Speculation: 2018-19 Roster Discussion Part I

[Hinterland]

Burns after 0 points and a -1 in the 1st 3 games. Has a 6 point streak going with 10 points and a +5.

Hasn't been posted here I guess?

 

[Jwec]

As good as Meier is I am still bummed and annoyed that we skipped Rantanen. I was so so so excited that Rantanen wasn't picked before 9th overall and I was so excited and sure at that moment that we would pick Rantanen. Then Tim Burke said we gunna select Timo Meier and I went like "No No NO NO NO JESUS f*** NO!". Of course now I'm glad that Meier is playing so well and I love to watch him play and he has good chance to put 30-goal and 55-point season but I really loved Rantanen and yeah... I would be lying if I would've thought that Rantanen would be THAT good and Art Ross candidate but I still thought he would become 65-point elite winger.

 

[Friday]

As good as Meier is I am still bummed and annoyed that we skipped Rantanen. I was so so so excited that Rantanen wasn't picked before 9th overall and I was so excited and sure at that moment that we would pick Rantanen. Then Tim Burke said we gunna select Timo Meier and I went like "No No NO NO NO JESUS **** NO!". Of course now I'm glad that Meier is playing so well and I love to watch him play and he has good chance to put 30-goal and 55-point season but I really loved Rantanen and yeah... I would be lying if I would've thought that Rantanen would be THAT good and Art Ross candidate but I still thought he would become 65-point elite winger.

Rantanen and Barzal are game changing players, but I still love Timo and I think he fits well with our group.

 

[Alwalys]

at least we didnt whiff. that woulda sucked.

 

[Hinterland]

Rantanen and Barzal are game changing players, but I still love Timo and I think he fits well with our group.

Timo is better than them. They're not even close from him physically or defensively. If you look at scoring only Timo may never equal their totals but if you look at overall performance I'd take Timo over them every day of the year. Especially if you're as focused on possession as the Sharks are. Try find a player stronger on the puck than Meier. There probably isn't a single one.

Plus, Meier, together with Hertl, has proven to be the gamechanger recently. Other players may have scored more but if you look at important goals you'll find out that their sticks were almost always involved. They're clutch players and their ability to dominate every single line in the NHL is intriguing.

 

[Jwec]

Timo is better than them. They're not even close from him physically or defensively. If you look at scoring only Timo may never equal their totals but if you look at overall performance I'd take Timo over them every day of the year. Especially if you're as focused on possession as the Sharks are. Try find a player stronger on the puck than Meier. There probably isn't a single one.

Plus, Meier, together with Hertl, has proven to be the gamechanger recently. Other players may have scored more but if you look at important goals you'll find out that their sticks were almost always involved. They're clutch players and their ability to dominate every single line in the NHL is intriguing.

You never disappoint So you think probably about 50-point forward is better than potential Art Ross winner who can possibly score over 100 points this season. But you were from Switzerland weren't you so probably there is some home country proudness and bias there but still. Wow

 

[SjMilhouse]

Timo is better than them. They're not even close from him physically or defensively. If you look at scoring only Timo may never equal their totals but if you look at overall performance I'd take Timo over them every day of the year. Especially if you're as focused on possession as the Sharks are. Try find a player stronger on the puck than Meier. There probably isn't a single one.

Plus, Meier, together with Hertl, has proven to be the gamechanger recently. Other players may have scored more but if you look at important goals you'll find out that their sticks were almost always involved. They're clutch players and their ability to dominate every single line in the NHL is intriguing.

uhhhh what?

 

[Gecklund]

Timo is better than them. They're not even close from him physically or defensively. If you look at scoring only Timo may never equal their totals but if you look at overall performance I'd take Timo over them every day of the year. Especially if you're as focused on possession as the Sharks are. Try find a player stronger on the puck than Meier. There probably isn't a single one.

Plus, Meier, together with Hertl, has proven to be the gamechanger recently. Other players may have scored more but if you look at important goals you'll find out that their sticks were almost always involved. They're clutch players and their ability to dominate every single line in the NHL is intriguing.

