting down on his ice time, no more PP time, and maybe give him a healthy scratch if he keeps playing so poorly.

 

[Lebanezer]

 

[LA Shark]

A 4th and Nick Ebert

 

[KirbyDots]

Before anyone says we should have acquired him, he's not what we need, we need a top 6 and hopefully a good one. This may lessen the likelihood that Kreider is traded, unless the Rags are out by the deadline.

 

[hohosaregood]

Also for all the valid concerns about having a replacement level player in the top-6, it’s worth noting that St. Louis just won a Cup rotating replacement level players in Sammy Blais and Zach Sanford on the left wing of their 2nd line. Both of those guys are not any better than Barclay Goodrow. So while it’s a legit issue, it’s something that a well-coached and well-built team can overcome, and it’s not an automatic excuse for failure.

Agreed. There's so much proof out there that a well structured system can overcome a lot of flaws in their roster. I mean, just look at Arizona over the last decade. They've never had a good team but Tippett and Tocchet have pushed these teams into the playoff bubble in several years which is arguably way higher than they had any right to be. The team we have, despite the flaws, should be playoff contender at the very least.

 

[Negatively Positive]

Vlasic proved in the playoffs he can still play. He's just lazy and gives no effort in the regular season now. He got injured in game 2 against Vegas and they lost that game along with games 3 and 4 that he missed. They were 4-0 in the games that he played fully. He was also a big part in slowing down Mackinnon. Do you want Dillon or Simek tasked with shutting down Mackinnon? The problem is the Sharks don't have the depth this year for anyone let alone a dude making 7 mill and supposed to be the shutdown guy to take the regular season off. Couture and Vlasic can't turn it on for the playoffs if they don't make the playoffs.

 

[fasterthanlight]

I think you have to separate Vlasic and Burns until Vlasic starts to get his stuff together.

Ferraro-Burns
Dillon-Karlsson
Vlasic-whoever right now it would be Carrick

I think that could be a really good pairing

 

[Doctor Soraluce]

WTF... that is some stupid shit right there. Yourtalkin is about the only forward who is actually playing any defense in his own zone and covering for the D-men that pinch and get caught out of position.

 

[Coily]

Someone should tell Dregs that Grammarly is on mobile and desktop...

 

[tiburon12]

Someone should tell Dregs that Grammarly is on mobile and desktop...

I laughed pretty hard at this, but then saw what Dregs posted. Not sure if it's my phone or my big thumbs, but i add periods unintentionally all. the time in texts

 

[Gecklund]

Apparently Dallas fans are trying to move Benn. Would you do Vlasic for Benn?

 

[Fistfullofbeer]

Apparently Dallas fans are trying to move Benn. Would you do Vlasic for Benn?

I want to know what is up with that. Did he really get that bad that fast?

 

[FunkyPhin]

I want to know what is up with that. Did he really get that bad that fast?

It's a tough call, Last year seemed like a bad year and a trend downwards, although he was also a season removed from being a close to PPG but 9.5 million for 6 more years compared to Vlasic at 7 at 7? It's a tough choice. I'd rather roll the dice on Benn than keep Vlasic.

 

[tiburon12]

I want to know what is up with that. Did he really get that bad that fast?

I can't pretend that i've watch much Stars hockey over the last few years, but when i have, Benn has been pretty unremarkable. He doesnt seem to drive play anymore and certainly isnt worth his contract.

We joke that Vlasic may have the worst contract, but i think it's Benn

 

[Alwalys]

we are a joke to him.

 

[TomasHertlsRooster]

I can't pretend that i've watch much Stars hockey over the last few years, but when i have, Benn has been pretty unremarkable. He doesnt seem to drive play anymore and certainly isnt worth his contract.

We joke that Vlasic may have the worst contract, but i think it's Benn

Vlasic’s contract is far worse than Benn’s. Benn is still a better player now and he’s got 6 years left, from ages 30 through 35, where as Vlasic has 7 years left from ages 32 through 38. Benn’s cap hit is $2.5M higher than Vlasic’s but that doesn’t offset the difference.

 

[Sharksfan83]

Vlasic’s contract is far worse than Benn’s. Benn is still a better player now and he’s got 6 years left, from ages 30 through 35, where as Vlasic has 7 years left from ages 32 through 38. Benn’s cap hit is $2.5M higher than Vlasic’s but that doesn’t offset the difference.

