William Nylander Discussion

[White Water Kayker]

I'm not sure if it's the Babcock effect on Rielly, but boy is he shining under Babs. That said I would love to see the Babcock effect (babfx as a stat?) on those 2.
I am one of those people that think mitch needs strengthening, not weight, so as to avoid injury. Obviously there will be injuries and they are not unavoidable, but imo there are some injuries, or a propensity for injury dependent on strength. Ie. RNH's shoulder injury in his rookie year. Imo that wouldn't have happened if he were a bit stronger.
My preference is for Marner to play with the Leafs next year, but only if he is strong enough. A senseless injury could set his development back imo.

I like your post except for the last line.

Really have a hard time seeing Marner making so great a leap in his game and strength in one year to make the NHL on a full-time basis. At best I'd like to see him have a strong camp, get a look at what the Regular Season looks like, then spend time in AHL learning and getting ready.

In kayaking hard rivers, my own personal philosophy when approaching difficult new runs is, I'd rather take off afterward thinking I was a few months overdue than a few months early... Rivers are VERY unforgiving, like the NHL.I think Leaf Mgm't as well as other teams front offices are starting to take that approach to young talent as well, unless it's just so overwhelmingly obvious they belong.

 

[ACC1224]

I like your post except for the last line.

Really have a hard time seeing Marner making so great a leap in his game and strength in one year to make the NHL on a full-time basis. At best I'd like to see him have a strong camp, get a look at what the Regular Season looks like, then spend time in AHL learning and getting ready.

In kayaking hard rivers, my own personal philosophy when approaching difficult new runs is, I'd rather take off afterward thinking I was a few months overdue than a few months early... Rivers are VERY unforgiving, like the NHL.I think Leaf Mgm't as well as other teams front offices are starting to take that approach to young talent as well, unless it's just so overwhelmingly obvious they belong.

FYI - AHL isn't an option for Marner. NHL or back to Jr., I'd bet on NHL.

 

[saltming]

I like your post except for the last line.

Really have a hard time seeing Marner making so great a leap in his game and strength in one year to make the NHL on a full-time basis. At best I'd like to see him have a strong camp, get a look at what the Regular Season looks like, then spend time in AHL learning and getting ready.

In kayaking hard rivers, my own personal philosophy when approaching difficult new runs is, I'd rather take off afterward thinking I was a few months overdue than a few months early... Rivers are VERY unforgiving, like the NHL.I think Leaf Mgm't as well as other teams front offices are starting to take that approach to young talent as well, unless it's just so overwhelmingly obvious they belong.

I think we are saying the same thing.
I said I would like to see him in the nhl IF he is strong enough to avoid injury.
You are saying the same thing right?

 

[White Water Kayker]

FYI - AHL isn't an option for Marner. NHL or back to Jr., I'd bet on NHL.

Ooops, typing on my phone, hit "A" when I meant "O"

 

[White Water Kayker]

I think we are saying the same thing.
I said I would like to see him in the nhl IF he is strong enough to avoid injury.
You are saying the same thing right?

No, not on the NHL bit. I'd rather see him have peak, then go back down next year. Can't imagine it'll hurt him at all.

But yes, I agree with the rest of your post.

 

[saltming]

No, not on the NHL bit. I'd rather see him have peak, then go back down next year. Can't imagine it'll hurt him at all.

But yes, I agree with the rest of your post.

That's fair. I admit that it's a bit selfish of me to want him in the nhl, but I also think babs could accelerate his development than going back to the ohl.
Again only if he's strong enough.

 

[White Water Kayker]

That's fair. I admit that it's a bit selfish of me to want him in the nhl, but I also think babs could accelerate his development than going back to the ohl.
Again only if he's strong enough.

This is where I'm placing a bit more faith in the new mgm't.

I think if he goes back to Junior next year, then has a half season or so in with the Marlies, he'll be moulded just the way they want him by the time he reaches the Leafs, who, by all signs won't be ready for him next year anyway. Or so it looks to me.

This Leaf team needs a LOT of parts, and those won't be coming in one more off-season. I think this is real opportunity to make sure a smaller but highly skilled kid is developed as a Pro before the pressure of Toronto will have to be endured.

I want to see him too, but I have to say, I've waited 45yrs for a real contending organization, I can wait a couple more. Lol

 

[saltming]

This is where I'm placing a bit more faith in the new mgm't.

