Speculation: Offseason Thread Pt III

[BrockLobster]

Well, you said better than 3 players. This adjustment makes him better than 6.

I said at least 3. I was referring to kuhl mdc jhs and clutter.

 

[ziggy7716]

I would prefer Leddy+ for Ehlers or Leddy for Hoffman

 

[Richie Daggers Crime]

I said at least 3. I was referring to kuhl mdc jhs and clutter.

Well, that's 4. You've got a math problem, friendo.

 

[BrockLobster]

Well, that's 4. You've got a math problem, friendo.

And i was a math minor in college...lol

I said at least!

 

[WangMustGo]

Laine just turned 21, there is still so much more room for him to grow. Ironically enough, it was Trotz that helped get Ovi to play more of a two way game.

Sometimes it takes the right coach to get players to reach their potential.

Laine and Ovechkin are completely different players. You never had to questions Ovechkins compete level and effort level. He has always laid everything on the ice, that is not the case with Laine.

I wouldnt mind getting Roslovic from Winnipeg. Probably would come much cheaper, and he is a guy that could be a top 6 center in the future.

 

[WangMustGo]

Is anyone good enough for this team?

Now we dont need 40 g guys.

Sure sign a guy for 10 million per, that is a glorified PP specialist.

 

[seafoam]

I am convinced that the "driving play" meme is just that. A meaningless meme.

It’s overused.

 

[IslandersFan17]

Laine and Ovechkin are completely different players. You never had to questions Ovechkins compete level and effort level. He has always laid everything on the ice, that is not the case with Laine.

I wouldnt mind getting Roslovic from Winnipeg. Probably would come much cheaper, and he is a guy that could be a top 6 center in the future.

Point stands, a good coach can get the max out of a player. I'm not comparing their playing style of anything other than the fact that, a good coach improved Ovis game (even more). There is zero reason to believe the same cant be done with Laine.

Ontop of which, again, Laine just tuned 21.

We have a fan base that is holding out hope for our specs to find their niche, yet are willing to write off a 21 year old elite sniper?!? Because his game just could never develop?!?

 

[Chardo]

And i was a math minor in college...lol

I said at least!

You mean greater than or equal to. A math minor should know that....

 

[SI]

We need a play driver that can elevate the play of Bailey, Nelson, Lee, etc. Another Barzal that can drive the bus.

Laine has wicked shot and that's about it.

Flat out wrong.

 

[PWJunior]

I would prefer Leddy+ for Ehlers or Leddy for Hoffman

Not giving up 3 years of Leddy for a rental Hoffman. There better be something else coming with him.

 

[Chardo]

I would be thrilled with getting a 21 year old who already has over 100 NHL goals, and having my hall of fame coach develop a complete game for him before he hits the ripe old age of 23.

 

[PWJunior]

Laine and Ovechkin are completely different players. You never had to questions Ovechkins compete level and effort level. He has always laid everything on the ice, that is not the case with Laine.

I wouldnt mind getting Roslovic from Winnipeg. Probably would come much cheaper, and he is a guy that could be a top 6 center in the future.

Ovie was a predatory animal out there in his younger days. He was a freight train trying to destroy people when he wasn't sniping pucks into the net. He was a sight to behold.

 

[IslandersFan17]

Not giving up 3 years of Leddy for a rental Hoffman. There better be something else coming with him.

Give me Aleksi Heponiemi and a pick to sweeten the deal. We maybe throw in a conditional pick based on Hoffman possibly resigning.

 

[WangMustGo]

Point stands, a good coach can get the max out of a player. I'm not comparing their playing style of anything other than the fact that, a good coach improved Ovis game (even more). There is zero reason to believe the same cant be done with Laine.

Ontop of which, again, Laine just tuned 21.

We have a fan base that is holding out hope for our specs to find their niche, yet are willing to write off a 21 year old elite sniper?!? Because his game just could never develop?!?

Except that Laine doesn't give 100% night in and night out like Ovechkin.

Sure hypothetically Trotz can get more out of Laine, but he has a ton of deficiencies and he wants a ton of money. I would take Conner over Laine anyday of the week.

If we are going after one of the bug RFA's Laine is the last one id pursue.

 

[periferal]

So pretty much set on this is the team we will put on the ice,Everyone is gone and we resign and add nothing...disappointing!

I am no Lou apologist that I can tell you.

That said the roster he inherited was not only incredibly flawed, but had 3 key players becoming UFAs at the end of his first season (which was supposed to be exploratory). To me Lou showed up as an EMT to a horrible car accident and his first job was simply to show up, tend to the victims, and stop the bleeding. By hiring Trotz and resigning Lee/Nelson/Eberle he's done that. Other than Cizikas there isn't another key UFA coming up in the next 3 seasons.

However I am truly a "results" guy and I don't think results happen by accident. We can give Trotz & his staff all the credit we want in having the season we just did (and truly they are the #1 reason), but Lou was the guy able to get him here.

I also think that Lou doesn't want to waste more cap space on mediocre contracts like Ferland or Dzingel. He went big game hunting on Mark Stong and Panarin and came close, but I think if you're going to see a move, it's going to be on of two things:

1. For a significant, if not elite level, player.
2. To get rid of bad contracts/free up cap space.

We should absolutely hold Lou's feet to the fire and I am certainly one of the masses who wants to see some big moves, but I know he's trying and I'm not sure what else he could've done to this point that would have made more sense.

 

[PWJunior]

Except that Laine doesn't give 100% night in and night out like Ovechkin.

Sure hypothetically Trotz can get more out of Laine, but he has a ton of deficiencies and he wants a ton of money. I would take Conner over Laine anyday of the week.

If we are going after one of the bug RFA's Laine is the last one id pursue.

