Speculation: Habs Mega Thread

[Kosseca]

Hab fans that think Chiarot will get a 1st are clowns basing there stupid reasoning on “Savard got a 1st last year”.

Trade prices are based on supply and demand like anything else. Players that are targeted at the trade deadline are the best UFAs from teams that will not make the playoffs. Teams that are looking to add are the top 2 or 3 teams with real shots at the cup (TB, Vegas, Colorado) looking to add depth for shorty term help for a playoff run. They don’t have plans to resign the player and are fine at letting them go at the end of the year cause they already have a group of dmen that already made their team a top contender. Teams that are in the hunt aren’t going to trade there own top end UFA dmen.

So if we look back at last years UFA dmen,.

Hamilton (Carolina not getting traded at the deadline)
Ditto Oleksiak, Larson, Suter, Ceci, Poolman, Forbort, kulikov, etc

That leaves Savard at the top, Haminic Goligoski, type of players.

let’s look at this years UFA dmen

Subban, Letang, Girodano, Boychuk, Stralman, Leddy, Ristolainen, Dekeyser, Dehaan, Klingberg, Manson, lindholm, maata, Miller, Butcher, Murphy, Edler……all UFA dmen on teams that will likely be on teams that are not on clear contenders, and most not ebven bubble teams. There is lots of supply, and demand will be the real contenders. Ben Chiarot is not going to be passing those players to be the prize UFA demand at trade deadline.

So it is time for you clowns to go back to the circus.

Are you a NHL DG by any chance? If not, then you don't know more then anyone here what Chiarot could fetch. You are speculating as much as any fan saying that he could fetch a 1st.

Your reasoning is as flawed as the reasoning of the fans stating that Savard has fetched a 1st, so Chiarot will 100% fetch one too.... For example, more then half of the name of Dman on your list a not for trade. their UFA status is irrelevant.

Anyway, the value of Chiarot will be based on the supply and demand at the time of the trade and how the two DGs involved value him. Injuries, place in the standing, cap space, type of Dman needed will play a more important role in the negotiation then going through a list of ufa.

 

[Stubu]

I’d rather keep Price if that’s the return. Retaining on him means Montreal is saving nothing on goaltending once you replace him with another starter. Taking your crap goalie back and a pick that might not be that high is an insulting offer

Koskinen isn't crap, he's mediocre, and overpaid for that. But let's remember, mediocre in NHL is what plenty of goalies dream of achieving.

Don't get insulted so easy? (Okay, you didn't.)

The whole point was, nobody knows if Price returns. If his rehab program ends up telling him to avoid the pressure cooker, then that's exactly what he should do. It is what it is. I have mad respect for him for finally taking the one single universally good piece of advice there is: ask for help.

Retaining on Price would be the only way to move that contract anywhere.

 

[Qwijibo]

Koskinen isn't crap, he's mediocre, and overpaid for that. But let's remember, mediocre in NHL is what plenty of goalies dream of achieving.

Don't get insulted so easy? (Okay, you didn't.)

The whole point was, nobody knows if Price returns. If his rehab program ends up telling him to avoid the pressure cooker, then that's exactly what he should do. It is what it is. I have mad respect for him for finally taking the one single universally good piece of advice there is: ask for help.

Retaining on Price would be the only way to move that contract anywhere.

Price is already out of his treatment program and has rejoined the team. He’s still rehabbing his knee from the offseason surgery. Regardless my point stands. Retaining $5m a year on Him means paying even a marginal replacement saves no cap space for Montreal. They’re better off keeping him under those circumstances than giving him away for what amounts to nothing

 

[Brixton]

dekeyser, matta, dehaan, elder, murphy, butcher cannot handle the playoffs minutes that chariot would . boychuk is finished and klingberg will be resigned . bringing subban to a new team wouldn't be recommended either . letang giordano leddy and lindholm are the only ones better . lindholm will also be resigned most likely

Way to not answer the question. You said half the guys on that list suck. There isn’t a guy on that list that I would take Chiarot over.

Top contenders that are trading a first at trade deadline are not looking for a guy to come in and play big minutes. They are one of the top teams in the league and have dmen sooooo much better than Chiarot. They want a guy that can step in to play better than their worst #6 dman that is a rookie or plays sheltered minutes or as a insurance piece for depth.

Dmen that suck are guys that make stupid mistakes over and over and don’t learn. Chiarot sucks.

Let’s look at last nights game.

1st goal..crosbys goal. Chiarot is the last dman back. Scrum at center ice, and he takes a stride towards the penguins zone when the puck comes out behind him (mistake). He races back and doesn’t take a man, he doesn’t play the pass (mistake)…instead he takes out his own goalie (mistake)…that sucks.

