Proposal: I WANT TANEV!!!!! (TOR/VAN)

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bukwas

Stanley Cup 2022
Sep 27, 2017
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1st and 2nd is fine, taking into account Tanev's injury history, like you said. He would be relied upon even more here (he's probably going to be put on the 1st pairing PK the second he comes here) and his usage will be even tougher into the playoffs, if he remains healthy. The playoff point is something that I feel some*, not all Canuck fans fail to realize. The playoffs are a war-zone, we need Tanev's body to hold up when the game gets even faster and more heavy.

The problem is, *some of your fellow Canuck fans are asking for either Nylander, 2 1st's.......even pushing for an extra 2nd/equivalent prospect, on top of late 1st + 2nd is too rich for me. The idea is that, you need a pipeline of ELC guys that develop well feeding into the system when the core guy's contracts start eating up large amounts of cap-space. A guy like Tanev, is a guy who is promising enough to cement himself as a core player if he's healthy and performs well, but we're still going to need those picks to get prospects to feed the other positions (guys like Liljegren on their ELC, Grundstrom, list goes on).

If anything, I think Dubas has this archetype all planned out and based on his interviews, I actually think he's leaning more towards the status quo rather than moving any picks, period. Otherwise, something like this would have been done around the draft. The next window probably opens closer to the TDL.

Exactly.
A strong development/draft program will be the key to sustaining a highly competitive team. Remember how the Av's used to be able to slot prospects into roles veterans were leaving(usually for more picks/prospects to continue the cycle) and doing so without setting the team back? They kept their competitive window open for a long time employing that strategy.
 

Lemmiwinks

Registered User
Jun 11, 2011
2,044
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1st and 2nd is fine, taking into account Tanev's injury history, like you said. He would be relied upon even more here (he's probably going to be put on the 1st pairing PK the second he comes here) and his usage will be even tougher into the playoffs, if he remains healthy. The playoff point is something that I feel some*, not all Canuck fans fail to realize. The playoffs are a war-zone, we need Tanev's body to hold up when the game gets even faster and more heavy.

The problem is, *some of your fellow Canuck fans are asking for either Nylander, 2 1st's.......even pushing for an extra 2nd/equivalent prospect, on top of late 1st + 2nd is too rich for me. The idea is that, you need a pipeline of ELC guys that develop well feeding into the system when the core guy's contracts start eating up large amounts of cap-space. A guy like Tanev, is a guy who is promising enough to cement himself as a core player if he's healthy and performs well, but we're still going to need those picks to get prospects to feed the other positions (guys like Liljegren on their ELC, Grundstrom, list goes on).

If anything, I think Dubas has this archetype all planned out and based on his interviews, I actually think he's leaning more towards the status quo rather than moving any picks, period. Otherwise, something like this would have been done around the draft. The next window probably opens closer to the TDL.

That's all fair. Other Canucks fans might want more but I'm just being realistic. To counter, there are some Leafs fans who won't even offer a late 1st for Tanev (and I have to wonder if it's been too long since they've seen the benefits of a top shutdown defender on their team - not a dig, just a reality).

It's fine to want to keep futures, but for a competitive team that needs to keep loading up against Tampa, the price Tanev will likely cost is a bargain imo. I mean, who else is as good a fit who's available for less than a 5m cap hit for the next two years? Even if you let him walk after his current contract I think it's worth the gamble. It can be hard to part with picks after we've just had the draft to watch, but come playoff time the feeling will be different.

All competitive teams have to make gambles when loading up. Leafs fans are lucky their team is at that stage.
 

Lemmiwinks

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Jun 11, 2011
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Exactly.
A strong development/draft program will be the key to sustaining a highly competitive team. Remember how the Av's used to be able to slot prospects into roles veterans were leaving(usually for more picks/prospects to continue the cycle) and doing so without setting the team back? They kept their competitive window open for a long time employing that strategy.

Sure, ideally you keep all your picks and win the cup every year with new ELCs rolling in. That's called having your cake and eating it too. It's also a huge gamble you're making by choosing not to trade assets to make your already very good core as good as it can possibly be.

What if, for example, your late 1st round pick in 2019 busts? Now you've wasted a better chance at winning the 2019 cup because you were worrying about winning in 2022.
 

bukwas

Stanley Cup 2022
Sep 27, 2017
5,644
2,801
Sure, ideally you keep all your picks and win the cup every year with new ELCs rolling in. That's called having your cake and eating it too. It's also a huge gamble you're making by choosing not to trade assets to make your already very good core as good as it can possibly be.