Laine is way more Alexander Semin than Ovie.

Laine and Ho-Sang would get along at least...

 

[periferal]

Laine just turned 21, there is still so much more room for him to grow. Ironically enough, it was Trotz that helped get Ovi to play more of a two way game.

Sometimes it takes the right coach to get players to reach their potential.

I 100% agree with this.

Here's what I don't agree with...Giving up significant assets and a massive contract to a player who doesn't at least give 100% every night.

Ovechkin was already a Capital when Trotz took over. That is a massive difference than trading for and giving Laine a very high contract with the risk that he doesn't get substantially better.

 

[IslandersFan17]

Except that Laine doesn't give 100% night in and night out like Ovechkin.

Sure hypothetically Trotz can get more out of Laine, but he has a ton of deficiencies and he wants a ton of money. I would take Conner over Laine anyday of the week.

If we are going after one of the bug RFA's Laine is the last one id pursue.

Everyone is entitled to prefer who they would want. I think Connor is 110% a beast with a high ceiling, that being said, I'm still taking Laine over just about any of these RFAs not named Marner.

 

[SI]

So often to me it feels like fans fall in love with the "name" instead of the actual player. Laine is a "name" player because he was the #2 overall pick who can score at an elite level. That said he is such a flawed hockey player and maybe the worst flaw of all...That he totally disappears when he's not scoring.

In the cap era each team only gets to hand out 3 or 4 huge contracts, and I would never give up one of them to a guy who disappears in stretches and often looks disinterested in being out there.

You want an elite contract then you have to be elite every night.

Actually, posters latch on to criticism that they've read or heard second hand then look at superficial stats and that becomes their POV and then they defend it like gospel without really knowing the player.

Laine is flat out awesome and is exactly what this team needs upfront. this team needs a SNIPER - someone who can flat shoot the goddamn puck at elite level. Laine with Barzal for the next 5-8 years would be incredible!

He was one of the unluckiest players in the league last season, playing for a terrible coach without a C. When he struggled to get the monkey off his back - he was taken off of the PP1.

Laine is not just a Former high draft pick - he has 110 career goals in 237 games played under the age of 21. He turned 21 after the playoffs!
so does he need to improve as 21 year old and find more consistency and mature? YES!

My GOD this f***ing place sometimes! Jesus CHRIST!

 

[IslandersFan17]

I 100% agree with this.

Here's what I don't agree with...Giving up significant assets and a massive contract to a player who doesn't at least give 100% every night.

Ovechkin was already a Capital when Trotz took over. That is a massive difference than trading for and giving Laine a very high contract with the risk that he doesn't get substantially better.

I agree there are going to be differences in the situation. Different variables, but my main point was the a good coach can find a way to get the most out of players. Ovi was an All World talent, but wasnt necessarily know as a force in all three zones. Trotz got Ovi to commit to those elements. In turn, Ovi should he was willing to work at his craft. Again, Ovi is of a different ilk, not saying the guy wasnt a high level competitor from the outset. Just pointing out, a good coach finds way to continue to get players to evolve.

I mean, Trotz took a very similar roster that allowed the leagues worst GAA, and turned them into the stingiest D team in the league. Elements of the game can be coached up. Especially with a younger kid, who might just need a change of scenery. Let's be honest, not a lot of players have been truly happy about being in Winnipeg.

Moreover, if you believe the rumours that their is a clash between the guys like Schiffle/Wheeler and the younger guys. Along with Maurice not being the best coach (IMO), it could be a recipe for a younger player to possibly start to slip through the cracks.

I do understand the hesitation to want to dish out the contract to a player who has had their compete level called into question.

However, if that's the goal totals for a guy who hasnt had a fire lit under his butt, what happens when he gets with a coach that gets him firing on all cylinders?

 

[Chardo]

There's a big difference between inconsistent players not living up to their potential, and guys who score 30+ goals doing it. The key is to figure out exactly why he's inconsistent, determine if it's fixable, and most importantly, use that inconsistency to lower the contract value.

 

[PWJunior]

I agree there are going to be differences in the situation. Different variables, but my main point was the a good coach can find a way to get the most out of players. Ovi was an All World talent, but wasnt necessarily know as a force in all three zones. Trotz got Ovi to commit to those elements. In turn, Ovi should he was willing to work at his craft. Again, Ovi is of a different ilk, not saying the guy wasnt a high level competitor from the outset. Just pointing out, a good coach finds way to continue to get players to evolve.

I mean, Trotz took a very similar roster that allowed the leagues worst GAA, and turned them into the stingiest D team in the league. Elements of the game can be coached up. Especially with a younger kid, who might just need a change of scenery. Let's be honest, not a lot of players have been truly happy about being in Winnipeg.

Moreover, if you believe the rumours that their is a clash between the guys like Schiffle/Wheeler and the younger guys. Along with Maurice not being the best coach (IMO), it could be a recipe for a younger player to possibly start to slip through the cracks.

I do understand the hesitation to want to dish out the contract to a player who has had their compete level called into question.

However, if that's the goal totals for a guy who hasnt had a fire lit under his butt, what happens when he gets with a coach that gets him firing on all cylinders?

On the other side of the coin, what if Laine is another Alexander Semin? He was supremely talented and he could wire the puck, had serious compete questions though and that never went away.

 

[Chardo]

On the other side of the coin, what if Laine is another Alexander Semin? He was supremely talented and he could wire the puck, had serious compete questions though and that never went away.

I would LOVE to sign Laine and get Semin. In his prime he was over a point a game without a negative season. I think his negatives were unfairly exaggerated because he didn't become the best player in the league like some thought he should. His teams didn't fail to win because of him, they were otherwise flawed.

 

[PWJunior]

This is going to go on for a while.