3rd goal guentzels goal. Chiarot backs in on his goalie on a 3 on 2. He doesn’t play the pass, or the player that goes to the net (mistake), instead he backs right into the sight line of the goalie and screens him so he can’t see the shot (mistake). That sucks.

4th goal bluegers goal - Chiarot is the middle dman on a 1 on 3. Two canadien guys are on McGinn at the blue line and Chiarot thinks he will leave the. Danger zone to make it 3 guys chasing McGinn (mistake)..leaving 2 penguin guys free behind in the center of the ice behind him to walk in alone (mistake). That sucks.

6th goal - bluegers 2nd goal. Chiarot is coming out of the Penguins zone and glides (that means he doesn’t even take one stride. At all) from 10 feet inside the Penguins zone, all the way to the time he is 15 feet away from his own blue line. (Mistake). The pass comes off the boards past the last guy back who is chiarot (who still doesn’t take a stride but waves his stick at it…mistake) and bluegers is in on a breakaway. Chiarot still glides as he goes in and scores. That sucks.

those are what 8 or 9 mistakes in one game (not even the whole game, I am sure there are way more ) that would get any player in the league sent to the press box for months. These are plays that are all basic things that are drilled into players from the time they start playing the game. Chiarot is not a rookie. He is 30 years old. He makes that many mistakes in one game …he sucks. What contender is going to wants him on their team just to wait for him to make a mistake that will cost them games. The answer is no one. Who is going to give up a 1st for a chance to have Chiarot screwe up? No one.

So when someone asks who from my list sucks, don’t dodge the question. Show them the evidence, not comments like yours. Show them a guy that is supposedly worth a 1st, who makes as many mistakes as Chiarot did in one game. Let’s make that clear, those where all in one game. That is a dman who “in your words” suck.

 

[Stubu]

Price is already out of his treatment program and has rejoined the team. He’s still rehabbing his knee from the offseason surgery. Regardless my point stands. Retaining $5m a year on Him means paying even a marginal replacement saves no cap space for Montreal. They’re better off keeping him under those circumstances than giving him away for what amounts to nothing

Fair enough, and good for him.

I was thinking of the case where the $5m after retainment gets Montreal a starter. Tall order, that, admitted.

Injured knee my ass. If his brain chemistry is sorted out, all good.

 

[Qwijibo]

Fair enough, and good for him.

I was thinking of the case where the $5m after retainment gets Montreal a starter. Tall order, that, admitted.

Injured knee my ass. If his brain chemistry is sorted out, all good.

He was in the treatment program for substance abuse, so I don’t know what brain chemistry has to do with it. He had a problem and got help. You can choose to use that as excuse to devalue him but the logic remains thst if the reason 50% on him they still need to replace him so they save nothing. If their not clearing a bunch of cap in the deal then they they better get a significant return for him. If they keep him and he’s not able to continue playing then he’s on LTIR and they can move on

 

[jfhabs]

Lol what's your counter-argument for saying that Anderson and Boeser are equal or even close in value then (as OP suggested)? I don't see any. Is he Mark Stone or Brad Marchand in that he has such a strong two-way game that it would elevate him to Brock's level? I get that roster construction-wise Boeser isn't a fit, but I'm just showing how much highway robbery OP tried to pull on Vancouver (along with addressing our roster needs, which can't be ignored either if we're trading the only player who's been an NHL all-star). We need Romanov or another young two-way D-man coming back, and him alone won't be enough (another of Vancouver's weaknesses is RH C, but I doubt Evans has the high ceiling to warrant a return which, along with Romanov, wouldn't look like pennies on the dollar if more wasn't added in return).

Also say what you want about a slumping player having depressed value, when trades actually happen you still see the team acquiring them shelling out assets -- and if you (or OP) want Brock, then it shouldn't be any different in this case.

I'm not saying he's close to Boeser. I'm saying trying to gauge his value using only point production waa disengenuous since he brings a lot more to the table in terms of speed and physicality which makes space for playmakers/snipers on his line.
Yes OP proposition was off in valu but so was your attempt. Our pick has good chances of being 1st overall right now, there's no way we trade it for Boeser let alone adding a quality complementary player and a 21yo defender with #3-4 upside

 

[Stubu]

He was in the treatment program for substance abuse, so I don’t know what brain chemistry has to do with it. He had a problem and got help.

Whether it's alcohol, opioids, or whatever, every doctor knows brain chemistry is involved. It's not the liver wanting that stuff. (And what goes on in the brain is way beyond mere chemistry. I'm not a neurologist so I digress.)

