Out of town thread: Where the grass is ALWAYS greener!

[donghabs98]

It's like the Habs early season problems went to the Sens. Losing, Not scoring and team MVP not playing like his normal self.

 

[waffledave]

My apologizes if you think Delusional = Stupid. That is not the intent. I am calling you delusional by not being able to see the trends and evidence I present you.

The "evidence" you are spouting is not nearly as good or as convincing as you seem to think it is.

 

[Habs Halifax]

The "evidence" you are spouting is not nearly as good or as convincing as you seem to think it is.

Where is the evidence to support what you are spouting? At least I have done my homework. All you are doing is adding noise on top of noise with nothing to back it up.

 

[le_sean]

If the Oilers get Dahlin, I quit.

 

[ECWHSWI]

Where is the evidence to support what you are spouting? At least I have done my homework. All you are doing is adding noise on top of noise with nothing to back it up.

so, it's HIS(her) noise over YOUR noise or something ??

 

[Habs Halifax]

so, it's HIS(her) noise over YOUR noise or something ??

No... Noise on top of your noise?

 

[PaulD]

He got a guy who could play 1C (and did for years in Ottawa) but was more impressive as a 2C. When RyJo is healthy that's such a fantastic one two punch down the middle.

You also have Arvidsson proving he's no fluke, Fiala getting better every game, Craig Smith possibly having his best season, and I've yet to mention Forsberg being a point per game. Josi, Ekholm, and Subban all carrying the defence.

The only disappointment so far has been Bonino, who I'm sure thought would be secure as a 2C but instead has been hurt and bounced everywhere. I didn't like that signing and so far I've been right. But he's got a lot of time to find his place.

Bonino was brought in as a proven play off winner with experience. If he is in the third line center spot by play offs then Preds are gold down the middle.

Last season Preds weakness on play off run was down the middle. So the GM addressed and rectified that immediately. Imagine that.

 

[Habs 4 Life]

If the Oilers get Dahlin, I quit.

they will still find a way and suck. But I hope they don't for the sake of hockey, I actually hope they finish last and lose the lottery

 

[PaulD]

Go to the Bergevin thread if you want to trash him. This was about getting our 2nd round pick back in the Sergachev trade and how this makes our next draft look. And then the cranky ones come along and twist it back towards Bergevin. It's getting old dude.

Bergevin mismanaging the Canadiens.......is whats "getting old dude".

 

[PaulD]

If the Oilers get Dahlin, I quit.

Cant imagine that.

If they win the lottery to get first pick they should simply be disqualified.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Bergevin mismanaging the Canadiens.......is whats "getting old dude".

I think he has made as many mistakes as all other NHL GM's. Our mistakes are pumped up because some of our fan base thinks we should be cup contenders because it's Montreal. What we do from this point till trade deadline and into the off season (Draft and how we spend our cap space) is going to dictate Bergevin's tenure... if he last that long. Definitely a critical point with him as our GM

 

[OldCraig71]

It's like the Habs early season problems went to the Sens. Losing, Not scoring and team MVP not playing like his normal self.

Basically in the east it's Tampa and barely Toronto. I watched my first full Leafs game last night and they give up a ton of chances against, Calgary would routinely get 3-4 shots per attack. Don Cherry has been saying it all season long, Anderson is basically saving their asses. Tampa is the best in the Atlantic because they have it all and the rest are just hoping for as many favours as possible to potentially make it in.

The Sens and Habs are in the same boat, some good pieces but clearly having holes in the roster, if any of our Atlantic teams played in the Metro or the west you could easily shave 5-7 points from our current totals. The Atlantic is very bad this year, much like last year.

 

[PaulD]

I think he has made as many mistakes as all other NHL GM's. Our mistakes are pumped up because some of our fan base thinks we should be cup contenders because it's Montreal. What we do from this point till trade deadline and into the off season (Draft and how we spend our cap space) is going to dictate Bergevin's tenure... if he last that long. Definitely a critical point with him as our GM

How many other GMs hired Therrien and kept him for 5 years?
or went without a number one centermen for their entire tenure?
or Traded away a Norris trophy winning Dman in his prime?

