Norris Finalists: Doughty, Hedman, Subban

[CanadianPensFan1]

Not a big surprise that it's these 3. I think Hedman has got it this year.

 

[Burke the Legend]

How did Jones get left off?

Name bias...

Finishing in the top 10 of voting would mean pretty good recognition for him, especially anything close to 5. A lot of the media tards who vote on these trophies know less about hockey and the league on the whole than your average yahoo fantasy player. All they know is their own team and then go by a quick glance at the stat sheet filter out by big name recognition so I wouldn't be surprised to see Jones finish behind Rielly, Josi or Letang even if he had more points.

 

[Wats]

Name bias...

Finishing in the top 10 of voting would mean pretty good recognition for him, especially anything close to 5. A lot of the media tards who vote on these trophies know less about hockey and the league on the whole than your average yahoo fantasy player. All they know is their own team and then go by a quick glance at the stat sheet filter out by big name recognition so I wouldn't be surprised to see Jones finish behind Rielly, Josi or Letang even if he had more points.

Or maybe its as simple as the votes being submitted before mid-March/April. Seth Jones ended the season with 7 points in last 3 games, 16 points in last 11 games.

Which means before game 68, Jones was at 41 points (on pace for 47 points total).

 

[Machinehead]

I was all set to be triggered, but I'm actually quite pleased with this.

 

[Grate n Colorful Oz]

ES Primary Points per 60 minutes
Hedman 0.89
Subban 0.89
Doughty 0.53

ES Defensive Zone Start %
Subban 57.5%
Doughty 48.7%
Hedman 45.9%


Vs Top 3 Forward Teammates ES Points
Doughty 27.3%
Subban 25.6%
Hedman 21%


Point Shares
Doughty 11.7
Hedman 11.0
Subban 10.5


Vs Top 3 forward teammates Point Shares
Doughty 48%
Subban 46.9%
Hedman 38.5%


ES Goals Allowed Per 60 minutes
Hedman 2.39
Subban 2.43
Doughty 2.66


Points difference Vs team leader
Subban -5
Doughty -33
Hedman -37

 

[KarmaPolice]

Hedman or Doughty gets it, IMO. It's a toss up between those two. I'd say Doughty is the more complete Dman and can affect the game more, but Hedman is no slouch either, and he put up more points. Hard to pick. As for Subban, there were so many guys you could put as the 3rd selection. Doubt he wins, but who knows.

Hedman and Doughty are the two standouts to me, and either one is just as deserving to win it.

 

[maacoshark]

Why should Subban get the short end of the stick on this one?

And Carlson ahead of him for the Norris? Seriously?

I'd take Carlson over Subban. And I don't think Carlson should be a finalist for the Norris. There are so many good dmen this season but Hedman and Doughty are above the rest. I think Hedman wins it.

 

[Oddbob]

Honestly, sometimes it feels like it is just reputation that gets you nominated. Not taking anything away from the 3 nominated, they all had really good seasons, but I honestly think that John Klingberg should have gotten serious consideration. He plays on a much worse team, than Subban or Hedman, had more points and a very respectable +10 in 24+ minutes a night, while playing in front of maybe slightly above average goaltending. Hedman and Subban both play in front of Vezina candidates so there plus minus will certainly be higher, that and the superior teams they play on.

 

[Merci Saku]

Honestly, sometimes it feels like it is just reputation that gets you nominated. Not taking anything away from the 3 nominated, they all had really good seasons, but I honestly think that John Klingberg should have gotten serious consideration. He plays on a much worse team, than Subban or Hedman, had more points and a very respectable +10 in 24+ minutes a night, while playing in front of maybe slightly above average goaltending. Hedman and Subban both play in front of Vezina candidates so there plus minus will certainly be higher, that and the superior teams they play on.

No, just no

He may be elite offensily but he’s not on the level of the others 3 nominees defensively

Not an opinion but a fact that all of us who are hardcore hockey fans knows

 

[olli]

I never thought there would be a day where the hockey writers were smarter than every day fans but wow we got there.

Again, have you watched a preds game this year?

 

[Eb]

This is so blurry. Do you have a link for this?

 

[Grate n Colorful Oz]

I'd take Carlson over Subban. And I don't think Carlson should be a finalist for the Norris. There are so many good dmen this season but Hedman and Doughty are above the rest. I think Hedman wins it.

Have you graduated from the Marc Bergevin school of hockey management?

