Norris Finalists: Doughty, Hedman, Subban

[KingPuckChoo]

Subban 97 giveaways
Josi 59 giveaways

Subban 217.1 mins shorthanded
Josi 228.1 mins shorthanded

 

[El Travo]

I just think you should at least be the best defender on your own team if you are going to get nominated for the Norris.

 

[ImNeverWrong]

Just finished watching the Preds\ Avs game 5. Im not even sure if Subban is the best defenceman on the Preds...but to be a finalist for the Norris???
This dude is horrible and if anyone watched game 5 ...it speaks for itself. Rolling around in the slot swinging his stick on the tying goal and giving up the puck and getting caught up ice for the winner. Consistently horrible.

Did you make those pro rory fitzpatrick ads bashing the likes of Niklas Lidstrom? Nik was -5 that one time!

 

[ImNeverWrong]

yeah the Subban nod is a farce

truthfully, Ryan Suter was the best defenceman this year hands down

this guy never gets any credit because he hovers around 40pts a year for an unsexy Minnesota team, and his style is unsexy as well

Suter
Carlson
S. Jones

should have been ahead of Subban it's not even up for debate

but the Karlsson - Burns - Klingberg advocates would really try hard to convince you that Subban is the best D this year

I question if you just watch just king games and some out of town boxscores...
your "analysis" would suggest this.

Subban 97 giveaways
Josi 59 giveaways

Subban 217.1 mins shorthanded
Josi 228.1 mins shorthanded

oh wait...there's MORE enthralling analysis. Hockeyreference.com had some busy servers tonight.

 

[Montreal Shadow]

yeah the Subban nod is a farce

truthfully, Ryan Suter was the best defenceman this year hands down

this guy never gets any credit because he hovers around 40pts a year for an unsexy Minnesota team, and his style is unsexy as well

Suter
Carlson
S. Jones

should have been ahead of Subban it's not even up for debate

but the Karlsson - Burns - Klingberg advocates would really try hard to convince you that Subban is the best D this year

Well it’s clearly up for debate because writers have a different opinion than yours.

 

[Refuse]

Well they got 2 of them right. One is not even the best dman on his team.

Good choices. Doughty should win but Hedman and Subban have been amazing too. Wouldnt be surprised if any of the three would win.

I think Doughty takes it, but these three guys were the logical choices in my opinion.

I never actually understood the voting process for this. So the voters have already voted and the winner is already known to the league but they won't release until June at the awards show?

Jones and Burns completely robbed of their 1 and 2 nomination.

Think Jones got snubbed, he's been insane this season.

Shame that klingberg cooled off so much. He was trending to have an amazing season.

Happy Carlson wasn't nominated.

This should be Hedman.

Hedman should win it. Subban shouldn't have been nominated. He's not even the best d-man on his own team.

How did Jones get left off?

Honestly, sometimes it feels like it is just reputation that gets you nominated. Not taking anything away from the 3 nominated, they all had really good seasons, but I honestly think that John Klingberg should have gotten serious consideration. He plays on a much worse team, than Subban or Hedman, had more points and a very respectable +10 in 24+ minutes a night, while playing in front of maybe slightly above average goaltending. Hedman and Subban both play in front of Vezina candidates so there plus minus will certainly be higher, that and the superior teams they play on.

No, just no

He may be elite offensily but he’s not on the level of the others 3 nominees defensively

I just think you should at least be the best defender on your own team if you are going to get nominated for the Norris.

Every NHL defenseman is a nominee for this award. The voting is done by the Professional Hockey Writers Association at the end of the season. The voters individually and in secret name 5 defensemen who get 10, 7, 5, 3, 1 points. The totals are tallied and the NHL release the names of the top 3. The winner is already determined, there's no second voting process. This is not the Oscars. If you wait to see the final results of the voting after the awards, you'll see how many points it would have taken for player X to get into the top three.

Every year, there are posters confused by this, talking about snubbed players etc. The NHL is to blame for this imo, as there's really no reason to divulge the finalists other than marketing, people just get confused. Why finalists? There's not going to be a final round.

