- Jan 23, 2017
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There's always a chance he signs in Buffalo.Guess I'll have to leave if he does.
There's always a chance he signs in Buffalo.Guess I'll have to leave if he does.
The thing with Stamkos is his best playoff performances tend to come in the games that matter least. And in the games that matter most, he often doesnt rise to the occasion. There have been exceptions, and he was fantastic in 2022. Outside of that year though, he really hasnt been an elite playoff performer. Or even a great one. He tends to top out at "pretty good."I mean, you're comparing him to maybe the 2 biggest playoff performers in the sport. And, 2 players with a larger cap hit than him.
The "Stamkos is bad in the playoffs" narrative is frankly tiring. He doesn't produce at his regular season rate. Few players do, though. He's still a hell of a contributor most of the time.
I posted above on this, but in the last 2 runs he's also been the only player to score in the do-or-die games we've been eliminated.The thing with Stamkos is his best playoff performances tend to come in the games that matter least. And in the games that matter most, he often doesnt rise to the occasion. There have been exceptions, and he was fantastic in 2022. Outside of that year though, he really hasnt been an elite playoff performer. Or even a great one. He tends to top out at "pretty good."
I think its rose colored glasses to think the narrative is false. I actually agree that it's unfair to compare him to Point and Kuch. But like, Palat and Killorn were more on Stamkos's playoff tier than they should have been. Palat, overall, was probably a better playoff performer. Especially in latter years with us.
I'll give you that. Although it seems like the majority of his scoring comes in garbage time.I posted above on this, but in the last 2 runs he's also been the only player to score in the do-or-die games we've been eliminated.
Game 6, Toronto - Stamkos scores, no one else does. Same story in game 6 against Colorado. In the deciding game to advance to the SCF vs. the Rangers, Stamkos potted both goals in a 2-1 victory.
Since 2015, Stamkos has as many goals in games we've been eliminated in as the rest of the team combined (granted, the rest of the team only has 3).
I'm not saying he's particularly clutch or anything - but the guy isn't exactly the ghost in big moments that people make him out to be. He's had his moments.
This. I don't remember the stat, but they showed a graphic during game 6 against the Leafs and talked about Stamkos in elimination games actually being quite good.I posted above on this, but in the last 2 runs he's also been the only player to score in the do-or-die games we've been eliminated.
Game 6, Toronto - Stamkos scores, no one else does. Same story in game 6 against Colorado. In the deciding game to advance to the SCF vs. the Rangers, Stamkos potted both goals in a 2-1 victory.
Since 2015, Stamkos has as many goals in games we've been eliminated in as the rest of the team combined (granted, the rest of the team only has 3).
I'm not saying he's particularly clutch or anything - but the guy isn't exactly the ghost in big moments that people make him out to be. He's had his moments.
I'd take Stamkos over ROR.Some people in here would really rather pay Stammer $7m+ over something like O'Reilly + Rodrigues?
f***ing wild.
I don't know how JBB, or anyone else, could justify paying him more than Hagel.
I'd take Stamkos over ROR.
Better leadership due to this being Stammers team. Ror is a great leader but this is Stamkos' locker room.
We have Cirelli in the shutdown C position, although RoR has better offensive stats, ill admit Cirelli needs to produce a little more offense but in the playoffs he has been huge at shutting down oppositions top lines.
Rodriguez is not a selling feature. You don't take Rodriguez over Stamkos. RoR isn't enough to tip the scales to move in from Stamkos. Stamkos is still producing at a high level.
RoR at last years TDL would have been a great rental. Nothing more. You lose scoring with RoR at 2C over Stammer at 2C.
Edit: it does come down to cost. I'm going under the assumption he isn't asking for 8.5 - 9.5, but somewhere in the 6.5 - 7 range. If he asks for 9.5 that makes things very difficult
Some people in here would really rather pay Stammer $7m+ over something like O'Reilly + Rodrigues?
f***ing wild.
I don't know how JBB, or anyone else, could justify paying him more than Hagel.
Stamkos at 7 mil leaves appx 6 mil to once again fill out the remaining roster spots with scrubs who could not make another team's roster and career minor leaguers coming off a big AHL season.Yes, 100% I would take Stamkos at 7 million. It's actuallying "f***ing wild" to me how anyone wouldn't
If they can get Stamkos to less than 7, or right around 7 exactly, they can make it work provided JBB feels confident in this year's top 9 and some.of the prospect promotions. I mean, after Stamkos, the remaining positions for next year that need filling look to be a 3LD, a #7D, and 3 F for the 4th line/13th. If Stamkos takes.6.5-7, and the cap does go to 87.5, Tampa would.have 5.3-5.8 available. With at least one F spot going to a prospect in this scenario(possibly one of the D spots as well), the space is there to sign what they need.Stamkos at 7 mil leaves appx 6 mil to once again fill out the remaining roster spots with scrubs who could not make another team's roster and career minor leaguers coming off a big AHL season.