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

Honestly, sometimes it feels like it is just reputation that gets you nominated. Not taking anything away from the 3 nominated, they all had really good seasons, but I honestly think that John Klingberg should have gotten serious consideration. He plays on a much worse team, than Subban or Hedman, had more points and a very respectable +10 in 24+ minutes a night, while playing in front of maybe slightly above average goaltending. Hedman and Subban both play in front of Vezina candidates so there plus minus will certainly be higher, that and the superior teams they play on.

He also got much softer minutes than the guys you mentioned so he needed to crush it.

But I'm also sure he got very strong consideration and likely finished at 4-5 in voting.

 

[Rygu]

Definitely shouldn't be Subban now

 

[nORRis8]

Just finished watching the Preds\ Avs game 5. Im not even sure if Subban is the best defenceman on the Preds...but to be a finalist for the Norris???
This dude is horrible and if anyone watched game 5 ...it speaks for itself. Rolling around in the slot swinging his stick on the tying goal and giving up the puck and getting caught up ice for the winner. Consistently horrible.

 

[Grate n Colorful Oz]

Again, have you watched a preds game this year?

Have you?

I have...

Subban is the most used dman for defensive missions on the Preds. Josi is used more for offense and Subban more often for defense and despite this, Subban outscored him.

Despite this and despite getting +10% more defensive zone starts than both other finalists, he is equal to Hedman in primary even-strenght points per 60 minutes and sports a similar GAA to Hedman. Doughty is behind in both categories. Subban is only 5 points behind his team leader while both Doughty and Hedman play with bigger offense producers and are close to 35 points both behind the point leader of their respective team.

Which should put their different +/- between Subban and Hedman into perspective as they both have similar ES GA and almost the same amount of ES TOI and about the same amount of points. So their difference in +/- is reflective of the difference in contribution from their best forwards.

Subban also has the most total primary points among all dmen (44). He just didn't get many secondary assists, contrarily to Doughty who almost has double the amount of secondary assists than both Hedman and Subban.

 

[nORRis8]

Definitely shouldn't be Subban now

Love the snow angels he was doing on the tying goal.❄

 

[OVrocks]

No Orpik? This is a joke!

 

[Grate n Colorful Oz]

Definitely shouldn't be Subban now

Neither should Hedman with 0 points

And have you watched Doughty in the playoffs?

All players have bad games/bad moments.

 

[Rusty Razor]

Name bias...

Finishing in the top 10 of voting would mean pretty good recognition for him, especially anything close to 5. A lot of the media tards who vote on these trophies know less about hockey and the league on the whole than your average yahoo fantasy player. All they know is their own team and then go by a quick glance at the stat sheet filter out by big name recognition so I wouldn't be surprised to see Jones finish behind Rielly, Josi or Letang even if he had more points.

This should be the Turing test for PHWA. If Letang gets a vote this season, you know they didn't watch games.

 

[Laphroaig]

These three are the obvious and correct choices. I'd give it to Doughty but I think Hedman wins this year. It's so close that any one of these guys would be a worthy winner.

 

[KCC]

lol Subban. He has no business being a finalist.

 

[KingPuckChoo]

Neither should Hedman with 0 points

And have you watched Doughty in the playoffs?

All players have bad games/bad moments.

Doughty brought the total shots against down from 30s (his suspended match excluded OT) to the 20s
he was on the PK more often than not with Vegas going 0/8 on the PP when Doughty played
the only PP goal came in game 2 when Doughty didn't play
LA allowed 7 goals the entire series (or 5 out of the 3 games doughty played) that's 1.66/game
And surprisingly despite the few goals, he managed to still be a +1 in the playoffs

i'm pretty sure you haven't seen Doughty play in the playoffs

but yes no points therefore he had "bad games"

no one likes the guy, i get it... it would make you guys look more legit though when you give credit to players that you do not care for or dislike

 

[KingPuckChoo]

lol Subban. He has no business being a finalist.

yeah the Subban nod is a farce

truthfully, Ryan Suter was the best defenceman this year hands down

this guy never gets any credit because he hovers around 40pts a year for an unsexy Minnesota team, and his style is unsexy as well

Suter
Carlson
S. Jones

should have been ahead of Subban it's not even up for debate

but the Karlsson - Burns - Klingberg advocates would really try hard to convince you that Subban is the best D this year

 

[Revelation]

You make it sound like Carlson was playing 45 minutes a game.

He averaged 40 seconds more than Subban with Orpik, Djoos and Kempny as his partners. He was basically a pairing onto himself this year.