Speculation: Roster Building Thread Part XIV: There ain't no gettin' off of this train we're on

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mrmovies779

The Greatest Teacher,Failure is.
Feb 5, 2013
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I don't think you or I have watched enough of Bereglazov to make that determination.

You seem to want defensemen in the top 6 who can't defend, which a defenseman has to be able to do.
Thats great that you can tell me what i want better than i can.I'm fine with giving him a look,you had him penciled into your top 6 already when you just said we cant make a determination on him yet.
 

Ghost of jas

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Feb 27, 2002
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I'm all on board the Ryan train at 50% retained. If he is only what he is now, $3M is eh, if he rebounds, it's great value. I like the risk/reward on him. He's 31, the deal will take him to 35. That is not aggressively over the hill at 3M/Y. I think people really have to look at his dollars v production at 50% retained. It makes it a lot more digestible.

I can live with Ryan for another four years if the cost to acquire him is worth the Rangers’ while. Swap a late 1st for a top ten pick, while maybe dumping some salary (Staal w/ 50% retention)? Sign me up.
 

GregSirico

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I can live with Ryan for another four years if the cost to acquire him is worth the Rangers’ while. Swap a late 1st for a top ten pick, while maybe dumping some salary (Staal w/ 50% retention)? Sign me up.
I was thinking something more along the line of

OTT gets NYR 2018 2nd + Vesey or a B level prospect
NYR gets B Ryan (50% retained) and 2018 first.
 

Lindberg Cheese

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To echo some here, Let’s take advantage of Melnyks penny pinching, I’d take a look at Ryan. He’s still a good asset, had a good playoffs last year, just overpaid. I’d take him at 4-4.5 mil. And add someone like Gilmour who’s value is prob the highest it will ever be and a 4th to get their 1st. Better than adding Nash or Kovy without that extra pick. Gorton will be looking at this stuff at draft, and someone brought up the impending CBA and expansion draft that gives us a bailout.
 
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Avery16

Shake my hand, fatso
Jun 28, 2015
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One has been an NHL defenseman and one has not. Neither is an NHL dman right now, but at least in Smith's case it can be blamed on a poor work ethic. If he works hard in the summer and comes to camp in good shape, there's a reasonable expectation that he can be an NHL dman again.
How long do you get a by for being out of shape and having poor work ethic? According to this thread, years.
 

DutchShamrock

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Nov 22, 2005
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How long do you get a by for being out of shape and having poor work ethic? According to this thread, years.
It's one year. We are being realistic. No one is blocking a trade with the hopes he becomes a 2nd pair guy. There are no options right now besides giving him a shot or burying him and refusing to see how he responds.
 

GregSirico

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To echo some here, Let’s take advantage of Melnyks penny pinching, I’d take a look at Ryan. He’s still a good asset, had a good playoffs last year, just overpaid. I’d take him at 4-4.5 mil. And add someone like Gilmour who’s value is prob the highest it will ever be and a 4th to get their 1st. Better than adding Nash or Kovy without that extra pick. Gorton will be looking at this stuff at draft, and someone brought up the impending CBA and expansion draft that gives us a bailout.
That is more my line of thought. I'd rather Ryan @ 50% than singing Kovy to 3/4Y or Nash. Also you can expose Ryan in 2020 if needed (especially if he's playing decent and our young kids are rising; he would be a nice add)
 

Pavel Buchnevich

Drury and Laviolette Must Go
Dec 8, 2013
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Thats great that you can tell me what i want better than i can.I'm fine with giving him a look,you had him penciled into your top 6 already when you just said we cant make a determination on him yet.

Thats exactly what you tried to do, but now its a problem?

I'm not sure we have 6 defensemen who deserve a spot. If we had better defensemen, I wouldn't want Staal or Smith in the lineup either, but when choosing between bad options, thats what I decided. I've seen enough of DeAngelo, he sucks. Gilmour isn't an NHL'er either, in my opinion.
 

GregSirico

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The only Q I have is what return will the Rangers have to add to make this palatable to Ottawa.

Our late first? Our second? A roster player (RFA)? A prospect? Remember they are trying to be fiscal here so sending say Zucc is probably not what they want.
 

Mac n Gs

Gorton plz
Jan 17, 2014
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Thats exactly what you tried to do, but now its a problem?

I'm not sure we have 6 defensemen who deserve a spot. If we had better defensemen, I wouldn't want Staal or Smith in the lineup either, but when choosing between bad options, thats what I decided. I've seen enough of DeAngelo, he sucks. Gilmour isn't an NHL'er either, in my opinion.
Deangelo doesn’t suck
 

GregSirico

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Thats exactly what you tried to do, but now its a problem?