I love Timo and I do think he is a better defensive player but I’d still take Rantanen and Barzal over him. Both have sky high potential.

 

[Pinkfloyd]

Simek and Heed continue to get no ice time. Dillon or Braun has to be moved.

I suspect that Ryan might go in a trade for a bigger piece.

Sharks can't afford a bigger piece. Considering they haven't played Simek or Heed, it would make no sense to move anyone.

 

[Sysreq]

Sharks can't afford a bigger piece. Considering they haven't played Simek or Heed, it would make no sense to move anyone.

Doug Wilson will find a way. I think DeSimone is playing fantastic in the AHL, and really think he gives us some options should we need another call up. I think Dell and Melker are both gonna be cap casualties. As much as I like Dell, I just don’t think we can afford him right now. Moving Heed and Simek, that gives us a good 5 million+ at the TDL to play with. I wouldn’t move Dillion or Braun, but I think we can still make a competitive offer with FLA’s 2nd (almost a 1st) and some of our strong prospects. Remember we still have one of the best AHL teams in the league. I don’t think we’ll be in on a guy like Panarin, I think that’s gonna be out of our price range, but I think we can do another Kane type deal (2nd + O’Regan) to still land an impact rental.

A lot of these guys like Dell or Melker either go at the TDL or get moved in the off-season. Assuming we still plan to keep Karlsson, there is just no way to make it work.

And don’t forget that we can always LTIR Thornton for the last 20 games of the season to gain another 5 mil if we needed to.

 

[rangerssharks414]

Wait, the Sharks passed on Barzal and Rantanen to take Meier? Mind. Blown.

 

[Hinterland]

You never disappoint So you think probably about 50-point forward is better than potential Art Ross winner who can possibly score over 100 points this season. But you were from Switzerland weren't you so probably there is some home country proudness and bias there but still. Wow

Has little to do with that. Barzal is pretty bad defensively and Trotz discovered his issues pretty quickly. Rantanen has MacKinnon to play with. They both can't protect the puck like Meier does. You shouldn't overvalue points.

 

[Jwec]

Has little to do with that. Barzal is pretty bad defensively and Trotz discovered his issues pretty quickly. Rantanen has MacKinnon to play with. They both can't protect the puck like Meier does. You shouldn't overvalue points.

Barzal is not great defensively but he is not that bad. Also Rantanen has McKinnon but Ovie has Backström, Thornton has had Pavelski, Benn has Seguin, Kane has Toews, Matthews had Nylander etc. And if you ask Avs fans they say that Rantanen has been better than Mack.

Rantanen can protect the puck pretty damn well and has so smooth hands. Also his hockey IQ is way way way better than Meier's. And wtf, I shouldn't overvalue points. Yeah, totally, 50-point difference is meaningless. It's not like hockey games are decided by scoring goals.

 

[TomasHertlsRooster]

It seems that Barzal and Rantanen are simply destined to improve at roughly 1.5X the rate which Meier improves. Meier could become a 40 goal, 70 point power forward and Barzal and Rantanen would score 50 goals and 100 points. It is what it is.

Since December 14, Meier has got 24 goals and 15 assists in 63 games. He ranks 1st on our team in goals, 4th on our team in points, 3rd on our team in even strength points. 24th in the NHL in goals, 15th in the NHL in even strength goals, 64th in the NHL in even strength points (tied with Blake Wheeler, Logan Couture, and Erik Karlsson), and 4th in the NHL in minor penalties drawn over that time frame.

We don’t make the playoffs last year without him. He inflated Chris Tierney’s numbers to the point where we were able to trade Tierney as the main roster piece for the best defenseman in the NHL. He did a whole hell of a lot for us last year at the age of 21.

Yes, it sucks that he just so happened to be the 9th overall pick in a draft where multiple franchise changing superstars were drafted past #9. Oh well. He’s already one of our best players and he’s only getting better.

