2013 Winter Classic: Hosted by Wings? Sharks or Toronto Involved?

[Brodie]

the optics at Comerica Park are fine, the skyline views are great. But the potential for Michigan Stadium means it will likely be considered a letdown.

 

[CHRDANHUTCH]

I still have to disagree, Brodie. Winter Classic will happen either way, either at Mich Stadium or Comerica. Heck, if all the U of M fans feel divided, the MSU fans can always pick up the excess tickets for the Wings game.


And seriously, if U of M is worrying about a possibility of a bowl game next year as a factor in whether or not to let the league use Michigan Stadium--- I'm not sure what to say to that. Those ratings will be affected because the Wings are sponsoring the WC. In effect, you seem to be admitting as well that Michigan Stadium being the host venue would have a greater impact on ratings than a Comerica site. Isn't that what the NHL should want?

Don't forget about Spartan Stadium and in Michigan circles, isn't the times for both the NCAA OUTDOOR CLASSICS involved Michigan State, it's rare for one state to have 2 major universities, rather than Comerica, Fugu....

 

[Brodie]

East Lansing is twice as far from Detroit as Ann Arbor, which is considered to be in the Detroit CMA. Plus Spartan Stadium much smaller and nowhere near as well known or scenic as Michigan Stadium, which would defeat the whole purpose.

Generally people in the Detroit area would consider U-M to be local while they'd consider to MSU to be in a different part of the state... I have a feeling nobody's driving 100 miles for the Winter Classic.

 

[Fugu]

Don't forget about Spartan Stadium and in Michigan circles, isn't the times for both the NCAA OUTDOOR CLASSICS involved Michigan State, it's rare for one state to have 2 major universities, rather than Comerica, Fugu....

Yeah, like Brodie said, it's a bit further out, just too far to be considered part of metro Detroit. I'm about 35 minutes from the airport and then continue for another 20 minutes to get to Joe Louis from AA. To get to Spartyville, I need to go in the opposite direction (northerly and west). It's 55-65 miles, depending on the route you choose. In fact, Ann Arbor would the only place that's somewhat equidistant from Detroit and Lansing.


Edit: Financially for Ilitch, it makes sense to use Comerica and to get some mileage for the Tigers out of it, but I agree it would be a letdown to not use Michigan Stadium. There are so many story lines that could be used, and Ann Arbor just has a ton more appeal than Detroit (city). It has those intangibles network marketers could spin in all sorts of ways. Disappointing for me (as a Wings fan) if they opt for the boring/predictable option. I still think they could make a ton more money by using Mich Stadium simply due to capacity.

 

[DanZ]

In September, October or November, I have no issue with driving to Ann Arbor. But in early January? There was a huge snowfall here the year of the inaugural classic... in those conditions I'd imagine a fan in Royal Oak would rather head downtown, for example. And if Michigan was playing at the same time? Forget about it.

And, of course, it must be mentioned that there would be no students at this game which takes away ~20,000 people who attend every football game and contributed to that Big Chill crowd.

Huh? I bet a lot of those students end up at the game..

 

[AdmiralsFan24]

Huh? I bet a lot of those students end up at the game..

I'm guessing a lot of them will be home for their break and the ones who stay it would depend on how much the tickets are and whether or not they're fans. Either way, I don't think anywhere close to 20,000 college students would be at the game. Maybe 1,000.

 

[Hivemind]

http://www.calgarysun.com/2012/01/02/calgary-edmonton-world-juniors-on-verge-of-new-profit-high

More proof Wings might host WC next season, perhaps at Illich-owned/controlled Comerica Park.

The article also mentions Washington hosting one in the next year or two.

 

[silkyjohnson50]

I'm guessing a lot of them will be home for their break and the ones who stay it would depend on how much the tickets are and whether or not they're fans. Either way, I don't think anywhere close to 20,000 college students would be at the game. Maybe 1,000.

10,000+ had no problem attending yesterday's basketball game. And i'm pretty sure the Winter Classic would be more of a draw than an early January game against Minnesota.

Many people would want to attend just to say that they were there, regardless of how much they follow hockey.

 

[AdmiralsFan24]

10,000+ had no problem attending yesterday's basketball game. And i'm pretty sure the Winter Classic would be more of a draw than an early January game against Minnesota.

Many people would want to attend just to say that they were there, regardless of how much they follow hockey.

So 10,000 students were at a Michigan basketball game in the 12,721 seat Crisler Arena? I find that hard to believe.

Even if that were the case what if some of those students are from out of state? Say they're from Houston. Do you think random college student from Houston is going to care that the Red Wings are playing whoever in the Winter Classic at Michigan Stadium and they have to get tickets to that game? I doubt it.

 

[silkyjohnson50]

So 10,000 students were at a Michigan basketball game in the 12,721 seat Crisler Arena? I find that hard to believe.

Even if that were the case what if some of those students are from out of state? Say they're from Houston. Do you think random college student from Houston is going to care that the Red Wings are playing whoever in the Winter Classic at Michigan Stadium and they have to get tickets to that game? I doubt it.