I don't know much about Benn right now, I only watch the Sharks, but if Vlasic can play like he did in the playoffs (80% of them) then he's still legit worth 5million of his contract. He just doesn't seem engaged at all.

 

[Barrie22]

Also for all the valid concerns about having a replacement level player in the top-6, it’s worth noting that St. Louis just won a Cup rotating replacement level players in Sammy Blais and Zach Sanford on the left wing of their 2nd line. Both of those guys are not any better than Barclay Goodrow. So while it’s a legit issue, it’s something that a well-coached and well-built team can overcome, and it’s not an automatic excuse for failure.

Easier to find the good coach at this point in the season.

 

[Gunnin54]

I wish we would’ve got Q

 

[SjMilhouse]

i thought this was just a shark chart til i took a second glance and saw Faska there, sandwiched between 4 sharks


while i agree with your premise, i do believe that the relationship between coach-player is significantly underrated around here, sitting behind a computer screens posting lines based on corsi and puck possessions is fine and dandy when you dont have to manage players feelings, emotions and interact with them day to day. Not accounting for these issues and just running the a corsi based lineup may work for a few games, but will lead to negative consequences as the season goes on

and while criticism for dismissing opinions because they arent "hockey people" is warranted, recently the analytic/twitter/reddit/numbers community have based alot of their questions using numbers only, without considering the human interactions that occur and can effect those numbers. "hockey guys" tend to understand the interactions having been in those situations on the opposite side. a blend is needed to effectively construct a lineup IMO. Which is why some teams have an analytics department, but dont take everything the say and recommend.

You literally can't disagree or have a different opinion than the twitter/reddit/HF analytics crowd. It's only "the numbers say this, you are wrong". There is 0 nuance so why even bother.

You can full on agree with the general premise, but any contrary opinion is met with "well look at this other obscure as statistic we created a year ago. Oh don't like that? Well what about this persons shots/60 in a home sweater at an away game adjusted for venue and score effects while the moon is on it's down cycle"

 

[WTFetus]

Vlasic’s contract is far worse than Benn’s. Benn is still a better player now and he’s got 6 years left, from ages 30 through 35, where as Vlasic has 7 years left from ages 32 through 38. Benn’s cap hit is $2.5M higher than Vlasic’s but that doesn’t offset the difference.

While I agree that Benn is better than Vlasic and would do that trade, age is a really bad argument. You can't compare a defenseman to a forward. Not to mention Vlasic's style compared to Benn's.

 

[Doctor Soraluce]

You literally can't disagree or have a different opinion than the twitter/reddit/HF analytics crowd. It's only "the numbers say this, you are wrong". There is 0 nuance so why even bother.

You can full on agree with the general premise, but any contrary opinion is met with "well look at this other obscure as statistic we created a year ago. Oh don't like that? Well what about this persons shots/60 in a home sweater at an away game adjusted for venue and score effects while the moon is on it's down cycle"

Quite often the "only numbers" argument thing is made by people who have zero to minimal experience in the actual sport, team athletics, a team oriented workplace, life experience working with a variety of different people and personalities, etc... Sample sizes also vary or are too small to be definitive yet are thrown up as gospel. Something to consider... Scotty Bowman won on every team he coached before analytics. Going to take someone a long time to ever catch him and that's even with the benefit of modern analytics. Of the top 4 sports, hockey might be the most dependent on a players self confidence. All the skill in the world can't overcome self doubt or a bad day in Hockey. Coaches with a good grasp of psychology would seem to have an advantage. Then having a good analytics person would help confirm or deny trends that the coach sees. Knowing when to throw a player out there, especially one who's been struggling, is the "feel" or "hunch" part of managing players. For example, why did PDB throw Goody out suddenly after benching the majority of game 7 against Vegas? Could be blind luck, but maybe he or one of the other coaches saw something in his demeanor on the bench. You can tell a lot watching your players on a bench.

 

[TomasHertlsRooster]

While I agree that Benn is better than Vlasic and would do that trade, age is a really bad argument. You can't compare a defenseman to a forward. Not to mention Vlasic's style compared to Benn's.

It’s not a bad argument at all. If you look at the research that has been done on player aging curves, you’re getting a ton more value out of a guy from the age of 30-35 than you are from 32-38. Their positions and style of play may offset that to some degree but in no way is it a bad argument.