Also, once Pavelski walks in the off-season, Meier will probably take his spot as the net front presence on the 1st PP unit and that will inflate his goal totals.

 

[Sysreq]

Pavelski isn’t walking in the off-season.

 

[Jwec]

Pavelski isn’t walking in the off-season.

How do you know? We are pretty tight with cap if Karlsson re-signs.

 

[Fistfullofbeer]

Pavelski isn’t walking in the off-season.

Not sure what you mean here? I am fairly sure he wants to re-sign but a lot is contingent on whether we end up signing EK65 or not.

The fact that DW has not started extension talks with Pavs, from all that we have heard, is telling.

 

[Pinkfloyd]

Doug Wilson will find a way. I think DeSimone is playing fantastic in the AHL, and really think he gives us some options should we need another call up. I think Dell and Melker are both gonna be cap casualties. As much as I like Dell, I just don’t think we can afford him right now. Moving Heed and Simek, that gives us a good 5 million+ at the TDL to play with. I wouldn’t move Dillion or Braun, but I think we can still make a competitive offer with FLA’s 2nd (almost a 1st) and some of our strong prospects. Remember we still have one of the best AHL teams in the league. I don’t think we’ll be in on a guy like Panarin, I think that’s gonna be out of our price range, but I think we can do another Kane type deal (2nd + O’Regan) to still land an impact rental.

A lot of these guys like Dell or Melker either go at the TDL or get moved in the off-season. Assuming we still plan to keep Karlsson, there is just no way to make it work.

And don’t forget that we can always LTIR Thornton for the last 20 games of the season to gain another 5 mil if we needed to.

Unless they think Thornton is hurt to such an extent that they can't count on him later in the season then there really is no point in adding a bigger piece with the limited space they have. I sincerely doubt that DW is going to go from Dell to Bibeau midseason this year. He may sacrifice Dell in the off-season but not now. They've added backups in the past because they value the position even for a short stretch from the deadline to the playoffs. Don't see him doing a 180 from that. DeSimone is probably not going to see ice time here barring a lot of injuries. They're not going to move both Simek and Heed for him since he makes more on the cap than both of them. He may move one of them in such a deal but not both. In reality, they have Melker's two and either 650 or 675k to use at the deadline with whatever space they're going to have which may amount to a million if they don't have more injuries eating up cap space. Also, I really doubt that's an option for them with regards to Thornton. That's only going to be an option if he's actually injured. They're not going to come to some backroom deal to pretend like he's hurt. Jumbo won't go for it.

 

[Hinterland]

Barzal is not great defensively but he is not that bad. Also Rantanen has McKinnon but Ovie has Backström, Thornton has had Pavelski, Benn has Seguin, Kane has Toews, Matthews had Nylander etc. And if you ask Avs fans they say that Rantanen has been better than Mack.

Rantanen can protect the puck pretty damn well and has so smooth hands. Also his hockey IQ is way way way better than Meier's. And wtf, I shouldn't overvalue points. Yeah, totally, 50-point difference is meaningless. It's not like hockey games are decided by scoring goals.

There won't be a 50 point difference this season and there wasn't last season as soon as Meier got some half decent icetime.
Rantanen sucks ass and whoever claims he's even close from MacKinnon doesn't have a clue. Play Meier with MacKinnon and he's gonna outscore Rantanen with ease. MacKinnon in my view currently the best Centerman in the NHL especially in terms of possession.

Barzal sucks defensively, is still losing just about every important faceoff and is also weak on the puck. Basically McDavid 2,0 with a bit of attitude on top. Those kind of one dimensional players will never lead a franchise to success. Not in a million years. Of course they could still improve and work on their weaknesses but I wouldn't hold my breath. Barzal thinks he's the nr.1 player in this league and that's how he behaves both on and off the ice. That brat over Meier? Nah thanks. He can stay right where he is.

 

[Juxtaposer]

1. It’s highly disappointing that we passed on Rantanen, as well as Barzal. If we were intent on taking a big, strong winger instead of Barzal, Rantanen was right there, and so was Connor. But it’s true that at least we didn’t take Crouse. Meier is awesome.

