Prospect Info: 2018 NHL Draft / Pick #9 - Vitali Kravtsov (RW) - Part IV

[Tawnos]

The only thing that annoyed me about the Kravtsov pick was that I wanted them to take a D. Dobson and Bouchard were both still on the board. Then they took D with 4 of their next 5 picks, all in the top 90, and I was mollified.

 

[nyr2k2]

See, I think the WJC is a great way to evaluate talent. I’ve seen plenty of guys be rated exceptionally high as prospects, with the stats to back it up, and show they don’t have what it takes during crunch time in the WJC. Those players also tend to underperform as pros.

But to put that much weight into the WJC where it’s going to completely change your ranking of a prospect is ridiculous. Especially given that said person allegedly does this for a living.

I have no problem using the WJC as a tool to evaluate guys. But when you have someone like Kravtsov who is doing special things in the second-best league in the world, against men, you don't need to "check back with" anyone after the tournament to know what you need to know about the kid.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

I have no problem using the WJC as a tool to evaluate guys. But when you have someone like Kravtsov who is doing special things in the second-best league in the world, against men, you don't need to "check back with" anyone after the tournament to know what you need to know about the kid.

Exactly. WJC is a great way to judge, but let's be real here:

Elias Pettersson was tearing it up in the SHL, had a mediocre WJC and people were labeling Mittelstadt as the next star. Who is currently leading all rookies in points (by a mile)?

Same with Kravtsov. He leads his KHL team in assists and points, while playing fewer games than the 2 he is tied with, at the age of 18. That's right. A teenager leads his team in points in the KHL! What more proof do you need? Oh, and he's on the 2nd worst scoring team in the league while doing so. Involved in 28% of his team's goals. He could go pointless this entire WJC tournament and still be our best prospect

 

[Vinny DeAngelo]

Exactly. WJC is a great way to judge, but let's be real here:

Elias Pettersson was tearing it up in the SHL, had a mediocre WJC and people were labeling Mittelstadt as the next star. Who is currently leading all rookies in points (by a mile)?

Same with Kravtsov. He leads his KHL team in assists and points, while playing fewer games than the 2 he is tied with, at the age of 18. That's right. A teenager leads his team in points in the KHL! What more proof do you need? Oh, and he's on the 2nd worst scoring team in the league while doing so. Involved in 28% of his team's goals. He could go pointless this entire WJC tournament and still be our best prospect

Does the bolded not de-value the underlined?

 

[Levitate]

Yea Pronman is a clown.

My favorite is when he criticized the Rangers going into last season, stating our farm system was depleted basically. My apologies Corey, we were busy going for the cup in 2014 and 2015, adding to the rosters we had by trading draft picks and prospects. We should have just traded everyone away and not competed so that we could have a more promising farm system.

As said on MLB network inside pitch, prospects are cool, parades are better

If you're talking purely prospects and farm systems then I think it's fine to criticize a team that spent some years trading picks in an attempt to win the cup, IN THE CONTEXT of how their farm system currently looks. Criticism doesn't have to be totally negative and it's fair to say that the Rangers sold some of their future in an attempt to chase the cup, but I think it's only particularly fair in terms of explaining the state of their farm system.

Basically, saying "the Rangers farm system isn't very good right now after they have traded many picks and some prospects in an attempt to win the cup" but getting into the "it was a stupid and failed attempt and they shouldn't have done it because they suck and now here's there sucky prospects" is probably not relevant when talking prospects

 

[Glen Sathers Cigar]

Exactly. WJC is a great way to judge, but let's be real here:

Elias Pettersson was tearing it up in the SHL, had a mediocre WJC and people were labeling Mittelstadt as the next star. Who is currently leading all rookies in points (by a mile)?

Pronman literally did this all summer. Had Mittelstadt as his number one forward prospect all summer.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

Does the bolded not de-value the underlined?

Would it be more impressive for a teenager to put up points on a team scoring 250 goals, or on a team scoring 120 goals?

 

[Calad]

Does the bolded not de-value the underlined?

If anything I would say it adds value to it. The offense of a professional team is revolving around our 18 year old prospect, and despite the situation surrounding him he is flourishing

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Biggest take away from the Pronman podcast appearance?

Podkolzin may slip due to being committed to the KHL for the forseeable future. Please fall to one of our later 1sts.

 

[nyr2k2]

Does the bolded not de-value the underlined?

Since his production is on pace or exceeding other KHL starlets who played on better teams, it does not. If his team-leading production was like 10 points, maybe, but he's doing what other stars have done just in much more difficult circumstances.

 

[GeorgeKaplan]

Biggest take away from the Pronman podcast appearance?

Podkolzin may slip due to being committed to the KHL for the forseeable future. Please fall to one of our later 1sts.

