Player Discussion Tuukka Rask - V - warning in OP

[Gee Wally]

Be curious to know who you're talking about. Because if you mean me, that's simply patently false. If I need to compile all the player threads where I heap praise on players or coaches, I'm happy to.

Was actually wondering what he'd have to do to make the HOF. One more Vezina and a ring and sustained decent play should do it I'd think?

The fact that you have to ask as well as posted the above just for consideration means no. Not you.

 

[Glove Malfunction]

Legitimately nobody is whining and everyone who has said he's struggled has pretty much admitted that they don't care what he does in the regular season as long as he is good in the playoffs.

This is not rue at all though. There are some who show up in this thread EVERY time Rask let's in a bad goal, and are noticeably absent when he has a bed game. Additionally, they have nothing but negative things to say about Rask. They are very much whining, and it's clear they DO care what he does in the regular season, and comment every time he farts sideways.

 

[Gee Wally]

But even when someone gives credit to the player/team when they're playing well, or explicitly says that even though their opinion is negative that they hope they're proven wrong, then when they are consistent with their opinion and are openly stating that they are posting so as not to be labeled an "only shows up when ____ is struggling" later on when it turns, then even that is considered trolling. That's the environment that's created when any unpopular post is deemed trolling, no matter how many facts or statistics you give to support your opinion.

So those people who only show up when the player is struggling have no choice, because if they show up and give their take any other time, their posting privileges are either revoked, or they are bombarded with personal insults. And when I say "those people", that's not a cute way of me saying "me", because I am in the first group I mentioned - I show up regardless and am consistent with my opinion. I post it so that I'm not labeled an "only show up when they struggle" person. But when I do that, then it's handled the way it's handled. It deters and penalizes civilized debate, which is the entire point of the board.

It also exists in the positive crowd as well. There are a billion snarky "how do you like Rask now?" kind of posts when he's playing well, as if any criticism from when he wasn't playing well, was not legitimate. Those people aren't around when he struggles. It exists on both sides and neither should be taken seriously or accepted, but one side is, for whatever reason.


Legitimately nobody is whining and everyone who has said he's struggled has pretty much admitted that they don't care what he does in the regular season as long as he is good in the playoffs. The discussion right now isn't even about his struggles, it's about that if he's hurt, then they should just play Khudobin because they aren't in a position of desperation. They can afford to rest Rask, and they should, considering he's shown signs in the past of breaking down at the end of seasons when he's overworked (as most goalies do).


You can't reason with them. Any even slight criticism, no matter how warranted, is automatically "HATE" and you're negative and are whining and blah blah blah.

You shouldnt speak for others for two reasons.

First some of what you are saying is false and the population here knows that.

Second , you have no visibility to some of the vile trash that gets posted here.

 

[Gee Wally]

Get back to Rask.

 

[pineapplestastegood]

Vehemently disagree. They are still whining.

Maybe I missed some posts that were whining, you don't have to go back and quote them. The ones I saw I didn't think were whining. I think any mention of anything negative gets misconstrued as whining. That's what was happening in the original post I was responding to with that, anyway.

The problem is not that they have negative opinions, it's that they are irrationally negative, and only appear if Rask offers a bad goal. They are not objective. They are 100% negative and have thus fully earned their monikers as "haters"

That would be true if the flip side were viewed the same way, but it's not. There are just as many, if not more, irrationally positive opinion people who only appear when Rask has a good game. Both sides are trolls, but only one side is condemned, so the problem clearly is the fact that the opinions are negative, which dilutes the negative impact of actual trolls.

Also, as I said, if you post your negative opinions during times when things are good, you are deemed as a troll. So if I have a big picture opinion, and I come in and say "Yeah he's been great lately, however my opinion is big picture so I'm not going to be swayed by a couple of months of good play in December and January. Just popping in to remain consistent so I'm not viewed as a cherry picker in the future." that is deemed as trolling, or whining.

They are far from the exact same. There simply aren't those who defend Rask in the face of bad goals. They acknowledge the bad goal, but also see him for the very good (elite) goaltender he is. The "haters" focus on the bad goals and irrationally (there's that word again) view him as below average or even bad.

