Line Combos: Roster Discussion/Line Combos
- Thread starter CBJWerenski8
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are we letting any RFA walk this off season ??
Texier,
Johnson,
Marchenko,
Sillinger,
Chinakhov,
Nylander,
Bean
Christiansen
Texier,
Johnson,
Marchenko,
Sillinger,
Chinakhov,
Nylander,
Bean
Christiansen
Add Blankenburg, Greaves, Bjork, Angle, Dunne, and Meyer for a full list.
Iron Balls McGinty
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I could see some of this list being let walk for nothing. Others above should potentially be traded.
Double-Shift Lasse
Just post better
I don't think any of the first list will be let walk, maybe some of the second. But yeah I could see the new GM coming in and doing some sifting of that first list via trade.
Iron Balls McGinty
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To expand on my thoughts:
Texier - Open to moving via trade
Johnson - open to moving via trade
Marchenko - keep
Sillinger - keep
Chinakhov - keep
Nylander - keep and see if the he can prove it longer term
Bean - ok to move in trade
Christiansen - ok to move in trade but probably retained for depth.
Blankenburg - ok to move on from. health is concerning especially the head injuries this season. I suspect he's closer to done than people want to talk about
Greaves - keep for depth for sure
Bjork - i suspect he goes back to europe. Held out this summer and hasn't gotten a sniff of NHL time this year even though he was pretty decent last year. Maybe a new GM sees differently.
Angle - maybe resigned for depth but could be allowed to walk
Dunne - could be allowed to walk, hasn't played since December. not sure what his situation is.
Meyer - I'm sure he'll get resigned as depth because he had a good season in the AHL but I'm not sure he has an NHL future.
DangeRouss
Registered User
I'm trying to think about the forward group for next season, and what it would hypothetically look like if there are 0 trades made. The only way I can think to format it is this -
Gaudreau-Fantilli-Jenner
Johnson-Sillinger-Laine
Chinakhov-Voronkov-Marchenko
Texier-Kuraly-Danforth
Nylander, Olivier, with maybe Brindley and Dumais making cases
My takeaways are:
1. One of Laine, Johnson, or Gaudreau should be moved for a heavier forechecker that plays a more supportive game and does not need the puck on their stick to be effective. I wonder if the new GM would work with Gaudreau or Laine to move them to a preferred destination where they would waive their clauses. The issue with that idea is both of them seem to love living here, and neither are likely to be in a hurry to ask for a move. The team needs veterans but I like the idea of Fantilli leading the way with Johnson and Sillinger as his lieutenants, they seem to be pretty close friends off of the ice already, and with the work ethic those 3 (I assume Sillinger fixed his) have they could set the standard in a meaningful way. All of that to say I prefer to keep Johnson over the other two aforementioned players. Jarmo is gone too so there are no Brisson problems.
2. The three Russian forwards are keepers. I think very highly of Chinakhov. He is a killer out there, on a team that often looks hesitant, he stands out with how decisively and sharply attacks on offense. I feel like his skating went from a weakness to a strength in only 2 years. He works his ass off, went from a bit weak, stiff, and thin to one of the team's most impressive athletes in a pretty short period of time. Voronkov is obviously great for this forward group too, and I'm excited to see how his play grows in to next year. I think Marchenko may be who he is already, which is a fine middle 6 forward who is great for the locker room. He has filled the Gavrikov Russian ringleader void already.
3. The next GM is walking in to a great situation overall, but will instantly have work to do. I listed good players there, but this group does not work together. Maybe Gaudreau and Laine will look better once Fantilli is clearly the focal point of the forwards? That lineup is not a disaster, but definitely is not built to win in this league. The next part of the rebuild won't be a fun and comfortable one.
The defense is trickier. One of Severson, Jiricek, Boqvist, or Gudbranson should go. I very much prefer to bet on Jiricek over Boqvist still. If no one sends a spectacular offer for Provorov then I would like to see Werenski, Provorov, and Mateychuk down the left side. I think Severson will play better next season, and I liked him more than most did this season as is.
Werenski-Severson
Provorov-Gudbranson
Mateychuk-Jiricek
Might be fun? I think Mateychuk will be ready, and Jiricek probably will be however I'm less certain with him.