I'm not sure we have 6 defensemen who deserve a spot. If we had better defensemen, I wouldn't want Staal or Smith in the lineup either, but when choosing between bad options, thats what I decided. I've seen enough of DeAngelo, he sucks. Gilmour isn't an NHL'er either, in my opinion.
Saying DeAngelo sucks is a little too harsh. You're acting like he has NO ability whatsoever.
 
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haveandare

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The team is absolutely not taking on Ryan’s contract
Yeah I don't see it happening. If he had a year or two left, maybe. But 4 years is way too much while we're still paying G's buyout and Staal's contract. They're likely not a cap team next year but I'd be surprised if they're okay with that much dead space 2, 3, 4 years from now. Who knows what the team will look like then?
 

GregSirico

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I really want to reiterate that I am not advocating taking on all of Ryan's money. That's just idiocy. But at 50% retained and getting an asset from Ottawa (a first round pick) by doing this, yeah that is something you should explore.
 

Gardner McKay

RIP, Jimmy.
Jun 27, 2007
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Smith is already getting a look in Hartford and isn’t doing anything at all to deserve more attention. At least Bereglazov is in the KHL.

I guess you missed the point I made about him getting in shape in the off season and seeing how he looks in camp?

I think people forget how hard it is to get back in peak shape once the season has started.
 

Pavel Buchnevich

Drury and Laviolette Must Go
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Saying DeAngelo sucks is a little too harsh. You're acting like he has NO ability whatsoever.

How many games has he played now? Must be near 30? Not scoring points and playing bad defense, although I guess the latter is kind of to be expected. The points is the problem. I expected he'd score points, he's not really doing much of that.
 

Oscar Lindberg

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Yeah I don't see it happening. If he had a year or two left, maybe. But 4 years is way too much while we're still paying G's buyout and Staal's contract. They're likely not a cap team next year but I'd be surprised if they're okay with that much dead space 2, 3, 4 years from now. Who knows what the team will look like then?
Pretty much

Nobody is at $7,250,000, but at 3.6M it's a lot more digestible. That's my point. And YES the Rangers can absorb that 3.6M if Ottawa makes it worth it to take on his money.
Cap space and maneuverability are worth their weight in gold going forward.

No way they take on that contract in any way with a Girardi buyout, Staal and Smith contract still on the books
 

GregSirico

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How many games has he played now? Must be near 30? Not scoring points and playing bad defense, although I guess the latter is kind of to be expected. The points is the problem. I expected he'd score points, he's not really doing much of that.
He's been up and down, only played 30 games. Look I'm not saying he's a fixture on this team but to say he's garbage after 30 games on a crappy team in a toxic environment with this coach is extremely unfair.
 

GAGLine

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Sep 17, 2007
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How long do you get a by for being out of shape and having poor work ethic? According to this thread, years.

He isn't getting a bye at all, hence why he is still in Hartford despite all of the defensive callups. He won't be getting a bye next year either. He'll have to earn his spot just like everyone else. Given that he has been an NHL dman until this year, the odds of him becoming one again are higher than Beargloves becoming one for the first time.

You seem to be of the opinion that we should just keep him in the AHL for the next 3 years as punishment. It isn't so much about giving him a 2nd chance as it is about rebuilding his value. No one is trading for him right now. He has to show he can be an NHL dman again and then maybe we can unload him somewhere. Sticking him in the AHL for 3 years isn't going to help us unless he refuses to report and we terminate his contract, but why would he do that and give up 12.4 mil? If he sucks in camp, he'll be demoted. If he gets his head out of his ass, he'll make the team and maybe next summer we can trade him.
 

haveandare

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I really want to reiterate that I am not advocating taking on all of Ryan's money. That's just idiocy. But at 50% retained and getting an asset from Ottawa (a first round pick) by doing this, yeah that is something you should explore.
Again though, with 4 years left that means they're down the cap space from Ryan, Staal, Smith and G's buyout for the next 3 years. That's a lot of money all added up. A real lot. And Ryan might not be completely done now, but I'd bet he'll be cooked before the end of this deal. In 2 or 3 years is the team going to be okay with all that dead cap space? I really doubt it, especially if they come close to turning this thing around in the next few years.
 

GregSirico

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Pretty much


Cap space and maneuverability are worth their weight in gold going forward.

No way they take on that contract in any way with a Girardi buyout, Staal and Smith contract still on the books
If Ottawa drafts at 4 and say for whatever reason Zadina or Boqvist drop there, you should really consider if 3.6M is worth having those guys in your fold for the next decade. It's being extremely short sighted in the bigger picture. Eventually Hank, Shatty, and Staals money will be gone in 3Y and so will Ryan's. That is essentially $25M. Even if you're only looking at next year, DD (1M), McLeod (800K), Pavelec (1,3M) and Carey (600K), that's your Ryan money.
 
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