2016 Draft Thread III – Host: Buffalo – Pick: 8th

[EichHart]

I think Juolevi is almost certainly the BPA for defenceman going into the draft at this point. He's probably the guy I'm hoping for now.

I got to see him live twice last week, and the kid just has it.

Good to hear. Still sticking with the Hamhuis comparable?

 

[Sabre the Win]

I think Juolevi is almost certainly the BPA for defenceman going into the draft at this point. He's probably the guy I'm hoping for now.

I got to see him live twice last week, and the kid just has it.

I was at both Ice Dog games against London last week and my girlfriend turned to me and said both times when we've seen him "that #4 is pretty good" and she didn't watch hockey much before being with me.

I've always thought he was the best defensemen. I've seen him/Chychrun and Sergachev. I goto a lot of Ice Dog games. Next year I might start recording the prospects people want to see the most on this forum and uploading them.

 

[EichHart]

Thought this would be more relevant here.

So did Chychrun lose all of his hockey sense this season? Because from my viewings he is good at everything else. Chychrun was also the first overall pick in the 2014 OHL Priority Selection.

In 14-15, In 42 games for the Sting, Chychrun scored 16 goals and added 17 assists for 33 points. he was named to the league’s First All-Rookie Team, and to the OHL Third All-Star Team.

In 15-16 he put up 49 pts in 62 games which puts him in similar categories of Ekblad, Petro, and Jones. He also was a +23 and put up 8 pts in 7 playoff games this year.

He was ranked #2 in September, #5 in January and #9 in May. I think Chychrun massive decline has to do with not making the world junior team where we saw players massively shoot up the list due to impressive showings.

http://www.tsn.ca/elite-prospect-mat...nking-1.364099

http://www.tsn.ca/tsn-mid-season-dra...three-1.435206

http://www.tsn.ca/laine-closes-gap-o...kings-1.478128

 

[EichHart]

I was at both Ice Dog games against London last week and my girlfriend turned to me and said both times when we've seen him "that #4 is pretty good" and she didn't watch hockey much before being with me.

I've always thought he was the best defensemen. I've seen him/Chychrun and Sergachev. I goto a lot of Ice Dog games. Next year I might start recording the prospects people want to see the most on this forum and uploading them.

I think it would definitely help Risto having another Finnish dman back there as well. Would be cool to see them on the international level too. Maybe they will become best friends and take hometown discounts to play together. One can hope!

 

[OkimLom]

Thought this would be more relevant here.

So did Chychrun lose all of his hockey sense this season? Because from my viewings he is good at everything else. Chychrun was also the first overall pick in the 2014 OHL Priority Selection.

In 14-15, In 42 games for the Sting, Chychrun scored 16 goals and added 17 assists for 33 points. he was named to the league’s First All-Rookie Team, and to the OHL Third All-Star Team.

In 15-16 he put up 49 pts in 62 games which puts him in similar categories of Ekblad, Petro, and Jones. He also was a +23 and put up 8 pts in 7 playoff games this year.

He was ranked #2 in September, #5 in January and #9 in May. I think Chychrun massive decline has to do with not making the world junior team where we saw players massively shoot up the list due to impressive showings.

http://www.tsn.ca/elite-prospect-mat...nking-1.364099

http://www.tsn.ca/tsn-mid-season-dra...three-1.435206

http://www.tsn.ca/laine-closes-gap-o...kings-1.478128

I think part of it is that some people think he didn't progress as well as some wanted him to, and add the perception of him by a loud minority that he didn't "make" Team Canada for the WJC, and the thought was he was playing bad. The games I saw he was Sarnia's go to guy for all roles and when he was asked to cover the best players of the other teams he sacrificed a lot of the freedom he had from the past season.

Couple that with other players playing well and having really good seasons and I can understand the drop, but I personally don't agree with it.

Honestly, I hope it causes him to drop to us and I will be ecstatic if we pick him.

 

[EichHart]

I think part of it is that some people think he didn't progress as well as some wanted him to, and add the perception of him by a loud minority that he didn't "make" Team Canada for the WJC, and the thought was he was playing bad. The games I saw he was Sarnia's go to guy for all roles and when he was asked to cover the best players of the other teams he sacrificed a lot of the freedom he had from the past season.

Couple that with other players playing well and having really good seasons and I can understand the drop, but I personally don't agree with it.

Honestly, I hope it causes him to drop to us and I will be ecstatic if we pick him.

He has a great slap shot and really nice wrist shot. Think he would be a great PP QB. His shot and speed are his best assets.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l9yk5f2xdkk

 

[1972]

Good to hear. Still sticking with the Hamhuis comparable?