Anyone who thinks that Rask is below average or bad, is a troll. That's not even a subjective thing, he's objectively very good. However I have stated a million times over that he is a very good goalie, but I am still viewed as a troll. You can't act like both extremes don't exist.

The fact that you acknowledge your opinion can't be changed just proves nothing more that an obtusely closed mind. And the facts and statistics don't support a negative opinion of Rask. they simply reinforce the fact that he's an elite goalie.

I didn't say my opinion can't be changed. I said that my opinion isn't going to be changed by a couple of good months of play in the middle of the regular season. We can't be misquoting eachother if we're going to have an actual debate here, come on.

My opinion isn't that he isn't an elite goalie. Though if you want to argue that specific point, then the statistics show that he hast not been an elite goalie over the past couple of seasons, as his numbers are middle of the pack at best, low 20s at worst. I've posted them a million times, you can go see where he ranks in GAA and SV% over the past couple of seasons, including this one.

bold

EDIT: I hit post on this before seeing Get back to Rask. To the poster I quoted, feel free to PM me if you'd like to continue discussing this.

Regarding Rask, if he's got some kind of nagging injury or something, he should be sitting. There's no reason to overplay him or potentially exasperate a small injury in the last month of the season when they are going to be in the playoffs either way. Health is more important than seeding.

 

[Gee Wally]

Tuuuuuuukkkkkkaaaa!

 

[3rdLiner]

Something something never steals games.

 

[Alberta_OReilly_Fan]

But even when someone gives credit to the player/team when they're playing well, or explicitly says that even though their opinion is negative that they hope they're proven wrong, then when they are consistent with their opinion and are openly stating that they are posting so as not to be labeled an "only shows up when ____ is struggling" later on when it turns, then even that is considered trolling. That's the environment that's created when any unpopular post is deemed trolling, no matter how many facts or statistics you give to support your opinion.

So those people who only show up when the player is struggling have no choice, because if they show up and give their take any other time, their posting privileges are either revoked, or they are bombarded with personal insults. And when I say "those people", that's not a cute way of me saying "me", because I am in the first group I mentioned - I show up regardless and am consistent with my opinion. I post it so that I'm not labeled an "only show up when they struggle" person. But when I do that, then it's handled the way it's handled. It deters and penalizes civilized debate, which is the entire point of the board.

It also exists in the positive crowd as well. There are a billion snarky "how do you like Rask now?" kind of posts when he's playing well, as if any criticism from when he wasn't playing well, was not legitimate. Those people aren't around when he struggles. It exists on both sides and neither should be taken seriously or accepted, but one side is, for whatever reason.


Legitimately nobody is whining and everyone who has said he's struggled has pretty much admitted that they don't care what he does in the regular season as long as he is good in the playoffs. The discussion right now isn't even about his struggles, it's about that if he's hurt, then they should just play Khudobin because they aren't in a position of desperation. They can afford to rest Rask, and they should, considering he's shown signs in the past of breaking down at the end of seasons when he's overworked (as most goalies do).


You can't reason with them. Any even slight criticism, no matter how warranted, is automatically "HATE" and you're negative and are whining and blah blah blah.

its sooooo difficult to keep coming here and posting snarky comments when he does well because with all time career best numbers, he has played well more than any other goalie in history. its a freaking full time job to post snarky comments when hes doing well

personally I find it sad for those who want to criticize him because... with career all time best numbers... the opportunities to criticize him without making yourself look rather questionable... are so few and far between

in a forum like this I wish everyone had a chance to jump in and post and post and post to be part of the community, but the poor rask haters really get the short end of the stick here, while the rask supporters have too much dumped onto their plate

I guess all any of us can do is continue to suffer rask's hof worthy career as he keeps putting up solid effort after solid effort 90% of the time.

let me get in one snarky comment before I'm done here though. it was a good game tonight.

bring on the playoffs... lets get rask his first cup win as a starter and see how everyone likes him then

