Player Discussion Jake Virtanen | Jake It Or Break It Edition

[Smeagoal]

JV blows. He's too young to be in the NHL, especially since he is too young without the skill/smarts to make an impact. Needs to be in the AHL. Atleast until he can learn to play in his own end better than be plays in the Ozone ... which is a very low bar I set for him..

 

[M2Beezy]

As much hate as Eriksson gets, he's still playing above a 0.5 P/G pace.

He is miles better than Virtanen at this point and scratching him over Jake would be asinine.

$6 million to BARELY get 0.5 p/g is UNACCEPTABLE

Sit down Loui!

 

[Jay Cee]

$6 million to BARELY get 0.5 p/g is UNACCEPTABLE

Sit down Loui!

I don’t think anyone is disputing that. I have said personally that I think Eriksson’s contract is the worst thing this team has done.

That being said, him and Virtanen’s names don’t belong together. One is a roster player in the NHL, the other is struggling to put up points or even do anything meaningful.

 

[The Extrapolater]

Virtanen's 21 years old, and now over a NHL 100 games to his credit. If he's struggling at the NHL level, then it's probably a case of "it is what it is". He's likely playing at the level he's able to give at this level.

He won't be a star, and he's doesn't have the sort of mindset to look for big hits. He's settling for an "in-between" game. He doesn't even have to be a big-time hitter to be effective if he'd just learn to place his self between his opponent and the puck on both ends of the rink. If he at the least had a "get on the puck" mentality, it'd go a long way toward carving out a role on the team.

As it is, he's a bottom-sixer who's likely to get out-worked for a spot on the roster of a non-playoff team.

There is a cause for a bit of optimism though, considering his on-ice stats are decent. He's at the least a 50/50 player when he's on the ice in terms of shots. However, without that goal-scoring ability and bottom-sixer intensity, he's in a "no-mans land" when it comes to earning playing time.

If he can't figure things out at the NHL level, then he should be sent down to the AHL to see if he can rework his game down there. Otherwise, the Canucks should be thinking about moving on to other projects in the system.

 

[supercanuck]

The season is lost. It does not matter if Eriksson goes from 0.5 Pts/Gm to 0.6 Pts/Gm. Why not give Jake some more playing time, and help him build some confidence? Experiment with him on the PP or PK. Play him with other speedy players like Bo that may align more with his skillsets. I just don't see how playing him 5-10 minutes a game with Dowd and Chaput is helping him develop.

In some way, it feels like whole Kassian thing again where they are trying to force players into a "4th liner" aggressive role at a time when the player is not able to or ready for.

 

[Josepho]

$6 million to BARELY get 0.5 p/g is UNACCEPTABLE

Sit down Loui!

That's not even that bad if he maintains this.

The term is where the contract sucks, I'd say he's less overpaid than Brandon Sutter.

And again, he's still probably our 5th-7th best forward.

 

[Cupless44]

The season is lost. It does not matter if Eriksson goes from 0.5 Pts/Gm to 0.6 Pts/Gm. Why not give Jake some more playing time, and help him build some confidence? Experiment with him on the PP or PK. Play him with other speedy players like Bo that may align more with his skillsets. I just don't see how playing him 5-10 minutes a game with Dowd and Chaput is helping him develop.

In some way, it feels like whole Kassian thing again where they are trying to force players into a "4th liner" aggressive role at a time when the player is not able to or ready for.

You are exactly right.

Virtanen has shown flashes of his speed and skill but he does not do it consistently. Sitting out is warranted at times but sometimes you just have to give a young player real opportunity to grow his confidence and that isn't the lowest icetime on the team at 10 minutes a game.

It is a 28th place team. Give him a chance on the power play to be a net front presesence over Granlund when Horvat was out who did nothing. Stick him out there in overtime...he is the best skater on the team.

You just might find he progresses a bit more and gains confidence. He has shown enough flashes to show his talent

 

[sting101]

Virtanen's 21 years old, and now over a NHL 100 games to his credit. If he's struggling at the NHL level, then it's probably a case of "it is what it is". He's likely playing at the level he's able to give at this level.

