Salary Cap: 2019-20 - Leafs Salary Cap issues and adjustments?

[Menzinger]

You still don't understand why Marleau was signed?

I understand why Marleau was signed.

That doesn't make his contract any less terrible

 

[Advanced stats]

Fact: The Leafs just had 3 consecutive opportunities to go deep in the playoffs while their youth were still on ELCs fortified with experienced (expensive) vets and couldn't make it happen. If you think things get easier from this point on, you're in denial. Matthews and co. are now the team's expensive leadership fortified by cheap support that doesn't consist of young superstar talent.

Literally all of our core is still developing though. They'll all get better and learn what it takes to win.

 

[Mr Hockey]

I understand why Marleau was signed.

That doesn't make his contract any less terrible

the contract was fine until Tavares fell into the Leafs laps and Marleau/contract will be gone next summer, no big deal. The team still a few years away from peaking

 

[Throw More Waffles]

The contracts Dubas is giving out are so horrendous that I’m starting to wonder if some grand conspiracy is occurring.

Like... maybe Dubas has intentionally destroyed the whole rfa contract situation in the nhl in order to unite the owners in locking out the players next year when the cba expires.

If Marner makes even ONE PENNY more than Rantanen, I think Dubas should be flat out investigated.

 

[Stamkos4life]

Personally I would rather be in the Leafs cap crunch then those teams. At least we are forecasting success and putting ourselves in a position to pay fairly for a team that is winning now. I don't want to be paying players higher salaries later for what they accomplished already. Everyone has to believe the cap will continue to rise over the next 5-6 years. If it does, the contracts signed will be nothing compared to what others will be signing.

Paying players a large sum into the twilight of their careers where they no longer produce at what they are paid is not a position the Leafs want to get in. Once we have Marleau off the books we wont have a player that fits that description and that is a great thing for a contending team. Regardless of how you slice it.

You'd rather be in our position than Pittsburgh or Chicago who have won multiple cups?

 

[GoonieFace]

Personally I would rather be in the Leafs cap crunch then those teams. At least we are forecasting success and putting ourselves in a position to pay fairly for a team that is winning now. I don't want to be paying players higher salaries later for what they accomplished already. Everyone has to believe the cap will continue to rise over the next 5-6 years. If it does, the contracts signed will be nothing compared to what others will be signing.

Paying players a large sum into the twilight of their careers where they no longer produce at what they are paid is not a position the Leafs want to get in. Once we have Marleau off the books we wont have a player that fits that description and that is a great thing for a contending team. Regardless of how you slice it.

The problem is that nobody knows if Marner/Matthews and Tavares are capable of being the guys to win a cup. Those other teams already had success and are paying for it dearly now. We are paying dearly, and as of yet have nothing to show for it.

 

[Advanced stats]

2Cs, 1D 1G and 6 total A list players who eat sleep and dream hockey to win and you get a Cup. That was Scotty's thing. At this point we have Tavares, Matty and Marner. We are close with Rielly, Freddy and one more still needed.

Who's Scotty?

And Rielly and Andersen are 100% A list already.

They'll finish top 5 for Norris/Veniza voting.

 

[Mr Hockey]

The contracts Dubas is giving out are so horrendous that I’m starting to wonder if some grand conspiracy is occurring.

Like... maybe Dubas has intentionally destroyed the whole rfa contract situation in the nhl in order to unite the owners in locking out the players next year when the cba expires.

If Marner makes even ONE PENNY more than Rantanen, I think Dubas should be flat out investigated.

Do you actually think Rantanen will sign before Marner?

 

[Legion34]

You'd rather be in our position than Pittsburgh or Chicago who have won multiple cups?

UMmmm yes?
Past success has nothing to do with next year. Going forward the leafs have a better younger core........

 

[BoredBrandonPridham]

You'd rather be in our position than Pittsburgh or Chicago who have won multiple cups?

It's about the journey, friend. I don't want to sit around and just remember a cup, I want to experience the journey to a cup. Given Pitts/Chicago are on the eclipse of their core contention period and we are entering ours, yes I would rather be a Leaf fan right now, and congrats to Pitts and Chicago, they've had a hell of a run.

 

[HamiltonNHL]

Do you actually think Rantanen will sign before Marner?

Dubas must wait.

 

[bentharbs]

People who act like Dubas, and only Dubas, is the only one signing off on any Marner contract are just being ignorant. Or Willie's deal. Or Matthew's deal. No contract is signed without Shanny's approval. Don't act like this is a one-man show. If you aren't happy with the contracts you have to distribute your anger equitably. We all know Shanny is making the final calls.

 

[Mr Hockey]

Dubas must wait.

Dubas wants Rantanan/Point/etc to sign first but all those players want Marner to sign first

 

[GoonieFace]

UMmmm yes?
Past success has nothing to do with next year. Going forward the leafs have a better younger core........

Chicago won with both Kane and Toews on their ELC's I believe. They had a solid core of younger players (Buff, Ladd, Seabrook etc) and veterans (Hossa, Campbell, Sharp). We have none of our core guys in their ELC's anymore. They are all making a mint, so in turn who are our (Hossa, Sharp etc)? Marleau? Hainsey? Kadri?. We don't have those guys and we probably never will given the cap situation. We basically have to hope like hell we have a bunch of young guys earn way above their paygrade in the next few years.