I think if he goes back to Junior next year, then has a half season or so in with the Marlies, he'll be moulded just the way they want him by the time he reaches the Leafs, who, by all signs won't be ready for him next year anyway. Or so it looks to me.

This Leaf team needs a LOT of parts, and those won't be coming in one more off-season. I think this is real opportunity to make sure a smaller but highly skilled kid is developed as a Pro before the pressure of Toronto will have to be endured.

I want to see him too, but I have to say, I've waited 45yrs for a real contending organization, I can wait a couple more. Lol

See that's where my logical side says yup that's the right way. I'm so conflicted! Haha
As for when the team will be ready I feel they have mature parts in play and ready for next year as they have rookies with pro experience. Nylander has Shl seasons and ahl season (by next year). Soshnikov has 2 years KHL and (by next year) 1 year ahl. Hyman is 24 now and plays a pro game. When we add in the vets kadri jvr winnick komorov we maybe able to 'rebuild' faster than expected.

 

[Tyler Biggs*]

As much as I would like to see him in the big leagues, it would be best to wait. Give Babcock a year to get a system in place that everyone adheres to and then next year maybe add a couple of kids that are ready. It would make more sense in MHO.

 

[thewave]

As much as I would like to see him in the big leagues, it would be best to wait. Give Babcock a year to get a system in place that everyone adheres to and then next year maybe add a couple of kids that are ready. It would make more sense in MHO.

Don't think for a second if this team battles out of the hole and into a playoff position that they won't just give in and bring him up.

At the start I said we would finish with pick 10-16. After the start I figured bottom 5 but... Babcock seems to be the wizard and this could turn the corner quick it seems. Jvr Kadri and Lupul aren't even "hot". If they start scoring and the rest of the team keeps it up we may just squeeze in.

 

[Mess]

Slowly but shirley the Leafs stage is being set for the induction of some youth to the roster and Willie would be near the top of that list when the time is right to inject him.

It most likely going to be post trade deadline or if the leaf run into a rash of injuries in top 6 players.

 

[KGL]

Slowly but shirley the Leafs stage is being set for the induction of some youth to the roster and Willie would be near the top of that list when the time is right to inject him.

It most likely going to be post trade deadline or if the leaf run into a rash of injuries in top 6 players.

I don't see Nylander getting the call post deadline. I think the Leafs will do what they did last season, take back expiring contracts of players that the other team doesn't want (IE Lindstrom, Jokinen, Brewer, Sill, etc). Fill roster spots until the season is over. By that time the Leafs should be at the bottom of the league, with no hope left for the season, might as well let Nylander continue playing with the Marlies where they'll be gearing up for a Calder Cup run.

 

[Leafed]

I don't see Nylander getting the call post deadline. I think the Leafs will do what they did last season, take back expiring contracts of players that the other team doesn't want (IE Lindstrom, Jokinen, Brewer, Sill, etc). Fill roster spots until the season is over. By that time the Leafs should be at the bottom of the league, with no hope left for the season, might as well let Nylander continue playing with the Marlies where they'll be gearing up for a Calder Cup run.

All Nylander has to do in order to be eligible for the Calder Cup is appear in 40 games in the AHL. I see that as the magic number with most of our prospects. Obviously management wants them to make a good run and compete for the championship, so I agree with those who believe he'll be brought in post-deadline. At the C spot, I think Spaling and Bozak will be moved. Enter Arcobello + Nylander.

 

[KGL]

All Nylander has to do in order to be eligible for the Calder Cup is appear in 40 games in the AHL. I see that as the magic number with most of our prospects. Obviously management wants them to make a good run and compete for the championship, so I agree with those who believe he'll be brought in post-deadline. At the C spot, I think Spaling and Bozak will be moved. Enter Arcobello + Nylander.

So the idea is for him to come up for 9 meaningless games at the end of the season? Or even worse, for him to come up for more than 9 meaningless games thus burning a year of his ELC? Doesn't make sense.

 

[Leafed]

So the idea is for him to come up for 9 meaningless games at the end of the season? Or even worse, for him to come up for more than 9 meaningless games thus burning a year of his ELC? Doesn't make sense.

It would give him a taste of Babcock and the NHL before next season. The transition then would not be as drastic, considering Marner's poised to have his first year, not to mention prospects like Brown, Soshnikov, etc.

I don't know how big of a deal the one year off the ELC is. Really, the significance of that is that he becomes one year closer to UFA right? Nylander projects to be a talent that gets locked up longterm anyway.