 

[Gee Wally]

its sooooo difficult to keep coming here and posting snarky comments when he does well because with all time career best numbers, he has played well more than any other goalie in history. its a freaking full time job to post snarky comments when hes doing well

personally I find it sad for those who want to criticize him because... with career all time best numbers... the opportunities to criticize him without making yourself look rather questionable... are so few and far between

in a forum like this I wish everyone had a chance to jump in and post and post and post to be part of the community, but the poor rask haters really get the short end of the stick here, while the rask supporters have too much dumped onto their plate

I guess all any of us can do is continue to suffer rask's hof worthy career as he keeps putting up solid effort after solid effort 90% of the time.

let me get in one snarky comment before I'm done here though. it was a good game tonight.

bring on the playoffs... lets get rask his first cup win as a starter and see how everyone likes him then

You wont be getting a response.

 

[RedeyeRocketeer]

statement game

 

[BruinsFanMike82]

 

[BiGBear8]

ALL I got too sAy is TUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU.........KAAAAAAAAA

 

[BiGBear8]

NHL Playoffs

[TBODY] [/TBODY]
[TBODY] [/TBODY]
[TFOOT] [/TFOOT]

Goalie Stats	Scoring
Season	Age	Tm	Lg	GP	GS	W	L	T/O	GA	SA	SV	SV%	GAA	SO	MIN	Starts with SV% > average SV% for the year, or at least 88.5% on nights with 20 or fewer shots against. Developed by Rob Vollman in the Hockey Abstract." data-stat="quality_starts_goalie" data-over-header="Goalie Stats">QS	QS/GS > 60% Good, < 50% Bad, ~53% League Avg Developed by Rob Vollman in the Hockey Abstract." data-stat="quality_start_goalie_pct" data-over-header="Goalie Stats">QS%	Starts with a SV% below 85%. Developed by Rob Vollman in the Hockey Abstract" data-stat="really_bad_starts_goalie" data-over-header="Goalie Stats">RBS	Lower is better, 100 is exactly average, 0 means you have saved 100% of shots faced. Min. 4 shots faced per team game needed to qualify." data-stat="ga_pct_minus" data-over-header="Goalie Stats">GA%-	GSAA	G	A	PTS	PIM
2009-10	22	BOS	NHL		13	13	7	6		36	409	373	.912	2.61	0	829	6	.462	0	96	1.61	0	1	1	0
2012-13	25	BOS	NHL		22	22	14	8	0	46	761	715	.940	1.88	3	1466	17	.773	0	78	12.76	0	0	0	0
2013-14	26	BOS	NHL		12	12	7	5	0	25	348	323	.928	1.99	2	753	7	.583	1	81	5.76	0	1	1	2
2016-17	29	BOS	NHL		6	6	2	4	0	15	187	172	.920	2.24	0	402	3	.500	0	101	-0.12	0	0	0	0
Career			NHL		53	53	30	23	0	122	1705	1583	.928	2.12	5	3450	33	.623	1			0	2	2

[TBODY] [/TBODY]
[TBODY] [/TBODY]
[TFOOT] [/TFOOT]

 

[BiGBear8]

Even Strength	Power Play	Short-handed
Season	Age	Tm	Lg	Sh	GA	SV %	Sh	GA	SV %	Sh	GA	SV %
2007-08	20	BOS	NHL	64	5	.922	3	0	1.000	21	5	.762
2008-09	21	BOS	NHL	33	0	1.000	0	0		2	0	1.000
2009-10	22	BOS	NHL	987	62	.937	40	1	.975	193	21	.891
2010-11	23	BOS	NHL	706	53	.925	31	1	.968	128	16	.875
2011-12	24	BOS	NHL	518	37	.929	11	0	1.000	91	7	.923
2012-13	25	BOS	NHL	830	52	.937	24	1	.958	126	17	.865
2013-14	26	BOS	NHL	1358	78	.943	31	3	.903	250	33	.868
2014-15	27	BOS	NHL	1691	119	.930	46	2	.957	274	35	.872
2015-16	28	BOS	NHL	1562	117	.925	39	2	.949	252	36	.857
2016-17	29	BOS	NHL	1325	107	.919	37	2	.946	248	28	.887
2017-18	30	BOS	NHL	1042	74	.929	45	6	.867	179	23	.872
Career		NHL	10116	704	.930	307	18	.941	1764	221	.875

[TBODY] [/TBODY]
[TBODY] [/TBODY]
[TFOOT] [/TFOOT]

 

[BiGBear8]

TUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU KAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

 

[alg363636]

I think Rask is just a streaky dude. And his streaks are dramatic.