I could go on and on but his bungling (learning on the job) list ill advised decisions has been well documented.

At best MB should have been an assistant GM in Montreal.

 

[Habs Halifax]

How many other GMs hired Therrien and kept him for 5 years?
or went without a number one centermen for their entire tenure?
or Traded away a Norris trophy winning Dman in his prime?

I could go on and on but his bungling (learning on the job) list has been well documented.

At best MB should have been an assistant GM in Montreal.

- MT, I agree with. Didn't like bringing him back and didn't like holding onto him for so long

- No #1C, I don't agree with. We drafted Galchenyuk and he is what he is.... not a #1C. Not even close yet anyways. Acquire a top 2 center requires us to have assets in our prospect pool and we did not have this. There are some examples where we could of been in negotiations but most of the proven centers were traded for some pretty serious assets we did not have.

- Weber for Subban. I like the return but I don't like the reasons why we made the trade. Bergevin is going to ware this for the rest of his life.

 

[NotProkofievian]

I think he has made as many mistakes as all other NHL GM's. Our mistakes are pumped up because some of our fan base thinks we should be cup contenders because it's Montreal. What we do from this point till trade deadline and into the off season (Draft and how we spend our cap space) is going to dictate Bergevin's tenure... if he last that long. Definitely a critical point with him as our GM

And barring a complete and total disaster, but a failure none the less, it will be ''what he does this off-season'' and then ''what he does at the deadline'' and then ''what he does at the deadline''...

6 years is a good bit of data with which to decide whether Bergevin is a good GM. The data is in. He is not.

 

[OldCraig71]

I think he has made as many mistakes as all other NHL GM's. Our mistakes are pumped up because some of our fan base thinks we should be cup contenders because it's Montreal. What we do from this point till trade deadline and into the off season (Draft and how we spend our cap space) is going to dictate Bergevin's tenure... if he last that long. Definitely a critical point with him as our GM

I don't mind his mistakes, it's what he ignores that is the problem. I have to chuckle about the bold part, I thought you were giving him till the end of training camp to use the money? You are now going to extend it to the TDL? I'm sorry but in reality most of his supporters have been extending this so called deadline for 6 years now. He is not going to pull the magic rabbit from a hat, he will add some depth and not much else. He will mention his faith in the current team and lump us in with the other not good enough teams and that will be it.

If he is eventually fired please don't come out and say you knew he had no vision for the team, just say you were wrong and we can all move on as hab fans, it is tiring.

 

[habsgirl5000]

if any of our Atlantic teams played in the Metro or the west you could easily shave 5-7 points from our current totals. The Atlantic is very bad this year, much like last year.

 

[Habs Halifax]

And barring a complete and total disaster, but a failure none the less, it will be ''what he does this off-season'' and then ''what he does at the deadline'' and then ''what he does at the deadline''...

6 years is a good bit of data with which to decide whether Bergevin is a good GM. The data is in. He is not.

IMO, the 6 year data is not good or bad. So this is where we disagree. You want to put trust into the next guy doing a better job and I want to ride out this road with our current GM for a bit longer. If our GM was an idiot like some are saying, we would of made desperate trades by now. He's not doing this, not yet.

Not a popular decision but I choose to remain patient. If the right moves are made, this perception of this team can change by a lot in 12 months time.

 

[ECWHSWI]

No... Noise on top of your noise?

well, he was actually responding to you in his post, not me.

You're trying too hard. It shows.

 

[Habs Halifax]

I don't mind his mistakes, it's what he ignores that is the problem. I have to chuckle about the bold part, I thought you were giving him till the end of training camp to use the money? You are now going to extend it to the TDL? I'm sorry but in reality most of his supporters have been extending this so called deadline for 6 years now. He is not going to pull the magic rabbit from a hat, he will add some depth and not much else. He will mention his faith in the current team and lump us in with the other not good enough teams and that will be it.