When he signed that contract I said he’d probably fall toward the end of the top 10 or further because the teams picking higher up generally want to show something tangible sooner than 2-3 years for their poor season (and GMs want to show owners they’re the ones to right the ship and keep their jobs)

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

Since his production is on pace or exceeding other KHL starlets who played on better teams, it does not. If his team-leading production was like 10 points, maybe, but he's doing what other stars have done just in much more difficult circumstances.

I post regular updates about this, but here's the current comparison:

 

[One Winged Angel]

Outside of NHL representing a nation in an international tournament always trumps team's or individual considerations. Once selected not going was not a realistic option for Kravtsov.

I understand this. I'm just saying for his development, I think it's best for him to stay playing the KHL. He'd be better served playing against men.

It's a great opportunity for him to play in huge games against the top competition at his age level, it makes no sense to not want to see him there.

It's not like we are talking about a player who has already made the NHL (Chytil).

I'm not saying I won't be happy if he has a great tournament. I just think he would be better served continuing to play against men, especially with how well he's played and how vital he is to Traktor at his age. You don't see that often.

 

[One Winged Angel]

I post regular updates about this, but here's the current comparison:

Excellent work, as always.

 

[Levitate]

Since his production is on pace or exceeding other KHL starlets who played on better teams, it does not. If his team-leading production was like 10 points, maybe, but he's doing what other stars have done just in much more difficult circumstances.

What's his comparison via icetime? Though it's kind of a back and forth argument...one guy puts up points playing on a loaded team but less icetime behind established players, another puts up points on a poor team but gets more icetime (but theoretically less help because of harder minutes/less talented linemates), so which is "better"?

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

What's his comparison via icetime? Though it's kind of a back and forth argument...one guy puts up points playing on a loaded team but less icetime behind established players, another puts up points on a poor team but gets more icetime (but theoretically less help because of harder minutes/less talented linemates), so which is "better"?

Ice-time is relatively the same. Kravtsov getting about a minute a game more, because of his bigger role. Most of Kravtsov's points are primary points as well.

 

[Vinny DeAngelo]

Would it be more impressive for a teenager to put up points on a team scoring 250 goals, or on a team scoring 120 goals?

Not necessarily. I was just making the counter point. What was more impressive Rick Nash putting up points on a garbage Columbus team or him putting up points on a stacked NYR. I think it's more of a philosophical question. We saw Buch put up solid numbers then when he was traded his production dropped off.

Do you think its more of a bad team that gets written off(his production just happens) or is it a case of teams look at him and say if we shut him down we win? Where are opponents focused if they even are focus on his team?

I lost my own point now... I'm Happy hes producing

 

[The Crypto Guy]

I understand this. I'm just saying for his development, I think it's best for him to stay playing the KHL. He'd be better served playing against men.



I'm not saying I won't be happy if he has a great tournament. I just think he would be better served continuing to play against men, especially with how well he's played and how vital he is to Traktor at his age. You don't see that often.

This tournament is a much bigger development tool for him than missing 6-7 KHL games.

 

[Algernop Kreider]

Would it be more impressive for a teenager to put up points on a team scoring 250 goals, or on a team scoring 120 goals?

Traktor's ineptitude makes his absolute offensive performance more impressive, but it does make it a little less impressive that he leads the team in points.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

Traktor's ineptitude makes his absolute offensive performance more impressive, but it does make it a little less impressive that he leads the team in points.

I get that. But it goes hand in hand, right? His team's production overall being so low makes it more difficult for him to put up points. He's still on track to finish at a similar scoring rate as the 5 Russian kids I compare him with, with a much higher Contribution percentage

 

[Algernop Kreider]

I get that. But it goes hand in hand, right? His team's production overall being so low makes it more difficult for him to put up points. He's still on track to finish at a similar scoring rate as the 5 Russian kids I compare him with, with a much higher Contribution percentage

Yeah I agree that it's very impressive the way his production tracks with other player on better teams, just wanted to point out that it's much easier to perform well relative to one's own team if the team sucks.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

Yeah I agree that it's very impressive the way his production tracks with other player on better teams, just wanted to point out that it's much easier to perform well relative to one's own team if the team sucks.

Agreed. It's a nice little stat I can throw in there years from now though.

 

[One Winged Angel]

This tournament is a much bigger development tool for him than missing 6-7 KHL games.

I disagree. He goes down to playing against kids. If he needed a confidence booster, I'd agree. He doesn't. He's playing very well against men, not 17-20 year olds.

 

[JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK]

This line will be deadly, Kovalenko is doing real good in the KHL right now. Great pick in June by the Avs

If Kravstov dominates at center I’ll be tapped out, can’t handle all these Rangers prospects dominating

 

[The Crypto Guy]

I disagree. He goes down to playing against kids. If he needed a confidence booster, I'd agree. He doesn't. He's playing very well against men, not 17-20 year olds.

I hope you're not expecting him to score 20 points in this thing. There are lots of "kids"playing in this tournament that are playing in a pro mens league. You have the best of the best kids going at it, half the KHLers wouldnt even make the AHL that he goes against in the KHL.