I do want a coach that has more balls, and will specially focus on giving support to Fantilli to take the team over from a leadership perspective. Someone telling consistently him "this will be your team"
Gaudreau-Fantilli-Jenner
Johnson-Sillinger-Laine
Chinakhov-Voronkov-Marchenko
Texier-Kuraly-Danforth
Nylander, Olivier, with maybe Brindley and Dumais making cases
My takeaways are:
1. One of Laine, Johnson, or Gaudreau should be moved for a heavier forechecker that plays a more supportive game and does not need the puck on their stick to be effective. I wonder if the new GM would work with Gaudreau or Laine to move them to a preferred destination where they would waive their clauses. The issue with that idea is both of them seem to love living here, and neither are likely to be in a hurry to ask for a move. The team needs veterans but I like the idea of Fantilli leading the way with Johnson and Sillinger as his lieutenants, they seem to be pretty close friends off of the ice already, and with the work ethic those 3 (I assume Sillinger fixed his) have they could set the standard in a meaningful way. All of that to say I prefer to keep Johnson over the other two aforementioned players. Jarmo is gone too so there are no Brisson problems.
2. The three Russian forwards are keepers. I think very highly of Chinakhov. He is a killer out there, on a team that often looks hesitant, he stands out with how decisively and sharply attacks on offense. I feel like his skating went from a weakness to a strength in only 2 years. He works his ass off, went from a bit weak, stiff, and thin to one of the team's most impressive athletes in a pretty short period of time. Voronkov is obviously great for this forward group too, and I'm excited to see how his play grows in to next year. I think Marchenko may be who he is already, which is a fine middle 6 forward who is great for the locker room. He has filled the Gavrikov Russian ringleader void already.
3. The next GM is walking in to a great situation overall, but will instantly have work to do. I listed good players there, but this group does not work together. Maybe Gaudreau and Laine will look better once Fantilli is clearly the focal point of the forwards? That lineup is not a disaster, but definitely is not built to win in this league. The next part of the rebuild won't be a fun and comfortable one.
The defense is trickier. One of Severson, Jiricek, Boqvist, or Gudbranson should go. I very much prefer to bet on Jiricek over Boqvist still. If no one sends a spectacular offer for Provorov then I would like to see Werenski, Provorov, and Mateychuk down the left side. I think Severson will play better next season, and I liked him more than most did this season as is.
Werenski-Severson
Provorov-Gudbranson
Mateychuk-Jiricek
Might be fun? I think Mateychuk will be ready, and Jiricek probably will be however I'm less certain with him.
I do want a coach that has more balls, and will specially focus on giving support to Fantilli to take the team over from a leadership perspective. Someone telling consistently him "this will be your team"
CBJ goalie
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Iron Balls McGinty
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Worthy thoughts to consider.
Nobody is trading for Laine. Until he comes out of the player's assistance programs he has no value to any team and of course we have no idea when or if that will happen.
We should be really open to trading KJ. The new GM should have a strong vision for what this team should be and finding players to fit that should be a priority. His play this year as well as his lack of physical play/stature should not exempt him from being moved.
We need to be open to moving players to meet whatever future vision this team has. This sh*t ain't gonna fix itself.
CBJWerenski8
Formerly CBJWennberg10 (RIP Kivi)
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I hope to be wrong but I could very easily see Laine never playing again. With everything he’s been through off the ice, in addition to all the injuries taking a physical and mental toll on him, and the psyche/confidence destruction that’s happened to him due to his on ice struggles, could easily see him saying it’s not worth it anymore.
But even if Laine does return, as IBM says, he holds no value until he can produce on the ice and stay healthy again.
But even if Laine does return, as IBM says, he holds no value until he can produce on the ice and stay healthy again.
EspenK
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- Sep 25, 2011
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This is a great post. 100% agree especially the bolded.
I think too many of us focus on individual players while ignoring the sum total of all the individual players. I think Jarmo was the leader of this kind of thinking.
Teams don't trade players partway into major rehab from surgery, or more properly teams don't trade for players in that situation. KJ's not moving this summer. He just had a surgery with a recovery time of 6-9 months. He's the literal definition of distressed asset. He is not tradable this summer.
And I say this as someone who would absolutely trade him if he were healthy.
And I say this as someone who would absolutely trade him if he were healthy.
KJ Dangler
Registered User
Not a chance I’m trading KJ any time soon . Especially watching Sillinger rebound this season after the same dismal sophomore slump . Most people here had penciled Sillinger in as a moveable piece . If anything , this injury and recovery may allow him to put on the needed weight/muscle to be more effective at the NHL level.
Double-Shift Lasse
Just post better
Yes, the new GM should be tasked with moving the organization from an asset acquisition phase into a roster-building phase. Whoever it is should be considering moving even valuable pieces for other valuable pieces, in the interest of assembling a more cohesive roster/lineup.