If he is eventually fired please don't come out and say you knew he had no vision for the team, just say you were wrong and we can all move on as hab fans, it is tiring.

You are confusing what I have said with others. This is what I said this past summer and I was very consistent... I said we head into the season with our new roster and see what circumstances we can take advantage of and maybe we can make a trade to make use of our salary cap. I overestimated our team D and that start to the season was just brutal. I was patient back in the summer and I still am. No matter who the GM is, patience is the direction I support.

It's sad, but I am happy we had a bad start. The best thing to happen to us at this point in time (in hindsight) is to take a few steps back. The pressure to win was building up too much. Expectations need to be toned down a bit IMO.

 

[donghabs98]

Basically in the east it's Tampa and barely Toronto. I watched my first full Leafs game last night and they give up a ton of chances against, Calgary would routinely get 3-4 shots per attack. Don Cherry has been saying it all season long, Anderson is basically saving their asses. Tampa is the best in the Atlantic because they have it all and the rest are just hoping for as many favours as possible to potentially make it in.

The Sens and Habs are in the same boat, some good pieces but clearly having holes in the roster, if any of our Atlantic teams played in the Metro or the west you could easily shave 5-7 points from our current totals. The Atlantic is very bad this year, much like last year.

One thing the Leafs have too is the offensive ability to compensate for when Andersen does have an off night. As you mention too the Sens and Habs are two teams with glarring wholes. Our start in particular really showed it when Price wasn't playing like himself to cover the flaws in the Habs lineup.

 

[NotProkofievian]

IMO, the 6 year data is not good or bad. So this is where we disagree. You want to put trust into the next guy doing a better job and I want to ride out this road with our current GM for a bit longer. If our GM was an idiot like some are saying, we would of made desperate trades by now. He's not doing this, not yet.

Not a popular decision but I choose to remain patient. If the right moves are made, this perception of this team can change by a lot in 12 months time.

I understand that you disagree with me. I still have the better argument, though.

He's not an idiot who's ever going to give you ''the reason'' to fire him. He's just a visionless hack who's best is barely sufficient to keep his nose above water.

How's the year by year evaluation of Bergevin coming btw? I've been told this is a critical year.

 

[Habs Halifax]

well, he was actually responding to you in his post, not me.

You're trying too hard. It shows.

The only thing I am doing is sticking my neck out and defending my opinions with researched data. Not many are willing to do this. The counter arguments are disingenuous because most people refuse to talk about anything positive because they are on a witch hunt to get our GM fired.

 

[OldCraig71]

One thing the Leafs have too is the offensive ability to compensate for when Andersen does have an off night. As you mention too the Sens and Habs are two teams with glarring wholes. Our start in particular really showed it when Price wasn't playing like himself to cover the flaws in the Habs lineup.

Yes and every team in this league has to deal with injuries but I would argue that the teams that collapse the way that we do if Price is injured are very few. This roster lives and dies with Carey Price(he is definitely the answer in the room). The Flames had the Leafs "generational" talent limited to 1 shot on goal in regulation(Flames D core is awesome) and they out shot them almost double. We hear Matthews blah blah but I tell you, they are Andersen.

 

[Habs Halifax]

I understand that you disagree with me. I still have the better argument, though.

He's not an idiot who's ever going to give you ''the reason'' to fire him. He's just a visionless hack who's best is barely sufficient to keep his nose above water.

How's the year by year evaluation of Bergevin coming btw? I've been told this is a critical year.

If I was president right now and you showed me a more proven guy that was available, I would fire him. However, where you fail to accept is my angle of reasoning. I don't agree that firing him today and replacing him with someone like Brisebois is the solution. I don't see Bergevin sacrificing our future so I don't see a point to fire him at this point. It's a critical point in his tenure and we need to ride out this path we are on IMO.

Like I said, If the right moves are made from here till trade deadline and then this off season, this roster can be turned around and the perception of our organization could look quite different in 12 months... with or without Bergevin.