2. I like Nick DeSimone a lot, enough so that I’d be down to trade Braun and replace him with DeSimone. Frankly, I’d be absolutely fine going into next season with a bottom pairing comprised of him, Simek, Middleton, and whatever good player other teams try to get snuck through waivers at the end of next offseason. I’d miss Dillon, because I actually think he’s playing quite well right now and he does legitimately seem to be a glue guy, the type of teammate everyone loves. But Karlsson, Donskoi, and potentially Pavelski are more vital.

 

[Fistfullofbeer]

1. It’s highly disappointing that we passed on Rantanen, as well as Barzal. If we were intent on taking a big, strong winger instead of Barzal, Rantanen was right there, and so was Connor. But it’s true that at least we didn’t take Crouse. Meier is awesome.

2. I like Nick DeSimone a lot, enough so that I’d be down to trade Braun and replace him with DeSimone. Frankly, I’d be absolutely fine going into next season with a bottom pairing comprised of him, Simek, Middleton, and whatever good player other teams try to get snuck through waivers at the end of next offseason. I’d miss Dillon, because I actually think he’s playing quite well right now and he does legitimately seem to be a glue guy, the type of teammate everyone loves. But Karlsson, Donskoi, and potentially Pavelski are more vital.

Undoubtedly. Also, next year could be a DeSimone, Roy, Middleton or Simek 3rd pairing and expect to lose Heed as a UFA. Overall that may end up being more of a stop-gap 3rd pairing in 2019-20 too because we could potentially have Merkley and Ferraro both available as options in 2020-21.

It is going to make for an exciting off-season this year. Both to see if EK65 re-signs and if he does, how it affects the other re-signings.

 

[Negatively Positive]

My problem with trading Braun or Dillon is Deboer's current treatment of Ryan. Ryan keeps getting benched in the 3rd period and we know what happened to him last year after getting injured. If Deboer's gonna treat Ryan like that who played well most of last season what's he gonna do to Heed or Simek who has less NHL experience than Ryan? He'd probably bench them after the 1st period and play Burns, Karlsson, and Vlasic 30 minutes each.

 

[Fistfullofbeer]

My problem with trading Braun or Dillon is Deboer's current treatment of Ryan. Ryan keeps getting benched in the 3rd period and we know what happened to him last year after getting injured. If Deboer's gonna treat Ryan like that who played well most of last season what's he gonna do to Heed or Simek who has less NHL experience than Ryan? He'd probably bench them after the 1st period and play Burns, Karlsson, and Vlasic 30 minutes each.

Yeah, but that would basically be DW forcing PDB's hand. Infact, Braun or Dillon being traded could potentially be the only way Ryan sees more time.

I am always hesitant saying that PDB's prefers vets over kids because he gave Labanc, Meier, etc. a lot of game time. However, he definitely does play favorites. He has played Melker, Paul Martin, etc. when there have been better options available. He gives 'proven' vets a longer leash and punishes mistakes from the kids by severely cutting their ice time or even not playing them.

If you are trying to 'earn' game time with PDB you have to produce points and do it without committing many/any mistakes. If not, he will bench you in favor for a vet who brings nothing to the table offensively but plays a vanilla error-free game.

 

[do0glas]

So with ek65, you have to give braun and dillon the most ice time. There is some seniority going on i think.

 

[Juxtaposer]

Undoubtedly. Also, next year could be a DeSimone, Roy, Middleton or Simek 3rd pairing and expect to lose Heed as a UFA. Overall that may end up being more of a stop-gap 3rd pairing in 2019-20 too because we could potentially have Merkley and Ferraro both available as options in 2020-21.

It is going to make for an exciting off-season this year. Both to see if EK65 re-signs and if he does, how it affects the other re-signings.

Ryan-Burns
Vlasic-Karlsson
Ferraro-Merkley

That’s very drool....