He won't be a star, and he's doesn't have the sort of mindset to look for big hits. He's settling for an "in-between" game. He doesn't even have to be a big-time hitter to be effective if he'd just learn to place his self between his opponent and the puck on both ends of the rink. If he at the least had a "get on the puck" mentality, it'd go a long way toward carving out a role on the team.

As it is, he's a bottom-sixer who's likely to get out-worked for a spot on the roster of a non-playoff team.

There is a cause for a bit of optimism though, considering his on-ice stats are decent. He's at the least a 50/50 player when he's on the ice in terms of shots. However, without that goal-scoring ability and bottom-sixer intensity, he's in a "no-mans land" when it comes to earning playing time.

If he can't figure things out at the NHL level, then he should be sent down to the AHL to see if he can rework his game down there. Otherwise, the Canucks should be thinking about moving on to other projects in the system.

This is an incredibly short sighted view. At 21 "it is what it is" is not a conclusion that should be made. You could be right pertaining to Jake but this 100 games 21 yrs old thing has very little supportive evidence amongst top6 players currently in the NHL, many of which are former 1st round picks.

i also don't see the lack of goal scoring ability you speak of.

Jake's a project. One that could be well worth the patience. I completely agree with the sentiment that he should either replace Vanek and his role after the TDL or sent to Utica to be a top line player with PP time if things don't change over the next month.

 

[tyhee]

....

Virtanen has shown flashes of his speed and skill but he does not do it consistently. Sitting out is warranted at times but sometimes you just have to give a young player real opportunity to grow his confidence and that isn't the lowest icetime on the team at 10 minutes a game.

It is a 28th place team. Give him a chance on the power play ... You just might find he progresses a bit more and gains confidence. He has shown enough flashes to show his talent

I agree that Virtanen should be getting more than 10 minutes a game, but I think he should be getting it elsehwere. An NHL coach, any NHL coach, is tasked with winning. The NHL is the elite league-players who have to develop to get to that stage have other places that are intended for that purpose.

Confidence? Where will he develop it best? Playing against the top-rank of players that he's been unable to consistently be good enough so gets less playing time, or against players of a lower level where he should be good enough to earn playing time from a coach trying to win?

Confidence? Where is he going to get it better-against players his own level in the AHL or the better players in the NHL?

Motivation? What provides it better-getting more playing time and opportunity after a mediocre part-season, or playing in a lower league for much less money?

Playing time? Where is a coach going to give him more playing time? At a high level where there are players who, on average, play more effectively, or at a lower level where he should be good enough to earn more minutes?

It would be silly to argue Virtanen is too good to develop in the AHL. He played there last season, with 9 goals, 10 assists and -11 in 65 regular season games. He played up in the lineup and ended up lower in the lineup because he wasn't yet effective enough. Only a good preseason kept him in Vancouver for this season. If he isn't going to consistently play to the level of preseason with the Canucks and needs to develop consistency and confidence, there's a place for Canuck prospects to do that.

The Canucks haven't used it much for that purpose (Demko, Gaunce, Baertschi for a short time) but the AHL is, after all, supposed to be a development league, complete with rules to make sure non-veterans get their share of spots in the lineup.

I believe the development of Virtanen has been badly mis-handled. He's a gifted prospect that had a lot to learn about how to be a pro and the more technical aspects of where to be on the ice and what to do with and without the puck. I don't think he should have been playing in the NHL in his D+2 year after his mediocre D + 1 season in junior (and without a 2015 training camp that showed him to be ready.) I don't think he should have started the 2016-17 season in Vancouver after coming to camp overweight and having a poor preseason. Gifting him a spot where he hasn't been good enough just sends the message that he doesn't need to work hard and improve in order to play in the best league in the world.

I don't think he should have started 2017-18 in Vancouver, after his truggles in the NHL and the AHL in 2016-17, despite his good preseason. We've known for a long time he can produce periods of good play, but consistency is a large issue. After being so poor last season I think after his good preseason he should have gone to Utica with the intention of calling him up as an injury replacement. If as an injury replacement he did well consistently he would earn a spot, otherwise he goes back down to work on his game until he can consistently be someone that the coach belives in enough to play him more.

I also believe gifting him more playing time right now would be adding to the errors in development that have already taken place.