Is a random student from Houston going to stay to watch it? Maybe not. But for every UoM student that is back home in Houston, i can promise you that seat would be quickly picked up by the local Michigan State, Central Michigan, Western Michigan, etc. student that would be back home themself.

I'm telling you, selling tickets for a WC game at the Big House would not be an issue.

 

[Brodie]

yeah, all my friends at UM and other local schools were just loaded with the kind of disposable income it takes to attend a hockey game like this a week after Christmas! Combined that with the number of kids home for break and you end up with an unlikely scenario.

There'd almost certainly be an arrangement for UM STHs like we've seen in past WCs, though. And this still looks incredibly unlikely to happen

 

[Kane One]

http://www.calgarysun.com/2012/01/02/calgary-edmonton-world-juniors-on-verge-of-new-profit-high

More proof Wings might host WC next season, perhaps at Illich-owned/controlled Comerica Park.

Do you have any older articles on Detroit getting the next WC? Because I see the phrase "more proof" where I never heard anything about Detroit getting it before this, but that's because I never looked.

 

[Ola]

The NHL is a business.

It should be in NYC.

 

[LadyStanley]

http://sports.yahoo.com/nhl/blog/pu...013-where-will-the-Winter-Cla?urn=nhl-wp21472

Puck Daddy on the "open assumption" that Detroit will be hosting WC next year, the $$ "printing" to the NHL from merchandise sales, Big House vs Comerica, and who the opponent might be.

 

[Drake1588]

The NHL is a business.

It should be in NYC.

The fact that Yankee Stadium signed up long term to host a bowl game torpedoed a NYC Winter Classic for years, with the existence of a long line of teams eager to host. The NHL clearly wants it at that venue. Yet everyone acknowledges that the right way to do this is to put down the ice well in advance to set, and have a week of community events focused around the sheet of ice, from player and team events, to old timers' games, etc.

A bowl game on January 1st at Yankee Stadium means none of that is possible. The NHL doesn't want it in New Jersey, so the football stadiums are out, and certainly not in Central Park, where you can't erect enough seats to sell tickets and make the kind of money off the thing that you can in a baseball or football stadium. Now you could do it at Citi Field in Queens instead of Yankee Stadium in the Bronx, but it's probable that the NHL wants to latch on to the old timey appeal of Yankee Stadium.

As soon as they can get it, if they can get it, my guess is the NHL puts the Rangers against who cares? at Yankee Stadium to the very top of the list.

Comerica in 2013 and Nationals Park in 2014 would be my guess. Maybe Yankee Stadium in 2015.

 

[TheMoreYouKnow]

The fact that Yankee Stadium signed up long term to host a bowl game torpedoed a NYC Winter Classic for years, with the existence of a long line of teams eager to host. The NHL clearly wants it at that venue. Yet everyone acknowledges that the right way to do this is to put down the ice well in advance to set, and have a week of community events focused around the sheet of ice, from player and team events, to old timers' games, etc.

A bowl game on January 1st at Yankee Stadium means none of that is possible. The NHL doesn't want it in New Jersey, so the football stadiums are out, and certainly not in Central Park, where you can't erect enough seats to sell tickets and make the kind of money off the thing that you can in a baseball or football stadium. Now you could do it at Citi Field in Queens instead of Yankee Stadium in the Bronx, but it's probable that the NHL wants to latch on to the old timey appeal of Yankee Stadium.

As soon as they can get it, if they can get it, my guess is the NHL puts the Rangers against who cares? at Yankee Stadium to the very top of the list.

Comerica in 2013 and Nationals Park in 2014 would be my guess. Maybe Yankee Stadium in 2015.

Rangers vs. Isles would be a gamble but one worth taking in my view. New York is the biggest prize as far as markets go and the Isles can use the publicity boost as much as any team in the league.

 

[Drake1588]

The Rangers at Yankee Stadium is going to be such a ratings bonanza that it probably doesn't matter who they play, to be honest. I suspect that it will be such a huge success that they'll be planning how soon they can go back as soon as it's over, it will be that great on every level. Islanders would work, but the slam dunk nature also gives the league the ability to think outside the box a bit, and appeal to those markets underserved, who don't support the Winter Classic as much as they would if their fans and media felt fully vested in it.

So you could take a Western team with many fans, like a Sharks or a Colorado. The West perennially feels jilted by the East Coast Bias of the NHL's head office. You also have the opportunity to cater to the Canadian markets. You could go with the Canucks, a very good team, but why not an Original Six opponent, in Toronto or Montreal? The Rangers draw all over the US, while Toronto and Montreal draw from all over Canada.

Either way, you can't miss with a Rangers/Yankee Stadium combo.

 

[Law]

Rangers vs. Isles would be a gamble but one worth taking in my view. New York is the biggest prize as far as markets go and the Isles can use the publicity boost as much as any team in the league.

Would be interesting, esp if in a few years Tavares, KO, Hamonic, etc have the rebuild on the right track. Don't think it will happen, but who knows.