 

[Refuse]

A better discussion than "X got left out!!" could be "Who do you think almost made it to the final 3?", "How close do you think these players were to say #4-6?" or "Is narrative playing a bigger part in the voting process than raw stats due to journalists voting?"

I think Jones, Carlson and Klingberg are in those 4-6 spots, mostly due to narrative.

 

[Oddbob]

He also got much softer minutes than the guys you mentioned so he needed to crush it.

But I'm also sure he got very strong consideration and likely finished at 4-5 in voting.

How exactly does he get softer minutes than the other 3? He plays on a worse team and is the #1 defenceman for Dallas. Pretty sure he would be playing against the other teams top players just as the other 3 did.

 

[Healthy DiPietro]

Subban 97 giveaways
Josi 59 giveaways

The more you possess the puck the more giveaways you will have, that's why most players who top the giveaway category are stars.

 

[Ivan13]

I just think you should at least be the best defender on your own team if you are going to get nominated for the Norris.

Like PK is?

 

[East Coast Icestyle]

Every NHL defenseman is a nominee for this award. The voting is done by the Professional Hockey Writers Association at the end of the season. The voters name 5 defensemen who get 10, 7, 5, 3, 1 points. The totals are tallied and the NHL release the names of the top 3. The winner is already determined, there's no second voting process. This is not the Oscars. If you wait to see the final results of the voting after the awards, you'll see how many points it would have taken for player X to get into the top three.

Every year, there are posters confused by this, talking about snubbed players etc. The NHL is to blame for this imo, as there's really no reason to divulge the finalists other than marketing, people just get confused. Why finalists? There's not going to be a final round.

Did you really just write a giant post over lazy terminology? Especially quoting mine where literally all I said was snubbed. You know you can be snubbed in voting, right? The award doesn't have to be nominations for that.

 

[Refuse]

Did you really just write a giant post over lazy terminology? Especially quoting mine where literally all I said was snubbed. You know you can be snubbed in voting, right? The award doesn't have to be nominations for that.

Well, snubbed as in 'ignored' doesn't really apply if player X got 1 less point than player Y in third place does it? Sorry if you understand how the voting works, but the majority of the quotes in that 'giant' post do not seem to. I posted what I did because it seems so pointless to argue a fictional scenario, with Oscar-like nominations.

5 lines of text - giant post? Really?

 

[Spazkat]

Every NHL defenseman is a nominee for this award. The voting is done by the Professional Hockey Writers Association at the end of the season. The voters name 5 defensemen who get 10, 7, 5, 3, 1 points. The totals are tallied and the NHL release the names of the top 3. The winner is already determined, there's no second voting process. This is not the Oscars. If you wait to see the final results of the voting after the awards, you'll see how many points it would have taken for player X to get into the top three.

Every year, there are posters confused by this, talking about snubbed players etc. The NHL is to blame for this imo, as there's really no reason to divulge the finalists other than marketing, people just get confused. Why finalists? There's not going to be a final round.

This might come as a shock, but not agreeing with the results doesn't mean you don't understand how it works. I'm not "confused".... I'm well aware of how the voting works. I also happen to think that a large portion of the PHWA are dumbasses who don't watch a lot of games outside their market and vote primarily based on reputation and name recognition, hence my comment.

Exhibit A: 2016 voting where somehow both Seabrook and Beauchemin get top 20 votes:
2015-16 NHL Awards Voting | Hockey-Reference.com

 

[Refuse]

This might come as a shock, but not agreeing with the results doesn't mean you don't understand how it works. I'm not "confused".... I'm well aware of how the voting works. I also happen to think that a large portion of the PHWA are dumbasses who don't watch a lot of games outside their market and vote primarily based on reputation and name recognition, hence my comment.

Exhibit A: 2016 voting where somehow both Seabrook and Beauchemin get top 20 votes:
2015-16 NHL Awards Voting | Hockey-Reference.com

Again, I just collected quotes that seemed to align with the misconception of finalists/nominees. Asking how a player got 'left out' kind of looks like it. Regarding Beauchemin, if one voter out of 150 decides to give their pity point to a guy like Beauchemin it's not the end of the world.