You can choose to use that as excuse to devalue him

Didn't mean to devalue him. He's the best goalie I've seen. Outside the elite goaltending, he's a sixth skater in the team like Rinne wanted to be. Awesome.

but the logic remains thst if the reason 50% on him they still need to replace him so they save nothing. If their not clearing a bunch of cap in the deal then they they better get a significant return for him. If they keep him and he’s not able to continue playing then he’s on LTIR and they can move on

If they retained 50%, it would be for getting a replacement for a probably LTIR guy. Yeah I'm not sure it makes that much sense.

 

[Gabe Kupari]

Carey price wouldn't waive for Edmonton. Only Seattle was mentioned because his wife is from there

Edmonton can't afford him and I highly doubt he'd agree.

 

[Habs Halifax]

The same insiders who thought Montreal wouldn't suck? Lol chiarot a 1st... GMs are dumb but nobody giving up a 1st for a 3 lhd... just not happening. It's Ben Chiarot... I mean really at what point do Montreal fans eat that humble pie and just accept you guys and the so called experts don't know shit really. You guys have been wrong for the last 6 months now and the insiders are just looking for clicks so u know... big fan base there for Montreal.

Creating this false narrative ("you guys") have been wrong for 6 months about everything is a joke! And grouping us all into one opinion is massive ignorance and disrespectful. I really which HF boards would make it against the rules to generalize fans bases into one option. It's a horrible way to have a conversation.

Personally, I have my doubts Chiarot gets a 1st. Not all of us feel that way bud. I think two 2nd's is more reachable. But if you feel that Chiarot is meh and only a bottom pairing LD, you are only making yourself look bad. He's a very solid guy to have if you need a physical skating LD who raises his game in the playoffs. He was no doubt in my mind one of many reasons why the Habs were able to win playoff series against the Pens, Leafs, Jets, and Knights in the last two playoffs. If you don't agree, I don't think you know what you are talking about and you are probably the type that thinks only offense matters.

 

[Guy Larose]

The same insiders who thought Montreal wouldn't suck? Lol chiarot a 1st... GMs are dumb but nobody giving up a 1st for a 3 lhd... just not happening. It's Ben Chiarot... I mean really at what point do Montreal fans eat that humble pie and just accept you guys and the so called experts don't know shit really. You guys have been wrong for the last 6 months now and the insiders are just looking for clicks so u know... big fan base there for Montreal.

Neither do most posters in this thread and site, including you.

 

[glenbuis]

Way to not answer the question. You said half the guys on that list suck. There isn’t a guy on that list that I would take Chiarot over.

Top contenders that are trading a first at trade deadline are not looking for a guy to come in and play big minutes. They are one of the top teams in the league and have dmen sooooo much better than Chiarot. They want a guy that can step in to play better than their worst #6 dman that is a rookie or plays sheltered minutes or as a insurance piece for depth.

Dmen that suck are guys that make stupid mistakes over and over and don’t learn. Chiarot sucks.

Let’s look at last nights game.

1st goal..crosbys goal. Chiarot is the last dman back. Scrum at center ice, and he takes a stride towards the penguins zone when the puck comes out behind him (mistake). He races back and doesn’t take a man, he doesn’t play the pass (mistake)…instead he takes out his own goalie (mistake)…that sucks.

3rd goal guentzels goal. Chiarot backs in on his goalie on a 3 on 2. He doesn’t play the pass, or the player that goes to the net (mistake), instead he backs right into the sight line of the goalie and screens him so he can’t see the shot (mistake). That sucks.

4th goal bluegers goal - Chiarot is the middle dman on a 1 on 3. Two canadien guys are on McGinn at the blue line and Chiarot thinks he will leave the. Danger zone to make it 3 guys chasing McGinn (mistake)..leaving 2 penguin guys free behind in the center of the ice behind him to walk in alone (mistake). That sucks.

6th goal - bluegers 2nd goal. Chiarot is coming out of the Penguins zone and glides (that means he doesn’t even take one stride. At all) from 10 feet inside the Penguins zone, all the way to the time he is 15 feet away from his own blue line. (Mistake). The pass comes off the boards past the last guy back who is chiarot (who still doesn’t take a stride but waves his stick at it…mistake) and bluegers is in on a breakaway. Chiarot still glides as he goes in and scores. That sucks.

those are what 8 or 9 mistakes in one game (not even the whole game, I am sure there are way more ) that would get any player in the league sent to the press box for months. These are plays that are all basic things that are drilled into players from the time they start playing the game. Chiarot is not a rookie. He is 30 years old. He makes that many mistakes in one game …he sucks. What contender is going to wants him on their team just to wait for him to make a mistake that will cost them games. The answer is no one. Who is going to give up a 1st for a chance to have Chiarot screwe up? No one.