If the NHL really wanted to get nuts, would love to see a home-and-home with the Rangers and Isles. Dec 31st at Citi Field and Jan 1st at Yankee Stadium. Not quite the day-night doubleheaders that the Yankees and Mets have staged in two different parks, but it would be electric none the less.

Again, don't see the Isles getting an invite (and I say that as a die-hard/suffering Islander fan), but one can dream.

 

[GKJ]

Next 3 years:

Detroit (vs. Chicago or St. Louis)
Washington (vs. Boston or Pittsburgh. Hopefully Boston)
New York (vs. Pittsburgh or LA)

Probably in that order. After that you might be going back to cities that have had it already.


I don't see Rangers vs. Islanders because the NHL would want more than one market, and the Islanders don't have the stability.

 

[LadyStanley]

Considering not one team west of the Mississippi (much less the Rockies) has participated, that a whole bunch of the western NHL teams that aren't even given a chance.

St Louis is the farthest west of those teams just listed.

NHL is really pissing me off by concentrating on NE/ATL teams.

There's also an apparent requirement that the team be a perennial (or close to) playoff participant (which is a strike against Toronto and Islanders).

NOT to include a team that's won a President's trophy, and their division (every year since the lockout) is ludicrous.

 

[Law]

Considering not one team west of the Mississippi (much less the Rockies) has participated, that a whole bunch of the western NHL teams that aren't even given a chance.

St Louis is the farthest west of those teams just listed.

NHL is really pissing me off by concentrating on NE/ATL teams.

There's also an apparent requirement that the team be a perennial (or close to) playoff participant (which is a strike against Toronto and Islanders).

NOT to include a team that's won a President's trophy, and their division (every year since the lockout) is ludicrous.

Fair point, but outside of the first one (which was really just an experiment), it's never been about rewarding a team, etc. The main goal is maximize the marketability of the event with perhaps a long term goal of turning the thing into a Super Bowl type of experience.*



*Just to clarify, I don't mean compete on the same level as the Super Bowl from a ratings or monetary perspective, rather I'm referring to the part about the two participants in the game being generally irrelevant. No one cancels a Super Bowl party because team 'x' and team 'y' are playing.

 

[Brodie]

New York will get theirs, it'll just take time. The last thing that event will need is to be rushed... can you imagine the game at a venue like the Yale Bowl or, god forbid, Army's Stadium? It would kill the whole purpose. Having New York as that ace up their sleeve keeps the whole thing fresh for longer.

Detroit has the largest fanbase of any American team, while I imagine next year will feature Washington against Pittsburgh again. Boston vs New York at Yankee Stadium is the dream scenario for the league and they need to be patient and let it all come together. After that, all of the obvious ratings driven matchups will have been used.

As for the Sharks... it's not about rewarding teams and never has been. It's about optics and attractiveness and the reality is that the eastern/great lakes teams are the ones with the biggest fanbases and the most history and thus the biggest draws. Putting the Sharks out there might make for a great hockey game, but it won't make Joe Sportsfan from Ohio or New York State watch hockey over college football... and the game would have to be at 10 am local time in San Jose, thus hurting the ratings even further. Although, if they wore Seals jerseys I would be all for it.

 

[Malpraktis]

Toronto vs. Wings @ Michigan Stadium (2 original 6, a Canadian team thrown in, and a ton of history)

Or MTL vs. Tor Heritage and Wings vs. Sharks or Wild, or Van vs. CHI, or BOS vs. WSH,

It's a business, they want the ones they can sell out, and that's really Original 6 or Canada or PHI/PIT/TBL/SJS (But SJS/TBL can't ever host.)

 

[CHRDANHUTCH]

Toronto vs. Wings @ Michigan Stadium (2 original 6, a Canadian team thrown in, and a ton of history)

Or MTL vs. Tor Heritage and Wings vs. Sharks or Wild, or Van vs. CHI, or BOS vs. WSH,

It's a business, they want the ones they can sell out, and that's really Original 6 or Canada or PHI/PIT/TBL/SJS (But SJS/TBL can't ever host.)

you'll never see a Canadian team in this, that's why both Alberta teams hosted Heritage Classics.....

rumor that's being floated here is Boston @ Detroit @ Comerica, or as Plan B @ Michigan Stadium (remember NBC just started showing a game on Black Friday, tht just happened to be DET/BOS

 

[Brodie]

http://sports.yahoo.com/nhl/blog/pu...013-where-will-the-Winter-Cla?urn=nhl-wp21472

Puck Daddy on the "open assumption" that Detroit will be hosting WC next year, the $$ "printing" to the NHL from merchandise sales, Big House vs Comerica, and who the opponent might be.

I think the Leafs would be interesting and that the event might be at a point where it could withstand it if only because the Leafs brand is incredibly well known. The Blues still seem more likely to me... it's very safe, but I'd rather have them go safe than take a risk that kills the golden goose.

I'm incredibly scared about the comment re: 24/7's future being in doubt... that's the primary reason for caring about the Winter Classic at this point.