Raptors Discussion: v53 | Raps' hostage-free FA signings | Joseph/Carroll presser Thu 9th @10am ET/7am PT

[Swervin81]

Just browsing thru realgm lol

Who will score all are points this year? Especially off the bench? I'm getting the impression we won't be lighting it up. Not that got us far in post season.

Patterson, probably. Ross gets a couple jumpers and Biyombo a putback or 2.

This is a defensive team right now.

 

[Diamond Joe Quimby]

Just browsing thru realgm lol

Who will score all are points this year? Especially off the bench? I'm getting the impression we won't be lighting it up. Not that got us far in post season.

People are going to overreact regarding the lost offense. I'll tell you this though, they will be far more efficient without the chucker twins.

 

[Woodman19]

I just love that we are hording so many young players. Even though they have limited potential it's still nice to have cheap depth options to fortify the core.

 

[trellaine201]

Mmm also googled Lowry and didn't realize him and Casey don't seem to see eye to eye. I think Lowry is very bull headed. Will be interesting to see how this plays out.

I would think Casey has a short leash?

 

[LaPlante94]

Mmm also googled Lowry and didn't realize him and Casey don't seem to see eye to eye. I think Lowry is very bull headed. Will be interesting to see how this plays out.

I would think Casey has a short leash?

I don't think that's true at all. People around here might hate Casey but I think the players love him. He seems like a real players coach especially after watching that series on Sportsnet during the season that followed the Raptors behind the scenes.

 

[Mach85]

Mmm also googled Lowry and didn't realize him and Casey don't seem to see eye to eye. I think Lowry is very bull headed. Will be interesting to see how this plays out.

I would think Casey has a short leash?

Lowry is the guy, no doubt about that. He has come a long way in listening to coaches and not being on his own program so much.

 

[trellaine201]

Ok so you think they can co-exist? I guess this probably happene a lot in all pro sports. Maybe it's overblown. You know media and social networks run rampAnt quite often.

 

[Vexed]

People are going to overreact regarding the lost offense. I'll tell you this though, they will be far more efficient without the chucker twins.

We had a lot of excess offense that needed to be flipped for D. We were turning into Steve Nash's Suns. You can't win with a team like that. Even GS wasn't looking good in the final until they got the defense sorted out.

This team is going to be a lot harder to play against and that's a great thing.

Still need to address the 4 spot though...

 

[Radiohead]

Toronto's biggest chip atm is wooing Wiggens in a few years, the prospect of coming home and playing for a championship in front of his home country is hopefully something that's appealing to him. Toronto never had star home grown talent before, not like James, Rose, LMA, etc, etc... Keeping the place relevant is huge imo and I think most people see the bonus to keeping this team relevant. Tanking or rebuilding at this stage is not an option for this franchise. not now, I am surprised you guys can't see that... I find it strange.

Wiggins is not leaving Minny for a long time. He's under team control for several years and Minny will match any offer given to him when he's a RFA. Why do people keep bringing him up?

 

[canucksfan100]

I think one of DeRozan or Lowry has to go this year. Whether its cause one is too old(Lowry) or too expensive(DeRozan). Other than that, we should try and move up into another top 10 pick by moving our 1st + for a top 15/10 pick. That way we can get Jamal Murray + another guy like Dragan Bender. Build around those two and JV. vTrading into the top 10 or so from our projected slot(19-20 IMO) would prob cost Our 1st + our 1st next year or our 1st + 2 2nds + a player

 

[Hyperglide]

One name that I have not seen mentioned around here (probably for good reason) is Carlos Boozer. If we are unable to trade for a legit starting calibre PF, maybe boozer could split time with 2Pat at the 4 spot. I don't imagine he will be looking for a ton of cash at this point in his career.

Boozer sucks and has sucked for a while. One of the most overrated PF's in the league. He hasn't really been good since he left Utah and had a couple of decent seasons in Cleveland when LeBron was first there.

 

[topched]

We had a lot of excess offense that needed to be flipped for D. We were turning into Steve Nash's Suns. You can't win with a team like that. Even GS wasn't looking good in the final until they got the defense sorted out.

This team is going to be a lot harder to play against and that's a great thing.

Still need to address the 4 spot though...

Agree. You don't need a guy to average nearly 20 points off be bench when you can hold your opponents to less than 100 points. Raps would get absolutely obliterated on the perimiter and dig themselves a double digit hole. That gave way to Lou,GV and the chucking style where it was feast or famine on whether or not you'd get back into the game

 

[The Nemesis]

Regarding the offence, just roughly

Out
Vasquez = 9.5ppg
Williams = 15.5
Amir = 9.3
Hansbrough = 3.6

Fields, Hayes, and Stiemsma are negligible individually. As a group they probably contributed about 1-1.5 ppg for the whole season.

So that's a total of 39.3 ppg from last season out the door.

In
Carrol = 12.6ppg
Joseph = 6.8
Biyombo = 4.8
Wright = 14.5 (NCAA)
Powell = 16.4 (NCAA)

So we've added 24.2ppg last year in the 3 NBA guys. Powell's contributions are probably negligible this year. Wright obviously won't score 10+, but you could probably get 5-6ppg out of him. So that would put our group of incoming players at about 29-30ish ppg.