But yeah I can't see either Laine or KJ happening soon due to their health situations. And maybe the new GM wouldn't even consider it then, because they fit the vision.
Iron Balls McGinty
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Just for perspective. I'm not sure people expected the Panthers to move Huberdeau. Especially coming off of the 100 point season he just had before that trade. Look at where the team is now and what they got in return.
The question that should be asked of every single player on the roster by the new GM and the rest of management should be is "Do they exemplify what we want this team to be?"
If they don't, you move on from them and replace them with someone who does. They might be a much greater fit for another organization and meet their needs and that is ok. No point in holding on to assets and potential if it will never be realized here.
The question that should be asked of every single player on the roster by the new GM and the rest of management should be is "Do they exemplify what we want this team to be?"
If they don't, you move on from them and replace them with someone who does. They might be a much greater fit for another organization and meet their needs and that is ok. No point in holding on to assets and potential if it will never be realized here.
If he were a 27 year old established NHLer with a potentially career threatening injury I might agree with you but this is not a permanent injury and I guarantee GMs will still see him as a long term asset to develop. They'll be more than willing to take on the short term loss for long term gain if he ends up not being part of the future vision here.
Exactly- Jarmo I'm sure is good at fantasy hockey.
Just he had no idea what he was actually building. Much like IDWT he would sometimes have a need to fill and fill it by creating another hole.
At other times he just "hoped" too much. Hoped that Elvis would stop more pucks. Hoped the coaching staff could get the players to play more defense.
Panthers moved Huberdeau for Tkachuk.
If Laine will be health, he will be a TOP NHL player and I don't see any reason to trade him. But if I understand JD, Euler's and Gaudreau right, his problems are very bad and it is a question when he will play, maybe ever if he will be continue to play hockey.
I doubt Gaudreau will be traded.
We need to think about whether we are overrated young players. Think of Brule, Brassard, Moore, Johansen etc. Are Russians, Johnson and Sillinger as good as we think? Chinakhov had an extremely high SH%, so did Marchenko. Is Jiříček really better than Boqvist? And there are many such questions.p
There is one more important thing, what style of play the new GM will be reviewing. More physical or based on speed, skill?
Iron Balls McGinty
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As I say with any player. Nobody is untouchable. You have to consider the return.
Of course there are people not willing to pay what would make worth moving some players but we also need to evaluate if we overvalue some players as part of that evaluation.
I'm pretty sure it would take a mountain of a return to get Fantilli from us. He's probably as close to being untouchable as we have.
I think it is less likely an unestablished player is moved in this circumstance. NHL teams are notoriously risk-averse, and an injured, unproven player is a massive risk. He's not a long-term asset. He's just a broken kid right now.
Iron Balls McGinty
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He's a broken kid to us right now.
He's 21. I can almost guarantee other teams won't see it that way. Perhaps teams that know how to properly develop talent.
This is ultimately the “golden question”. But, it goes much deeper than just asking the players that question. Not to mention, you’re almost always going to have SOME players deviate from the majority of the other players’ style, as it is almost always a necessity for a truly successful team. But, even then, as we saw with Panarin, even the most skilled players need to “buy in” to whatever the system is and play a TEAM ORIENTED game.
Again, for all the haters of BOTH Jarmo and Howson, they did a good job at building a TEAM. (And for the haters of Torts, he could and can coach CERTAIN teams.) At one time. Then somewhat recently, literally everything changed. The roster build, the mindset, the on ice play. And what followed? More and more losses. But, WHY THE CHANGE??
The problem isn’t even the majority of the players, IMO. Though an interesting poll here would be -“Who are the problem players”?-…Forget the GM/Management asking the players that question, they need to figure out what exactly THEY want this team to be 1st!!
SHAME on all of you who were fully supportive of the changes and weren’t happy with the absolute SUCCESS of the team, that IMO is what pressured and caused ownership and Jarmo to build this current CBJ team into the BS literally unwatchable team it has become. “Hockey should be exciting”…..insert Jack Roslovic…..???
Why is Torts currently leading/coaching one of the most “storied” or “prestigious” NHL franchises/organizations to the playoffs currently, when the CBJ team/organization led him to want to “retire” and many of its fans had expressed that “the game was moving past him”? While at the same time, since he’s gone the team has played the most embarrassing hockey the have in their existence, and been a consistent bottom 3 team statistically.
Why is our past “long term” captain Nick Foligno mentoring Bedard in Chicago and not Fantilli in Columbus??
Why does nobody else seem to care about these things??
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