He's probably always going to end up around .915-.922 and that's going to be comprised of periods where he is playing around or just below .900 and periods where is playing. 950+ Not much in between.

I think it's just the way he is. During the bad times the whiners are going to be here whining and during the good times the cheerleaders are going to be out in full force.

Are the good times worth the bad? For me yes. And I think he's more consistent in the playoffs which is good. But we've seen the pattern going back a few years now.

 

[ON3M4N]

I've just come to a point where I don't even try to defend Rask to the Anti-Rask crowd anymore. They've made up their mind and will defend it till the day they die and that's fine. I'm going to sit back and enjoy watching Rask play because there will come a time where I wont have those opportunities...well unless its highlights or something.

 

[BigBadBruins7708]

for the "rask doesnt steal games" crowd...

Rask's current point streak is:

w/o Bergeron: 5-0-1
w/o Bergeron and McAvoy: 4-0-1
w/o Bergeron and McAvoy and Chara: 1-0-1

 

[BruinsFanSince94]

for the "rask doesnt steal games" crowd...

Rask's current point streak is:

w/o Bergeron: 5-0-1
w/o Bergeron and McAvoy: 4-0-1
w/o Bergeron and McAvoy and Chara: 1-0-1

Don't you go bringing stats into this!!!

 

[Jean_Jacket41]

I've just come to a point where I don't even try to defend Rask to the Anti-Rask crowd anymore. They've made up their mind and will defend it till the day they die and that's fine. I'm going to sit back and enjoy watching Rask play because there will come a time where I wont have those opportunities...well unless its highlights or something.

I don’t think you can be a Rask hater. Life would be miserable with so few happy moments.

Rask having a Vezina type season. Big reason of the team success. Winning nearly every games since late Nov 2017.

Bruins are lucky to have one the best G in the league at 3.5M less than Price.

 

[rocketdan9]

Cassidy should consider not playing Rask in b2b(incl 1 day rest) situations moving fwd

Instead of saying Rask needs to do better etc...it is what it is. He has logged alot of mileage and team needs to play a backup 40 percent of the time (regular season)

 

[NDiesel]

Going through a rough patch (team is still winning) but I think it clearly has to do with the personnel we have missing. Hope he's back to his earlier form again come playoff time, I might even rest him a few extra games down the stretch, Dobby has earned some trust/starts down the last few weeks of the season.

 

[Dennis Bonvie]

I think Rask is just a streaky dude. And his streaks are dramatic.

He's probably always going to end up around .915-.922 and that's going to be comprised of periods where he is playing around or just below .900 and periods where is playing. 950+ Not much in between.

I think it's just the way he is. During the bad times the whiners are going to be here whining and during the good times the cheerleaders are going to be out in full force.

Are the good times worth the bad? For me yes. And I think he's more consistent in the playoffs which is good. But we've seen the pattern going back a few years now.

Seems to be the case for all of the goalies in this era.

Since Brodeur won back to back, the Vezina winners have been:

Thomas
Miller
Thomas
Lundquist
Bobrovsky
Rask
Price
Holtby
Bobrovsky

Its probably going to be Rinne this year

And all of these guys have multiple off years

 

[DKH]

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/threads/the-unraveling-of-tuukka-rask.2416289/

This is so outstanding

 

[BruinsFanSince94]

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/threads/the-unraveling-of-tuukka-rask.2416289/

This is so outstanding

Yeah, from the OP, to the recent bump....Loving it