 

[Throw More Waffles]

Do you actually think Rantanen will sign before Marner?

I don’t care who signs first.

If Marner makes even ONE PENNY more than Rantanen, I want Dubas flat out investigated.

 

[deletethis]

Thas still muh higher than we should expect.

Their best comparables have them getting like 2.1-2,7 mil aav in such a small term. 3ish would be a number if we were talking 4-5 year contracts though

Are you going to ignore that I posted concrete 2018 examples of Kapanen's and Johnsson's comparables? Their production is clearly higher than any of the $2.1M-$2.7M bridge contracts.

 

[BlueForever75]

You'd rather be in our position than Pittsburgh or Chicago who have won multiple cups?

Yes I would rather be paying players towards winning a cup in their prime not for what they did. Do I wish the Leafs had cups of course, that is a stupid question and you are neglecting the point. We are talking from a cap situation and moving forward long term.

 

[Mr Hockey]

I don’t care who signs first.

If Marner makes even ONE PENNY more than Rantanen, I want Dubas flat out investigated.

Mackinnon like Kuch has an outdated contract, so it will be interesting to see how Sakic deals with that

 

[BlueForever75]

The problem is that nobody knows if Marner/Matthews and Tavares are capable of being the guys to win a cup. Those other teams already had success and are paying for it dearly now. We are paying dearly, and as of yet have nothing to show for it.

Yes you are correct, with an eye they will take us to where we need to go and getting better. Would rather have it this way then pay for has beens.

 

[Legion34]

Chicago won with both Kane and Toews on their ELC's I believe. They had a solid core of younger players (Buff, Ladd, Seabrook etc) and veterans (Hossa, Campbell, Sharp). We have none of our core guys in their ELC's anymore. They are all making a mint, so in turn who are our (Hossa, Sharp etc)? Marleau? Hainsey? Kadri?. We don't have those guys and we probably never will given the cap situation. We basically have to hope like hell we have a bunch of young guys earn way above their paygrade in the next few years.

None of this has anything to do with 2019-2020. The leafs are in a better situation now.

Chicago and Pitt caught lightning when the league changed post lockout and they had young cores.

That they won a decade ago has nothing to do with the current NHL

 

[GoonieFace]

None of this has anything to do with 2019-2020. The leafs are in a better situation now.

Chicago and Pitt caught lightning when the league changed post lockout and they had young cores.

That they won a decade ago has nothing to do with the current NHL

I'm not sure the Leafs are in a better situation right now. If Marner gets $10mil, thats $40mil (almost half the cap) tied up in 4 players, that have no playoff success up till this point.

 

[Throw More Waffles]

Bridges for Kapanen and/or Johnsson?

Kapanen , 20g 24a
Johnsson, 20g, 23a

2018 signings of RFAs:

More points
Less points

Tobias Rieder: $2.0M (1 year), 12g 13a
Jimmy Vesey: $2.275M (2 years), 17g 11a
Mattius Janmark: $2.3M (1 year), 19g 15a
Devin Shore: $2.3M (2 years), 11g, 21a
Oliver Bjorkstrand $2.5M (3 years), 11g, 29a
Ondrej Kase $2.6 M (3 years), 20g 18a
Miles Wood $2.75M (3 years), 19g 13a
Chris Tierney $2.937M (2 years), 17g 23a
Andreas Athanasiou $3.0M (2 years), 16g 17a
Ryan Strome $3.1M (2 years), 13g 21a
Max Domi $3.15M (2 years), 9g 36a
Anthony Mantha $3.3M (2 years), 24g 24a
Vlad Namestnikov $4.0M (2 years), 22g 26a
Brock Nelson: $4.25M (1 year), 19g 16a

Pretty much all of these players are either much younger than Johnsson, or they have put up similar numbers for MORE than one season.

If anything, those stats reinforce that market value for Johnsson is around 2.5x3, with Kapanen being slightly more.

 

[Al14]

I don’t care who signs first.

If Marner makes even ONE PENNY more than Rantanen, I want Dubas flat out investigated.

I would want Dubas fired!

You know, when Tavares signed last July, many Leafs fans bet that our Leafs would win the Cup. I even think our Leafs might of become the favourites via Vegas.

Now, thanks to Dubas’s botching of both Nylander's and Matthews's contracts, and, the ripple effects it will produce with Marner and other Leafs, the Toronto Maple Leafs will continue to be the epicenter of chaos.

The more it changes in Toronto, the more it stays the f***ing same.

 

[Rielly]

Horton on LTIR
Marleau Ret to Sharks
Trade Brown
Get rid of Zaitsev somehow

Not easy, but very doable

Doable till you complain about what its gonna cost to get rid of marleau & zaitsev lmaoo

 

[Throw More Waffles]

I would want Dubas fired!

You know, when Tavares signed last July, many Leafs fans bet that our Leafs would win the Cup. I even think our Leafs might of become the favourites via Vegas.

Now, thanks to Dubas’s botching of both Nylander's and Matthews's contracts, and, the ripple effects it will produce with Marner and other Leafs, the Toronto Maple Leafs will continue to be the epicenter of chaos.

The more it changes in Toronto, the more it stays the ****ing same.

I don’t want him merely fired. I want him imprisoned. There is no way he is just this bad at his job. There is something else at play here.
I want a criminal investigation into these dramatic overpayments. I’m not saying he’s guilty of anything. But I at least want there to be an investigation.