What if, for example, your late 1st round pick in 2019 busts? Now you've wasted a better chance at winning the 2019 cup because you were worrying about winning in 2022.

Haven't seen anyone suggest that.

There are no moves/plans that guarantee Cups, so we opt to support various strategies to accomplish it. That one would be my preference.
 

GoodbyeLuongo

Registered User
Jun 8, 2012
1,927
638
Seattle
Kapanen is a potential 20-25 goal scorer if he gets top 9 minutes...I think people underrate him.

People probably do underrate him but my goodness do Leaf fans overrate him. Prior to last season he was “supposed” to be better than Boeser. He’s probably going to be a fine player but he has nothing to indicate he’ll be more than a bottom 6 speedster. As someone said above, he’s in the Jannik Hansen mold.
 

Kamiccolo

Truly wonderful, the mind of a child is.
Aug 30, 2011
26,828
16,944
Undisclosed research facility
What if we did something like

Conditional 1st 2019 * Condition being if he plays under 65 games, Vancouver has the option to take a 2nd 2019 and 2nd 2020 OR defer the 1st round pick to 2020 where the condition will be he has to appear in at least 50 games*

Bracco

If Vancouver is not confident he will play either 65 games or 50 games the year after for that first, then that should speak to his actual value.
 

The List Of Jericho

Judas effect
Mar 1, 2002
18,024
3,500
Toronto
People probably do underrate him but my goodness do Leaf fans overrate him. Prior to last season he was “supposed” to be better than Boeser. He’s probably going to be a fine player but he has nothing to indicate he’ll be more than a bottom 6 speedster. As someone said above, he’s in the Jannik Hansen mold.

He hasn’t been given any real opportunity besides 4th line minutes and the PK.
 

Sypher04

Registered User
Jan 20, 2011
11,702
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If we ask Tanev really nicely could he just get his yearly injuries out of the way at the start of the season so we can have him for second half & playoffs? Lol
 

zeke

The Dube Abides
Mar 14, 2005
66,937
36,957
lulz.

We'll give the canucks a 2nd and a 4th for Tanev.
 

Cotton

Registered User
May 13, 2013
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That's all fair. Other Canucks fans might want more but I'm just being realistic. To counter, there are some Leafs fans who won't even offer a late 1st for Tanev (and I have to wonder if it's been too long since they've seen the benefits of a top shutdown defender on their team - not a dig, just a reality).

It's fine to want to keep futures, but for a competitive team that needs to keep loading up against Tampa, the price Tanev will likely cost is a bargain imo. I mean, who else is as good a fit who's available for less than a 5m cap hit for the next two years? Even if you let him walk after his current contract I think it's worth the gamble. It can be hard to part with picks after we've just had the draft to watch, but come playoff time the feeling will be different.

All competitive teams have to make gambles when loading up. Leafs fans are lucky their team is at that stage.

It’s more just not wanting to spend assets on the defensive version of Joffrey Lupul, who we are all too familiar with, and who also suffered from weird injuries.

There is such a risk involved with acquiring Tanev that for me personally i’d rather just pass all together. I’d happily pay a big price on a D that deserves one, but at this point Tanev isn’t. He’s great when he does play (like Lupul) but it’s guaranteed he’ll be sitting soon enough with another injury (like Lupul).
 

DadBod

Registered User
Sep 1, 2009
3,361
15
Coquitlam
I want to address Tanev being injury prone.


While he always misses games I’m hesitant to give him the “injury prone” tag. To me being injury prone means you’re always pulling muscles, tearing soft tissue, injuring joints, injured back etc.

While he has suffered some injuries of that nature, he usually suffers injuries that aren’t projectable. He blocks a tonne if shots and has suffered injuries because of it.

He’s also the Canucks #1 defenseman who plays the toughest matchups. The Canucks suck and because of that are always pinned in their own zone, Tanev takes a lot of hits on the forecheck and battles physically in his own zone. Tanev is in a situation where he’s always getting hammered by the forwards, and when he isn’t he’s blocking shots.