 

[East Coast Icestyle]

Well, snubbed as in 'ignored' doesn't really apply if player X got 1 less point than player Y in third place does it? Sorry if you understand how the voting works, but the majority of the quotes in that 'giant' post do not seem to. I posted what I did because it seems so pointless to argue a fictional scenario, with Oscar-like nominations.

5 lines of text - giant post? Really?

Snubbed applies just fine if Jones was one of the top two d in the league this year, as is my opinion.

On mobile, your post is a giant wall of text.

 

[Refuse]

Snubbed applies just fine if Jones was one of the top two d in the league this year, as is my opinion.

On mobile, your post is a giant wall of text.

Ok, I still think he got top 5 votes, which is fine imo and I don't regard being top 5 in voting among what? ~250 defensemen as being snubbed really, but that's just different interpretations of the word. Sorry for the wall of quotes, but my intent was for all those people to read the post in case they didn't know how the voting is done.

 

[jj cale]

Yes but the poster doesnt vote on the awards, biased NA:s do.

And Nick Lidstrom is glad they do, especially for the one he did not deserve to win.

 

[maacoshark]

Have you graduated from the Marc Bergevin school of hockey management?

What's so great about Subban? Did you see the bonehead play he made on the game winner last night? Plays like that are quite common for him. He is a good defence man but he makes a lot of mental mistakes.

 

[CupsOverCash]

If Hedman doesnt win it this year, he should be putting up career numbers next year with McDonagh taking some of the load off of his shoulders defensively. Amazing how they choose the most productive D but not the best all around D. Hedman would have won last year if this was how they did it. He might not win it this year because of that very same reason. I agree with others that say they should make the Orr trophy for best D.

 

[East Coast Icestyle]

If Hedman doesnt win it this year, he should be putting up career numbers next year with McDonagh taking some of the load off of his shoulders defensively. Amazing how they choose the most productive D but not the best all around D. Hedman would have won last year if this was how they did it. He might not win it this year because of that very same reason. I agree with others that say they should make the Orr trophy for best D.

What? Hedman has the most points out of the finalists. If anything the points argument will benefit him this year

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

And Nick Lidstrom is glad they do, especially for the one he did not deserve to win.

Well that sort of ignores the fact he was the best D-man in the league from 95 onward and was robbed of a bunch of Norris Trophies while "earning" his place to win them.

I think Seth Jones deserved to be a finalist, because well I think he should be winning the award this year so I am surprised by his omission.

 

[CupsOverCash]

What? Hedman has the most points out of the finalists. If anything the points argument will benefit him this year

Does he? I thought Subban maybe outproduced him. Well then he should win.

 

[jj cale]

Well that sort of ignores the fact he was the best D-man in the league from 95 onward and was robbed of a bunch of Norris Trophies while "earning" his place to win them.

I think Seth Jones deserved to be a finalist, because well I think he should be winning the award this year so I am surprised by his omission.

Agreed, Nick lost one Norris due to the "earning it" factor that you mentioned, I don't think he lost a bunch to that though, deserving guys just beat him out. But he also won one he did not deserve as a legacy pick too. The point is there is no anti Swedish player bias, Some swede fans need to let that childish stuff go.

 

[East Coast Icestyle]

Does he? I thought Subban maybe outproduced him. Well then he should win.

Hedman with 3 over doughty, 4 over subban. None of them top 3 in d scoring this year. I think doughty will get it, but my top 3 has been pretty closely doughty, Hedman, Jones. Don't think subban deserves it but would be fine with the others.

 

[CupsOverCash]

Hedman with 3 over doughty, 4 over subban. None of them top 3 in d scoring this year. I think doughty will get it, but my top 3 has been pretty closely doughty, Hedman, Jones. Don't think subban deserves it but would be fine with the others.

Im a big fan of Doughty. Wouldnt be mad if he won. I think Hedman deserves it too. Hes just too good at what he does.