2014 - 2015 Coyotes Roster Part 13

[Mosby]

^ The Doan fill-in.

Depending on how many rookies we want to roll with next season, Samuelsson could fit as 4RW. Right now though I have him starting in the 'A'.

 

[Plub]

If the Coyotes failed Gormley (not saying they did) then the failure was at the AHL level for not developing him over two years to be able to play at NHL speed, or adjust his game to compensate for what he lacks in speed and quickness.

I have never been impressed with our AHL coaching staff, and would love to see a change in Springfield next year.

They definitely should take a large part of the blame. But then again, if he was going to be a great defenseman he would overcome poor development. I'm done with Gormley. If he pans out, great. If he doesn't, oh well.

He's on my indifferent list.

 

[XX]

if he was going to be a great defenseman he would overcome poor development.

No.

There are only a handful of players in a draft that can survive poor developmental systems. Everybody else needs coaching and support.

Given that the Coyotes 'system' has produced little in the way of forward talent or really marked improvement in any prospect, the blame should fall on the system.

 

[RemoAZ]

No.

There are only a handful of players in a draft that can survive poor developmental systems. Everybody else needs coaching and support.

Given that the Coyotes 'system' has produced little in the way of forward talent or really marked improvement in any prospect, the blame should fall on the system.

The difference between the best organizations and everybody else.

 

[Prongo]

What does your defense look like for next year?

 

[IPreferPi]

What does your defense look like for next year?

Right now, my educated guess will be:

OEL - Stone
Dahlbeck - Murphy
Moore - ??
Gormley
Samuelsson (AHL)

We could really use a Top 4 RHD with size. Wouldn't be surprised if we went after Petry in the offseason.

I'm expecting either one of Moore or Gormley to be traded in the offseason to address other needs, but as of now they'd be battling for that 3LD spot.

 

[Prongo]

Hmm your team looks like it will need to spend quite a lot to get to the floor. I'm just thinking out loud here but what about MacDonald being traded to your team? He would give you a top 4(minutes wise) locked up for 5 more years. I couldn't see any GM running a defense like you just proposed.

Murphy has 101 NHL games played
Moore has 228 but I honestly think he is terrible.
Dahlbeck has 21 NHL games played
Gormely has 32 NHL games played.

You would have a lot of inexperienced players back there.

Don't kill me for the idea because I know how MacDonald is perceived around the league. I think it makes some kind of reasonable sense to see if there is a match here though. I actually believe we will be in talks with Arizona about Prongers cap as well. Hextall tried to move it this summer but was unsuccessful. He said he talked to a few teams interested, I believe Arizona was and will be one of them.

 

[Mosby]

No interest in MacDonald. Besides, we need a RHD, not another lefty. I suppose Luke Schenn or Grossmann make sense in that regard.

 

[Prongo]

No interest in MacDonald. Besides, we need a RHD, not another lefty. I suppose Luke Schenn or Grossmann make sense in that regard.

Luke Schenn is a righty and I would trade him. Not that he is that bad we just acquired Gudas who will be our third pairing defender next year at 900K.

MacDonald can play the right side. Grossmann is a lefty and generally plays the left side.

 

[Mosby]

Not sure why I was thinking Grossmann is a RHD. In any event, for Schenn, I'd be interested but I'd have a few concerns:

1. He's a 25-year-old added to an already young D
2. Like the above, it means one of Stone, Murphy, or Schenn plays with OEL
3. Most importantly, is Luke Schenn still an effective NHL defenseman?

I'd be interested, but certainly wouldn't pay much.

 

[Etch]

Luke Schenn is a righty and I would trade him. Not that he is that bad we just acquired Gudas who will be our third pairing defender next year at 900K.

MacDonald can play the right side. Grossmann is a lefty and generally plays the left side.

Don't want MacDonald and don't want to go anywhere near Luke with a ten foot pole. Don't know much about Grossmann.

I don't see the Flyers as a realistic partner in a trade that involves them giving us defenseman.

 

[IPreferPi]

I actually believe we will be in talks with Arizona about Prongers cap as well. Hextall tried to move it this summer but was unsuccessful. He said he talked to a few teams interested, I believe Arizona was and will be one of them.

I won't mind helping you (or Boston) out with your cap problems, but I do expect a decent sweetener be thrown our way as compensation.

 

[Plub]

No.

There are only a handful of players in a draft that can survive poor developmental systems. Everybody else needs coaching and support.

Given that the Coyotes 'system' has produced little in the way of forward talent or really marked improvement in any prospect, the blame should fall on the system.

Well, it isn't as though the guy hasn't gotten coaching and support, that's a bit of a stretch. Perhaps he didn't have perfect development, but we have other defensemen making significant strides and they came from the same system.

This isn't a white or black argument. One can put blame both on the player and the system.

 

[XX]

Well, it isn't as though the guy hasn't gotten coaching and support,

You know what I meant. It's the quality of the coaching and support that matters. Isn't Steve Sullivan the first full time developmental coach that the Coyotes have had? What has really been done about his skating? When the system is essentially a black hole, I find it hard to blame the players.

This isn't a white or black argument. One can put blame both on the player and the system.

Players can squeak on to the parent team's roster and survive. That's what we're seeing with Murphy. He's not really ready and ideally should be down. But the Coyotes have a pressing need, and the system sucks. I think everyone knows that at this point.

I don't see much progression in the guys that go to the AHL and come back up. The young D are starting to stagnate. Really, it's a coaching issue. Playfair needs to be fired.