If Tanev were on a better team with better team mates, he wouldn’t be taking the amount of abuse he does with the Canucks. He wouldn’t be blocking as many shots, he wouldn’t be getting hammered on the forecheck. It’s not unreasonable to think his health could see a 50% bump.

Tanev is a Warrior in every sense of the word. He plays tough minutes and is one of the best defensive defenseman in the game. On a different team his play and health would greatly improve.
 
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DadBod

Registered User
Sep 1, 2009
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Coquitlam
that's cause he doesn't play more than 10 games before getting injured


No it’s because 0% of Eastern Maple leafs fans stay up until 1am watching Canucks play hockey. The average person knows more about quantum physics than they do about Chris Tanev.

He’d be on the leafs first pairing, their best defensive player, only makes 4.5m and is a local Toronto kid. Those are facts folks.
 

Tavares to Marner

Registered User
Dec 20, 2011
2,455
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Hamilton
No it’s because 0% of Eastern Maple leafs fans stay up until 1am watching Canucks play hockey. The average person knows more about quantum physics than they do about Chris Tanev.

He’d be on the leafs first pairing, their best defensive player, only makes 4.5m and is a local Toronto kid. Those are facts folks.

it's not a question of talent and I don't think you Vancouver fans can't understand that

of course hed be our best defensemen that's not even a debate but when was the last time he played a full 82 games?

durability not talent is the question here.

You can't seriously expect a young healthy up and coming guy in Nylander for a guy who can't play 60 games
 

kmart

Registered User
Jan 23, 2008
4,350
671
leafs top players just disappeared in the post season... why would u throw out picks and build around them... its to early to make such moves. you will suck for another decade if u throw out ur picks for the slightest hope your young guns give you.
 

DadBod

Registered User
Sep 1, 2009
3,361
15
Coquitlam
it's not a question of talent and I don't think you Vancouver fans can't understand that

of course hed be our best defensemen that's not even a debate but when was the last time he played a full 82 games?

durability not talent is the question here.

You can't seriously expect a young healthy up and coming guy in Nylander for a guy who can't play 60 games


No I don’t think Tanev for Nylander is a trade the Leafs should make. Look a few posts up, I addressed Tanevs injuries. Respond if you disagree.


But as is the case with both fan bases, we deal in extremes. Do I think Tanev for Nylander is fair? No of course not.

Do I think Tanev is worth a late 1st round pick + legit prospect? Yes of course.
 
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DougGilmour93

Registered User
Feb 7, 2007
7,395
702
Most I’d pay would be a 2nd and a prospect (Bracco) for Tanev.
He’s just too injury prone. We’d acquire him and he’d end up missing half the seasons + playoffs...
 

clunk

Registered User
Dec 10, 2015
11,343
5,418
I'm gonna..
Most I’d pay would be a 2nd and a prospect (Bracco) for Tanev.
He’s just too injury prone. We’d acquire him and he’d end up missing half the seasons + playoffs...
You're not making it past Tampa Bay or Washington without a steady d-core. You take the risk and pay the price or don't improve your defense.
 

Tavares to Marner

Registered User
Dec 20, 2011
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No I don’t think Tanev for Nylander is a trade the Leafs should make. Look a few posts up, I addressed Tanevs injuries. Respond if you disagree.


But as is the case with both fan bases, we deal in extremes. Do I think Tanev for Nylander is fair? No of course not.

Do I think Tanev is worth a late 1st round pick + legit prospect? Yes of course.

1st and kapanen is more than fair, sorry for coming off harsh but there is still a vocal few that believe Tanev is worth Nylander
 

elitepete

Registered User
Jan 30, 2017
8,156
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Vancouver
What if we did something like

Conditional 1st 2019 * Condition being if he plays under 65 games, Vancouver has the option to take a 2nd 2019 and 2nd 2020 OR defer the 1st round pick to 2020 where the condition will be he has to appear in at least 50 games*

Bracco

If Vancouver is not confident he will play either 65 games or 50 games the year after for that first, then that should speak to his actual value.
If Tanev plays 70 games his value is much higher than a 1st and Bracco.

If he were available for some ridiculous trade like this, he would already be a leaf.
 

bukwas

Stanley Cup 2022
Sep 27, 2017
5,644
2,801
You're not making it past Tampa Bay or Washington without a steady d-core. You take the risk and pay the price or don't improve your defense.
True but there are players whose risk is far less. I think they'd be better off limiting the risk as much as possible.
 
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