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2018-19 Roster talk; Part two

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Magua

Magua

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deadhead said:
I want to see what Hatcher was able to do with that p***y Sanheim over the summer. :sarcasm:
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CapnZin

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Stizzle said:
Ummm, no you clearly have a personal preference. No objectivity.

For a guy who has never, or barely ever, seen him play you have a very vocal opinion on Vorobyev.

You show a lot of confidence in a guy who went from full-time NHL player to full-time AHL the next season. Then back to the NHL the following year where he lost his PK spot to Torgo and Filp. By the playoffs he wasn't even playing center.

Laughton is 3 years older than Vorobyev. If Vorobyev is suffering a similar fate in 3 years I'll eat my hat.

Laughton scored .65 pts/game in his most recent AHL season with his most common linemate as Taylor Leier and big minute 1C duties from day 1.

Vorobyev just scored at .5 pts/game while starting low in the lineup, with limited minutes, and little production at the start. All the while having Fazleev as his most common linemate who finished very low in possession rankings this year. Even so, Vorobyev finished very high.

Go re-read his interview from a month or so ago. Misha could not speak english. He did not even have confidence to shoot the puck. This is a player who improved leaps and bounds as he grew even a little comfortable. What improvement has Laughton displayed?

By the end of the year we were seeing the real Vorobyev. Anyone who watched regularly saw he's a smart player, a legit playmaker, and has the chops to handle the defensive rigors of playing center. He is what a bottom/middle 6 center is supposed to look like.

Laughton is a forechecking, straight ahead, tunnel visioned forward. His skillset doesn't even lend itself to that of a center. He has no future at center in this organization. He's 24 years old and the GM is talking up Jordan Weal over him. A player who can barely crack the lineup and is the antithesis of what they look for in a center.

The only other level of play we have to compare the two is World Juniors and that's not even close. Misha showed up and produced. Laughton didn't. Even with the 'C' on his chest. Canada got eliminated in the quarterfinal. Russia was a shootout away from beating a beast USA team in the semifinal. A shootout where Misha buried one. Then went on to win bronze the next day. Obviously, the WJC experience isn't the be all, end all, but I bring it up as a rare data point they both share.

I don't know man. This really doesn't seem like a tough choice. You really just have to watch the games imo.
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Personal preference aside... I agree with you. Laughton in a checking line with the likes of Simmonds and Lindblom makes for a very effective 3 CHK line, but that’s so constricted in view it completely takes away other facets of the game.

I don’t think that Frost dominating at the JR level is beneficial to him, but it could raise his confidence and allow him to build muscle instead of being manhandleled at the NHL level... I don’t know if he can play in the AHL yet. I assume he can’t.

Misha’s vision is, most likely, his most underrated ability. He has a great playmaking ability. His passing is also above average too. Simmonds and Lindblom aren’t playmaking types, rather, powerforward/2-way shooting players. Simmer and Lindblom need a passer in their line. Laughton doesn’t fit that mold. Vorobyev fits that mold.

The thing that does bother me is that the franchise has deemed him a 2-way forward, instead of playing to Vorobyev strengths like the playmaking ability he has. I guess that’s what happens when you give Gordon a Russian. We saw that with Fazleev.

I personally would like to see:

G - Couts - TK
JVR - Patrick - Voracek
Lindblom - Vorobyev - Simmer
Raffl - Laughton - NAK

Lehtera/Weise, Leier/Weal.
 
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deadhead

deadhead

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Vorobyev has the size, instincts and willingness to play defense to be a two way center.
Why would you want him to just focus on offense, especially in a bottom six role where you also hope he can contribute on the PK?

I think Weal will get first shot at 3C, and if he falters, Vorobyev comes up after playing a top six role in LHV for a couple months. You want a playmaker between Lindblom and Simmonds.
 
deadhead

deadhead

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"Gone are the days when the ox fall down,
Take up the yoke and plow the fields around. . . "
 
Curufinwe

Curufinwe

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Feb 28, 2013
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Stizzle said:
Ummm, no you clearly have a personal preference. No objectivity.

For a guy who has never, or barely ever, seen him play you have a very vocal opinion on Vorobyev.


You show a lot of confidence in a guy who went from full-time NHL player to full-time AHL the next season. Then back to the NHL the following year where he lost his PK spot to Torgo and Filp. By the playoffs he wasn't even playing center.

Laughton is 3 years older than Vorobyev. If Vorobyev is suffering a similar fate in 3 years I'll eat my hat.

Laughton scored .65 pts/game in his most recent AHL season with his most common linemate as Taylor Leier and big minute 1C duties from day 1.
Click to expand...

[EDIT] I didn't realize this discussion was from two months ago and was already thoroughly discussed.

You're leaving out the part where Laughton received almost no powerplay time in his final AHL season of 60 games, scoring 33 of his 39 points at ES, 2 on the PP, and 4 SH. Vorobyev was a regular on the Phantoms second PP unit during his rookie season of 58 games, scoring 22 of his 29 points at ES, and 7 on the PP.

At the same time Hak moved Laughton to wing, he also moved Lindblom and Sanheim to the pressbox. So I don't think we should just use the playoff lines to determine where young players stand going forward. Laughton played the vast majority of the season at center, with good possession numbers, good faceoff numbers, decent 5on5 production, and one of the best GA/60 among regular PKers on the team.

The one stat Laughton struggled in was PDO, which was well below even Sanheim's.

Player Season Totals - Natural Stat Trick
 
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Curufinwe

Curufinwe

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Magua said:
Yeah but what about the final dozen games. We know what you do in the final dozen games is the better indicator of future success.
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Final 25 games, thank you very much. That prolonged stretch of greatness had them 19th in the league at 78.4%.

Part I: Pre-training camp Q&A with Flyers GM Ron Hextall

DI: One area you said you wanted to take a step forward in was the penalty kill. You pointed to the last two months of the season where you were 80.7 percent, but that was only 14th in the league in that timeframe. There was no coaching change. How does this team improve? Where do you see the same group getting better?
RH: Well, again, as I stated late in the year, we tried personnel wise to do some things. Certain things haven’t worked out. As I stated, if we have the same personnel, we have to be the entire year like we were the last 25 games. We can’t be at the bottom of the league.
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NHL.com - Stats

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Rebels57

Rebels57

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Sep 28, 2014
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Curufinwe said:
That's a shocker. They were 25th overall for the season at 76.9%.

First 55 games - 70.9%
Last 27 games - 90.4%
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Can probably chalk that up to playing loose since their season was already over at that point. It's a lot easier to play with no expectations which is why we always see those non-playoff teams go on late runs and play spoiler.
 
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