That means on balance the team has only lost about 9 points per game of production between last year's group and this year's. And you can probably pencil Joseph in for an uptick from his 7ish points if he is indeed getting a more prominent scoring role. So now if he gets to 12ppg, the scoring deficit is only 5 points and that's before potentially addressing the PF hole or the potential for improved contributions from Valanciuas or Ross.

This isn't going to be a top 5 scoring team in the league most likely, but they can probably pick up their defensive play a fair bit and make up for the offensive production lost with defensive ability gained.

Mmm also googled Lowry and didn't realize him and Casey don't seem to see eye to eye. I think Lowry is very bull headed. Will be interesting to see how this plays out.

I would think Casey has a short leash?

That was earlier in Lowry's time. In the last year and a half or so (basically since Lowry's breakout) the two have come to a better understanding and working relationship.

 

[Quares27]

I don't even think we're losing much offense

- Joseph should be able to give us about what Vasquez did
- Ross will give us less than Lou Williams off the bench did but Carroll will give us more than Ross did as a starter
- 2Pat will give us about what Amir did offensively
- Biyombo will give us about the same that Hansbrough/Hayes did
- Everyone else is the same

So other than a few pts dropoff from Lou Will to Ross the loss comes from going from Amir to the next PF. And we don't even know who that will be yet

Also if the team does actually move the ball well then you figure good knockdown shooters like Ross and Patterson will see a rise in their numbers. And hopefully JV can up his numbers a bit if we can actually give him the ball for once

Even then the defense will be a lot better so scoring going down a bit wouldnt matter much if the defensive improvement is more than the loss in scoring which it should be with the guys we added

edit: didn't even see the post above lmao. Basically saying the same thing

 

[topched]

@Chris_Broussard: Sources: Carlos Boozer is in on-going conversations with LAC, SA, Dallas and Toronto


Boozer is not a bad option for us. I know he's bad defensively, but with all the additions we've made I think he would fit in nicely. Can still score the ball, and he brings a nice veteran presence that we lost with Amir.

With PPatt coming of the bench he wouldn't be relied upon too much which probably fits perfectly. I also forgot that Amare is still out there. Not sure what kind of $ he's looking for but again a good volume scorer who is spotty on D at best. Durability similar to Amir

 

[The Nemesis]

@Chris_Broussard: Sources: Carlos Boozer is in on-going conversations with LAC, SA, Dallas and Toronto


Boozer is not a bad option for us. I know he's bad defensively, but with all the additions we've made I think he would fit in nicely. Can still score the ball, and he brings a nice veteran presence that we lost with Amir.

With PPatt coming of the bench he wouldn't be relied upon too much which probably fits perfectly. I also forgot that Amare is still out there. Not sure what kind of $ he's looking for but again a good volume scorer who is spotty on D at best. Durability similar to Amir

It would have to be a low-end contract for either. My numbers had the Raptors around $500k left in cap space, but I've seen other estimates that say they could be up as high as about $4m. It's still not enough to really get into the higher tier of potential tradebait PFs like Lee/Ibaka/maybe Morris, but you might be able to coax a veteran into a "prove-it" type deal where they sign cheap to reestablish their value.

 

[Swervin81]

Ridnour will be waived, so that's $2.9M more space we have.

 

[FreeBird]

The ultimate fate for Ross is hopefully another team's uniform.

Or a sit down with Mike Babcock.

 

[The Nemesis]

Ridnour will be waived, so that's $2.9M more space we have.

That was included in both my count and the $4m number I pulled from other sources. It was always presumed he was gone, so his contract was never really included in the team's cap calculation.

 

[FreeBird]

That was included in both my count and the $4m number I pulled from other sources. It was always presumed he was gone, so his contract was never really included in the team's cap calculation.

I see a 5th year on Lowry's contract, his option or the teams?

 

[Swervin81]

I see a 5th year on Lowry's contract, his option or the teams?

I only see 4 years, but he has an ETO after year 3.

 

[topched]

That was included in both my count and the $4m number I pulled from other sources. It was always presumed he was gone, so his contract was never really included in the team's cap calculation.

True, but if you move Ross or JJ for cap space or picks/futures you may have enough to get a guy like Boozer/West/Amare

Was it confirmed that we used the MLE on Biyombo or is that still tbd/available?

 

[Diamond Joe Quimby]

True, but if you move Ross or JJ for cap space or picks/futures you may have enough to get a guy like Boozer/West/Amare

Was it confirmed that we used the MLE on Biyombo or is that still tbd/available?

Not a great trade off in my opinion. I'd rather go small, and play JJ at the four. Those PWF's are really bad, save for West.

 

[Shwaguy*]

I think one of DeRozan or Lowry has to go this year. Whether its cause one is too old(Lowry) or too expensive(DeRozan). Other than that, we should try and move up into another top 10 pick by moving our 1st + for a top 15/10 pick. That way we can get Jamal Murray + another guy like Dragan Bender. Build around those two and JV. vTrading into the top 10 or so from our projected slot(19-20 IMO) would prob cost Our 1st + our 1st next year or our 1st + 2 2nds + a player

We'll likely have our own top 10 pick next year from the Knicks/Nuggets

 

[Nasty Nazem]

We're talking about Boozer as if he is a real option?

Puke.