 

[WTFMAN99]

Talk lately is that Leivo might get the nod as the next Leafs call up.

 

[KGL]

It would give him a taste of Babcock and the NHL before next season. The transition then would not be as drastic, considering Marner's poised to have his first year, not to mention prospects like Brown, Soshnikov, etc.

I don't know how big of a deal the one year off the ELC is. Really, the significance of that is that he becomes one year closer to UFA right? Nylander projects to be a talent that gets locked up longterm anyway.

Phrasing!

I guess I wouldn't be super opposed to him playing nine games after the deadline, but that's it. After that send him back down to the AHL to lead the team to Calder. Burning a year of his ELC would be a big deal, you want to keep top players cost controlled for as long as possible.

 

[saltming]

Talk lately is that Leivo might get the nod as the next Leafs call up.

Well deserved and at the same time I wonder if that designates him as a 'journeyman'?
The management has stated that they will not bring u the young talent to use as stop gaps, so if Leivo gets a call up for injury does that place him in the expendable category?

 

[Pholus]

All Nylander has to do in order to be eligible for the Calder Cup is appear in 40 games in the AHL. I see that as the magic number with most of our prospects. Obviously management wants them to make a good run and compete for the championship, so I agree with those who believe he'll be brought in post-deadline. At the C spot, I think Spaling and Bozak will be moved. Enter Arcobello + Nylander.

I doubt this will happen. Everyone keeps saying that Nylander will come up after the TDL. Do they not remember management saying that the prospects will not be called up until they are ready to stay in the NHL for good? To me, this means that if Nylander gets called up late in the year, he will NOT be returned to the Marlies after the Leafs' season ends, so he wouldn't benefit from any potential Calder Cup run (seeing as he wouldn't be on the team). If they call him up, then send him down, they are yoyo-ing him just like they did with Percy, and Dubas has pledged not to do that anymore.

 

[Leafed]

I doubt this will happen. Everyone keeps saying that Nylander will come up after the TDL. Do they not remember management saying that the prospects will not be called up until they are ready to stay in the NHL for good? To me, this means that if Nylander gets called up late in the year, he will NOT be returned to the Marlies after the Leafs' season ends, so he wouldn't benefit from any potential Calder Cup run (seeing as he wouldn't be on the team). If they call him up, then send him down, they are yoyo-ing him just like they did with Percy, and Dubas has pledged not to do that anymore.

Not when the Leaf season's over and the AHL playoffs are to be had. Look at what the Lightning did, graduating the triplets line after a Calder Cup

 

[Shwaguy*]

Well deserved and at the same time I wonder if that designates him as a 'journeyman'?
The management has stated that they will not bring u the young talent to use as stop gaps, so if Leivo gets a call up for injury does that place him in the expendable category?

If they call Leivo up it will be with the idea in mind that he's staying up. But it's up to him to play that way.

 

[leafsfuture]

Well deserved and at the same time I wonder if that designates him as a 'journeyman'?
The management has stated that they will not bring u the young talent to use as stop gaps, so if Leivo gets a call up for injury does that place him in the expendable category?

Leivo is not 19 or 20. He is 22 and has 2 years in the AHL + 2 medium length stints in the NHL.

As you get to that 3rd and 4th AHL season, the marginal utility you get from being in the minors is less than a guy like Nylander.

Percy to me is in the same category. The benefit to him of the AHL is less than a guy like Valiev

 

[zeke]

Talk lately is that Leivo might get the nod as the next Leafs call up.

has to happen sometime this year.

next year guys like leivo and percy can't be sent down without waivers. we probably want to take look at them before that.

 

[Ovate]

has to happen sometime this year.

next year guys like leivo and percy can't be sent down without waivers. we probably want to take look at them before that.

I believe can bring them up as emergency call ups without exposing them to waivers if someone on the Leafs gets injured, which is bound to happen over the course of the season

 

[Canada4Gold]

If believee can bring them up as emergency call ups without exposing them to waivers if someone on the Leafs gets injured, which is bound to happen over the course of the season

huh? what are you talking about? Nobody requires waivers to be called up, no need for an emergency call up, just call them up normally.

also they're waiver exempt right now so it doesn't matter for this year anyway.

They're not going to yo-yo the prospects so if they do get called up it's for good, not so they can send them back down a few days later like you would do with an emergency callup