 

[Nucker101]

This is his last season of being waiver exempt. Send him down and have him finish the season playing big minutes in Utica again, he's not an effective NHL player right now.

 

[member 290103]

Virtanen is very likely a bust. I would think differently about him if he was out crashing and banging and raising hell every night, but he isn't.

Benning should try to move him while he still has some semblance of value.

 

[Kryten]

Virtanen is very likely a bust. I would think differently about him if he was out crashing and banging and raising hell every night, but he isn't.

Benning should try to move him while he still has some semblance of value.

But hes going to be so cheap to re-sign

 

[timw33]

Sign Archibald and play him in the mucker bottom 6 role if that's all you're going to use him for.

Unfortunately, I just don't think JV has the hockey IQ to be a highly effective player. Easily one of the biggest mistakes Benning has made, actually, the first mistake he made coming in before the draft and passing on high skill and taking a project with major shoulder surgery with the 6th.

 

[Johnny Canucker]

Virtanen is very likely a bust. I would think differently about him if he was out crashing and banging and raising hell every night, but he isn't.

Benning should try to move him while he still has some semblance of value.

What value does he have? None. Unless one of the GMs doesn’t own a TV or have access to the internet , JV would barely clear waivers.

 

[VanJack]

Virtanen is like a lot of Canucks......shows flashes, has the odd good game, but far too inconsistent to be an effective NHL player at this point. Doesn't hit consistently; scores once a month; demonstrates zero hockey sense like that dreadful turnover tonight; and then sees his ice-time reduced to 8-10 minutes a night....it's like 'Groundhog Day'.....I'm with other posters.....At 21, 'he is, what he is".....and a major disappointment for a sixth overall pick.

 

[Yggdrasil]

good job idiot benning picking virtanen 6th overall when we couldve had Ehlers or Nylander.

 

[arttk]

This is his last season of being waiver exempt. Send him down and have him finish the season playing big minutes in Utica again, he's not an effective NHL player right now.

It’s obvious Green has no interest in developing him, send him down to Utica and just give him a ton of minutes to develop. Simply put, he f***ing sucks right now and if it wasn’t the 6th overall picking hanging over him, he has no business being in the NHL.

 

[groov2]

good job idiot benning picking virtanen 6th overall when we couldve had Ehlers or Nylander.

Good insight!

 

[Yggdrasil]

Good insight!

'button had virtanen in the 2nd round!

just imagine if we had

ehlers horvat boeser.

then

ehlers pettersson boeser
dahlen horvat ???

in 2020.

god damn i cant wait for us to tank hard so we can get a top 5 pick this year and get this bloody season over with!

 

[groov2]

'button had virtanen in the 2nd round!

just imagine if we had

ehlers horvat boeser.

then

ehlers pettersson boeser
dahlen horvat ???

in 2020.

god damn i cant wait for us to tank hard so we can get a top 5 pick this year and get this bloody season over with!

Well yeah, but we knew all this on the day of the draft.

 

[LordBacon]

At this point I will be content with raffi torres 2.0 but that implies he's gonna be an upgrade over torres which I honestly cant see happening. Jake needs to work way harder to overcome that low hockey iq of his.

 

[Yggdrasil]

Well yeah, but we knew all this on the day of the draft.

thats one thing i absolutely hate about benning, his first year...he drafts f***ing virtanen. !!!

 

[ProstheticConscience]

Nice backpass to nobody at the blueline tonight, Jake.

 

[Kryten]

Nice backpass to nobody at the blueline tonight, Jake.

Not even a backpass which would have been more understandable, it was lateral while gaining the o-zone. Sure under normal circumstances a player might be there but he had no idea of his surroundings. Its like turning left onto a road while only looking right. The play that followed looked like Hemsky after Stepans empty net miss

 

[mathonwy]

So I'm reading that the Sedins are going through the motions right now (no big surprise).

And if the Sedins are going through the motions... and

...

Jake is a follower. This whole team is full of followers because that's the type of person Jimbo seems to like hiring.

My overall assessment of Jake is that he won't be successful without a centerman that is telling him exactly what to do and where to go.

Are we seeing such communication between Jake and the Sedins? Is Hank "taking charge"? Do we see them talking with each other at the bench?