So when someone asks who from my list sucks, don’t dodge the question. Show them the evidence, not comments like yours. Show them a guy that is supposedly worth a 1st, who makes as many mistakes as Chiarot did in one game. Let’s make that clear, those where all in one game. That is a dman who “in your words” suck.

i have never seen a fan so messed up over having his team swept in the playoffs . did you break down every one of the habs plays ? obviously last year's playoffs have your panties in a knot . i'll repeat . your jets were the easiest team to SWEEP. by far the easiest . they laid like a cheap rug .

i have you mixed up with the other messed up fellow . i gave you an answer of over half the list who are not as good as chariot . your entitled to your opinion though . good luck watching your game films

 

[MTL Dirty Birdy]

I think Chiarot gets a first( assuming the market isn’t saturated. Big, physical, can skate, shit down AND is young enough to resign a multi year deal. Someone will want him. I look at teams like Vegas and Colorado, NYR, NYI and Pittsburgh all needing somebody like this. Not just this spring but for the next few years

 

[Hunter368]

I would suggest some take it down a notch & stay on topic (Habs players for trade/value) if you want to continue in this thread.

Friendly warning.

 

[FedorTyutin]

I have a bold prediction :

Koekkoek and Nurse are on IR.
EDM are trading 1st + Lavoie to MTL in an exchange that brings them Ben Chiarot back.

 

[CapSpace]

I have a bold prediction :

Koekkoek and Nurse are on IR.
EDM are trading 1st + Lavoie to MTL in an exchange that brings them Ben Chiarot back.

It'd be robbery from Montreal. So I'm in.

 

[zar]

I have a bold prediction :

Koekkoek and Nurse are on IR.
EDM are trading 1st + Lavoie to MTL in an exchange that brings them Ben Chiarot back.

Not a f.... chance!

 

[Kimota]

I'd be livid if my team gave up a 1st for Chariot. Livid.

Depends on which Chiarot shows up. This year the whole team sucks, nobody as value. But if we talk about the Chiatot from the playoffs, if I was any team, I would do it. He was a big reason why the Habs won so many games. A big mean physical D that acted as a great shutdown pair with Weber. These type of guys have enormous value still.

 

[glenbuis]

How old are you son? If you can’t keep on topic and have to regress to making comments about something not related to the post, I assume your brain hasn’t developed fully so I would say 8 or 9, unless you are getting your mom to do typing for you…then you could be younger.

You said half those players “sucked”. Backup what you say. I showed you what exactly “sucked” means. Chiarot sucks.

tell you what go back and show me 1 game where anyone on that list made 9 glaring BASIC mistakes like Chiarot did last night. I will wait. If you have to wit until after nap time, I will understand junior.

i'm in my fifties there junior and i've watched enough playoff hockey to know that when the refs put the whistle away in the playoffs, guys like chariot become a lot tougher to play against. in last year's playoffs he logged 25 + minutes and was very good in a shutdown role . everybody has a bad game but for the most part he's been our best defenseman this year . i respect the fact you don't like him but there will be teams looking for him at 50% retention

 

[NoGoalCaufield]

Dermott for Caufield?

who adds?

 

[glenbuis]

How old are you son? If you can’t keep on topic and have to regress to making comments about something not related to the post, I assume your brain hasn’t developed fully so I would say 8 or 9, unless you are getting your mom to do typing for you…then you could be younger.

You said half those players “sucked”. Backup what you say. I showed you what exactly “sucked” means. Chiarot sucks.

tell you what go back and show me 1 game where anyone on that list made 9 glaring BASIC mistakes like Chiarot did last night. I will wait. If you have to wit until after nap time, I will understand junior.

so to further backup my claim , you had 17 players you would take before chariot . i named six that would not be as effective as chariot in the playoffs. (matta,dekeyser,dehaan,butcher,murphy,and elder.) a seventh would be boychuk whose playing days are over . an eighth subban at 50 % would still be 4.5 and a questionable add to any room . i will also add a 35 year old stralman who is not very physical or offensive.

as for the remaining 8 , lindholm and klingberg will resign there respective teams . giordano at 38 has slowed down considerably and is twice as expensive. letang is not an easy fit cap wise . that only leaves leddy , risto,miller and manson all of whom have higher cap hits than chariot .

i'm really curious as to whom your team is though because i seem to have struck a nerve with you .

 

[ole ole]

That is lot of conditions.

More like a lot of nothing.

 

[ole ole]

Dermott for Caufield?

who adds?

2 Dermotts wouldn't net you 1 Caulfield.

 

[kilowatt]

Just for fun, what would it cost to get Toffoli back to LA?

 

[AlexGretzchenvid]

Just for fun, what would it cost to get Toffoli back to LA?

You can just have him lol