I'm not necessarily using Hamhuis as a direct comparable per say. I just think that's the type of impact Juolevi will have in the NHL but better offensively. A guy who plays around 25 minutes per night on your top pair and chips in offensively here and there. He's a tremendous skater and puck mover, and is so calm under pressure so it really wouldn't surprise me if he became a No.1 guy either. Remember he is still built like a bean pole while guys like Chychrun and Seragachev dominant physically.

 

[Ethan Edwards]

He's a tremendous skater and puck mover, and is so calm under pressure so it really wouldn't surprise me if he became a No.1 guy either. Remember he is still built like a bean pole while guys like Chychrun and Seragachev dominant physically.

These traits are why I'm higher on Juolevi than most, though I haven't seen all of his games. I also think he's the top Dman at this point. Apologies to Sweden, but he shares a lot of the traits of a circa 1989 Lidstrom whaaa?. Yeah, I said it...but obviously I'm not comparing Juolevi to 2009 Lidstrom, a runaway HOFer. But the time-of-draft frame (tall and thin), skating, positional smarts, first passing, and overall in-game intelligence shows some elements to get excited about. I've crashed and burned with some assessments before, and I'll fail again, plus Juolevi will require more seasoning, but I like the potential I see.

 

[Push Dr Tracksuit]

These traits are why I'm higher on Juolevi than most, though I haven't seen all of his games. I also think he's the top Dman at this point. Apologies to Sweden, but he shares a lot of the traits of a circa 1989 Lidstrom whaaa?. Yeah, I said it...but obviously I'm not comparing Juolevi to 2009 Lidstrom, a runaway HOFer. But the time-of-draft frame (tall and thin), skating, positional smarts, first passing, and overall in-game intelligence shows some elements to get excited about. I've crashed and burned with some assessments before, and I'll fail again, plus Juolevi will require more seasoning, but I like the potential I see.

I think Joulevi has the least potential of the top D prospects, but I'm also fine with us drafting a pure defensive stalwart in the top 10, I know that makes other peoples stomachs turn but if I'm drafting a 22min a night guy that plays top competition and only scores 15pts a season I really don't care if we found him at 8 or 88 that's a core player

 

[Revelate]

I'm not necessarily using Hamhuis as a direct comparable per say. I just think that's the type of impact Juolevi will have in the NHL but better offensively. A guy who plays around 25 minutes per night on your top pair and chips in offensively here and there. He's a tremendous skater and puck mover, and is so calm under pressure so it really wouldn't surprise me if he became a No.1 guy either. Remember he is still built like a bean pole while guys like Chychrun and Seragachev dominant physically.

The only "issue" i have with him is that he's seldom under pressure. In the games i've seen he hasn't been matched up against other teams top competition. he seems to see a fair amount of O-zone starts as well. It's not really a reason to dump on him, but it does give me pause before making comparisons to Chychrun, who plays ridiculously tough minutes. It's part of the reason i have a tough time using the WJC as an argument in Juolevi's favor. He's a player who really benefits from the open ice and having more time to make decisions.

 

[1972]

The only "issue" i have with him is that he's seldom under pressure. In the games i've seen he hasn't been matched up against other teams top competition. he seems to see a fair amount of O-zone starts as well. It's not really a reason to dump on him, but it does give me pause before making comparisons to Chychrun, who plays ridiculously tough minutes. It's part of the reason i have a tough time using the WJC as an argument in Juolevi's favor. He's a player who really benefits from the open ice and having more time to make decisions.

The whole tough minutes thing is so over blown in junior hockey. There are so many factors involved in how a player is used that its not even worth it. Alot of the top players don't defend very well, and most games are pretty open especially in the regular season.

 

[tsujimoto74]

I don't see how Juolevi's potential is limited compared to the other D. He's not quite as skilled as Chychrun/Sergachev, but he's got great IQ. It seems for more plausible for a prospect to develop better skills than to develop better hockey IQ.

 

[Ethan Edwards]

I think Joulevi has the least potential of the top D prospects, but I'm also fine with us drafting a pure defensive stalwart in the top 10, I know that makes other peoples stomachs turn but if I'm drafting a 22min a night guy that plays top competition and only scores 15pts a season I really don't care if we found him at 8 or 88 that's a core player

My opinion of him is higher and clearly very lonely, but I stand by it until he goes all Zagrapan on us (or someone else). Either way, we disagree with the road but agree with the destination, so if I read you correctly we'd both be happy with him for different reasons. For me personally, he's the only Dman I'd take at the 8 spot.