At what point does the majority of fans of this organization realize enough is enough and if you pay your core seven most of your Cap space, you are going to have a very difficult time filling the rest of your roster with decent players? Five years behind us are the good, young players under ELCs who could be brought up cheaply to fill those roles and fill them well.
Should the team tank in the first or even the second round this season, do we sign Stamkos to a big deal that takes most of the remaining Cap space or do we allow him to walk and use that Cap space money to find two or three decent players to help the younger core that we have already committed a lot of money to?
You are NOT going to be able to do both, so that fantasy can be forgotten right now.
Stamkos at 7 mil leaves appx 6 mil to once again fill out the remaining roster spots with scrubs who could not make another team's roster and career minor leaguers coming off a big AHL season.
At what point does the majority of fans of this organization realize enough is enough and if you pay your core seven most of your Cap space, you are going to have a very difficult time filling the rest of your roster with decent players? Five years behind us are the good, young players under ELCs who could be brought up cheaply to fill those roles and fill them well.
Should the team tank in the first or even the second round this season, do we sign Stamkos to a big deal that takes most of the remaining Cap space or do we allow him to walk and use that Cap space money to find two or three decent players to help the younger core that we have already committed a lot of money to?
You are NOT going to be able to do both, so that fantasy can be forgotten right now.
People would rather fill the bottom 6 than keep the top 6, ppg forward who also wears the C, after we've already lost two other top 6 forwards (killorn and palat) and lose scoring depth for what? Random 10 goal, 30 point player and an aging vet?If they can get Stamkos to less than 7, or right around 7 exactly, they can make it work provided JBB feels confident in this year's top 9 and some.of the prospect promotions. I mean, after Stamkos, the remaining positions for next year that need filling look to be a 3LD, a #7D, and 3 F for the 4th line/13th. If Stamkos takes.6.5-7, and the cap does go to 87.5, Tampa would.have 5.3-5.8 available. With at least one F spot going to a prospect in this scenario(possibly one of the D spots as well), the space is there to sign what they need.
They could spread out the cap space with more middle/bottom 6 options, and maybe a slightly better 3LD(all in the ~3 million aav range maybe). It's definitely one way to go, especially if the team struggles this season and JBB feels some more.fresh faces are in order. I'd still bet on Stamkos re-signing for a number that works for both sides, at least for the time being.
We made the SCF in 2022 with Point out between the first round and game 5 of the finals. If that doesn't tell you he's a complementary player then I don't know what does.I would say the vast majority of top players still produce ppg rate in the playoffs at minimum, to excuse him for poor production while he largely doesn't provide anything else just seems like you're making excuses. PPG playoff runs aren't even impressive anymore given how many players do it with ease in today's game and he still can't match that.
We won the cup without the guy playing a single meaningful game and made game 7 of the ECF in another year where he missed the entire playoffs, if that doesn't tell you he's a complimentary player than I don't know what does. If you were to take any of our players on any given run at their best, Stamkos might be the 5th or 6th choice, that's definitely a replacement level contributor. As long as Hedman is around as well, leadership isn't lacking either.
We made the SCF in 2022 with Point out between the first round and game 5 of the finals. If that doesn't tell you he's a complementary player then I don't know what does.
See how easy that is?
(Fun fact: Stamkos had 11 goals that year, tops on the team alongside Palat)
This. His playoff comparables are guys who should be at least a full tier below him.Stamkos has played 123 playoff games in his career, of course you can cherrypick singular games or series to suit your narrative one way or the other.
But the fact is that Stamkos' playoff career ppg is a 63 point pace over an 82 game season. On the ice, Stamkos for the most part of his career has offered very little outside scoring. I don't know how you look at that and don't think he hasn't underperformed in the playoffs. His best playoff runs are comparable to those of Killorn or Palat's.
Yeah, no question. He's still worth that, or more, in the regular season. And that's probably around what he's worth in the playoffs too.Yes, 100% I would take Stamkos at 7 million. It's actuallying "f***ing wild" to me how anyone wouldn't
Or replace a 85-95 point player with 2 ~3 million meh F who might, between them, equal the production of Stamkos. And maybe have an extra million for a slightly better 3LD that realistically, won't be that much of an upgrade over the ~1 million 3LD they'll have next season.So it reads like the opinion of many is to pay Stamkos whatever he wants as long as it is between 7 and 7.5 million, cross our fingers the Cap does go up, then fill the rest of the roster with players at a million or less a season due to Cap Restraints.
Fun times are ahead.
Or replace a 85-95 point player with 2 ~3 million meh F who might, between them, equal the production of Stamkos. And maybe have an extra million for a slightly better 3LD that realistically, won't be that much of an upgrade over the ~1 million 3LD they'll have next season.