 

[Etch]

Murphy and Stone are our only 2 right handed defenseman. They have guaranteed spots no matter what and get to play without being worried about being benched or scolded. Not really fair to point to them as examples of the system working. We have no choice but to play them. (Having said that I've been pleasantly surprised with both. How much of their success comes from coaching vs getting NHL reps in?)

Not the case with Gormley or any of the LHD.

 

[Sinurgy]

This isn't a white or black argument. One can put blame both on the player and the system.

One can and one should because it's almost always the case.

 

[ck26]

Players can squeak on to the parent team's roster and survive. That's what we're seeing with Murphy. He's not really ready and ideally should be down. But the Coyotes have a pressing need, and the system sucks. I think everyone knows that at this point.

I don't see much progression in the guys that go to the AHL and come back up. The young D are starting to stagnate. Really, it's a coaching issue. Playfair needs to be fired.

Murphy and Stone are our only 2 right handed defenseman. They have guaranteed spots no matter what and get to play without being worried about being benched or scolded. Not really fair to point to them as examples of the system working. We have no choice but to play them. (Having said that I've been pleasantly surprised with both. How much of their success comes from coaching vs getting NHL reps in?)

Not the case with Gormley or any of the LHD.

You guys are remembering this wrong. Murphy played 30 games last season, 26 of which were before the Olympic break when we were actually good. Michalek and Morris and Rundblad and Schlemko and Summers were all here. He made it here on his own merits, and on a two-way contract ahead of other guys (Rundblad) who were on one-ways.

 

[Mosby]

I won't mind helping you (or Boston) out with your cap problems, but I do expect a decent sweetener be thrown our way as compensation.

I'm for adding Savard w/ a sweetener if it's a move where we're allocating excess cap, not just simply climbing to the floor. I.E., if we've already spent above the floor and then Boston wants to pay us to take Savard? Sure. Otherwise though, I think it's an ugly message to the fans. Let's first focus our cap on players who can actually play. Of course, it always depends on what sort of asset the Bruins would staple to Savard.

 

[Mosby]

You guys are remembering this wrong. Murphy played 30 games last season, 26 of which were before the Olympic break when we were actually good. Michalek and Morris and Rundblad and Schlemko and Summers were all here. He made it here on his own merits, and on a two-way contract ahead of other guys (Rundblad) who were on one-ways.

And Stone even played a pair of games during the 2012 run.

 

[IPreferPi]

I'm for adding Savard w/ a sweetener if it's a move where we're allocating excess cap, not just simply climbing to the floor. I.E., if we've already spent above the floor and then Boston wants to pay us to take Savard? Sure. Otherwise though, I think it's an ugly message to the fans. Let's first focus our cap on players who can actually play. Of course, it always depends on what sort of asset the Bruins would staple to Savard.

I don't think (well at least I hope) that Barroway will clamp down on spending next season, especially if we get McEichel. But I agree with the principle of your sentiment - if we do end up taking a LTIR cap dump like Savard/Pronger just to reach the cap floor and then we ice another tank-worthy bottom feeder, we should be angry about it. But if we are going to make an effort to spend a decent team and Boston/Philly is willing to throw a reward for any team willing to help them out of their cap issues, why not take the deal?

 

[hbk]

I'm all for acquiring long term assets if it means we have to bury another team's problem contract. If it's just an exercise though to hit the cap floor then absolutely not. I want to see us hold another team for ransom here.

 

[DesertDawg]

I'm for adding Savard w/ a sweetener if it's a move where we're allocating excess cap, not just simply climbing to the floor. I.E., if we've already spent above the floor and then Boston wants to pay us to take Savard? Sure. Otherwise though, I think it's an ugly message to the fans. Let's first focus our cap on players who can actually play. Of course, it always depends on what sort of asset the Bruins would staple to Savard.

Doesn't the arena agreement have a vague statement about icing a competitive team? The payroll being significant less than the cap floor may be view as a violation of that agreement. I don't think Barroway wants to go there in his 1st full season.
And as far as Savard, he doesn't count against the cap for the season, so I don't see them giving up an asset just to get rid of him. The only feasible scenario is if Savard was included with a contract that the Bruins are willing to trade. IMO, I would rather the Coyotes go after one of the Bruins UFAs than make a trade like this. Why help them?

 

[XX]

Or, you know, the whole forfeiting your share of revenue if you are below the floor thing...

 

[Mosby]

Doesn't the arena agreement have a vague statement about icing a competitive team? The payroll being significant less than the cap floor may be view as a violation of that agreement. I don't think Barroway wants to go there in his 1st full season.
And as far as Savard, he doesn't count against the cap for the season, so I don't see them giving up an asset just to get rid of him. The only feasible scenario is if Savard was included with a contract that the Bruins are willing to trade. IMO, I would rather the Coyotes go after one of the Bruins UFAs than make a trade like this. Why help them?

My understanding is that Savard counts against the cap in the summer. The Bruins aren't able to put him on LTIR until opening night, at which time he wouldn't count against the cap. You can go 10% above the cap in the summer, but the Bruins may need the added space of no Savard as early as this summer.

 

[Jakey53]

No.

There are only a handful of players in a draft that can survive poor developmental systems. Everybody else needs coaching and support.

Given that the Coyotes 'system' has produced little in the way of forward talent or really marked improvement in any prospect, the blame should fall on the system.

Murphy and Stone are doing just fine, and all three came up in the same system. Looks like Lessio and HS are developing just fine. I think the biggest problem was our drafting, which I think is now much better, which gives you better prospects. I'm not an Edward fan, at all, and if we had someone else, who knows, maybe our development would have bee better, or not.