 

[stokes84]

The only "issue" i have with him is that he's seldom under pressure. In the games i've seen he hasn't been matched up against other teams top competition. he seems to see a fair amount of O-zone starts as well. It's not really a reason to dump on him, but it does give me pause before making comparisons to Chychrun, who plays ridiculously tough minutes. It's part of the reason i have a tough time using the WJC as an argument in Juolevi's favor. He's a player who really benefits from the open ice and having more time to make decisions.

I'm confused. You don't want to use the WJC as an argument in favor of Juolevi because Chychrun didn't get to see those match ups? In the WJC, those match ups are superior to anything thrown at you in juniors and he aced that test. You can't knock him for not playing in hard situations, while disregarding a time where he saw the hardest situations.

 

[OkimLom]

The whole tough minutes thing is so over blown in junior hockey. There are so many factors involved in how a player is used that its not even worth it. Alot of the top players don't defend very well, and most games are pretty open especially in the regular season.

I think it can be over blown as well, but you should factor it in when evaluating players. It's not the end all be all, but should be included when discussing a player.

 

[OkimLom]

I'm confused. You don't want to use the WJC as an argument in favor of Juolevi because Chychrun didn't get to see those match ups? In the WJC, those match ups are superior to anything thrown at you in juniors and he aced that test. You can't knock him for not playing in hard situations, while disregarding a time where he saw the hardest situations.

I agree with this.

 

[1972]

I think it can be over blown as well, but you should factor it in when evaluating players. It's not the end all be all, but should be included when discussing a player.

Ok that's fair, but you can't just look at two different players in junior hockey in completely different situations and jump to conclusions.

 

[Revelate]

I'm confused. You don't want to use the WJC as an argument in favor of Juolevi because Chychrun didn't get to see those match ups? In the WJC, those match ups are superior to anything thrown at you in juniors and he aced that test. You can't knock him for not playing in hard situations, while disregarding a time where he saw the hardest situations.

I discredit it because like I said, i think the large ice surface benefits a player of Juolevi's skillset more than most. I don't totally throw it out, but i emphasize is OHL play much more.

 

[Revelate]

Ok that's fair, but you can't just look at two different players in junior hockey in completely different situations and jump to conclusions.

I don't think I was jumping to conclusions, but I it's something i consider. I'm not sure if i have my mind totally made up on the two. I just think the whole Chychrun hockey IQ thing has been overblown. He plays a ton of minutes against the other teams best players. There will be mistakse because there are more opportunities for mistakes. I actually think Chychrun's poise in the defensive zone is comparable to Juoelvi's. i have some concerns about his decision making/creativity on offense, but then again he is more physically gifted than Juolevi. Juolevi's production also seems a bit low for the caliber of his team. It's a tough one for me.

 

[hizzoner]

For someone who has seen him play--is Jake Bean a Karlsson type or more like Brennan or Leduc?

 

[1972]

For someone who has seen him play--is Jake Bean a Karlsson type or more like Brennan or Leduc?

That's a pretty ridiculous gap, your talking Multiple Norris trophies or AHLers...

 

[Revelate]

That's a pretty ridiculous gap, your talking Multiple Norris trophies or AHLers...

Yeah, i'm not sure how to take that question. Are you essentially asking if he sucks or nah?

 

[hizzoner]

I assume he is somewhere in between. I kind of get he is the offensive version of Pysyk but without his defensive sense. We have had offensive D picks that looked really good on paper as suggested. I figure he is better than them based on scouting reports but hello Brennan, Gauthier Leduc, Persson etc. On the other hand Subban, Karlsson have been similarly touted but with defensive caveats. If the first group is 0 and the latter are 10 where in the continuum does Bean fit according to posters who have seen him multiple times. I am pegging Juolevi at 7.5 B as an example.

 

[Jim Carr's Rug]

I kind of get he is the offensive version of Pysyk but without his defensive sense.

That just blew my mind.

Offensive version of a defensive IQ player, without the defensive sense leaves you with...
Nobody.

 

[hizzoner]

That just blew my mind.

Offensive version of a defensive IQ player, without the defensive sense leaves you with...
Nobody.

What worries me....Pysyk is great skater who has NEVER put up points-despite his skills with the Oil Kings, Amerks or Sabres. He has excellent gap control and positioning. Bean is said to be similar in size and temperament with similar outstanding skating, who puts up points but is a mess in his own end. Or that is what I read into various reports. I have not seen him. From the responses no one seems to be in a position to opine from personal viewing.