GDT: Game 67: Colorado Avalanche @ Columbus Blue Jackets - Black and Blue - 5PM

[member 116861]

Bottom line, these are starting to become must-win games and this team just refuses to win lately. The games are there for the taking and then Tyson Barrie tends to happen.

We aren't even getting close in these games unless Tyson Barrie happens.

 

[hooverdam]

We aren't even getting close in these games unless Tyson Barrie happens.

He's seriously the only one consistently scoring right now. I know his points are often considered lucky or fake or they count less than Real Defenseman Points or something, but the fact is that with the top line struggling, he is the only other gamebreaker in the lineup.

 

[Thepoolmaster]

I think we are seeing what happens when you have three rookies as your secondary scoring down the stretch. They just aren't ready for the longer and tougher schedule near the end of the year. I'm not overly concerned because of this and the fact that this is a development year .Playoffs would be amazing by wasn't expecting it at the start of the season so won't be too upset if they can't pull it off especially after the EJ injury.

Hopefully they can find that last bit of energy to push into the playoffs though . Next year will be a different story if they can't come through at the end of the year.

 

[AvsGuy]

Tyson Barrie is not the reason this team lost tonight.

We aren't even getting close in these games unless Tyson Barrie happens.

His scoring is great, but his mind boggling defensive plays cost us momentum. That play on the Jenner goal was a pin in the balloon.

 

[McMetal]

His scoring is great, but his mind boggling defensive plays cost us momentum. That play on the Jenner goal was a pin in the balloon.

He scored a beautiful goal, then skated into his own defensive partner for another goal against. So roughly even on the night for him.

 

[Patagonia]

He scored a beautiful goal, then skated into his own defensive partner for another goal against. So roughly even on the night for him.

Actually, he cost another goal in overtime.

So he ended -1 for the night.

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

We aren't even getting close in these games unless Tyson Barrie happens.

He was directly responsible for 2 goals against tonight(And I dont even consider the OT goal his fault), and 1 goal for.


I'm not harking on Barrie. I think he's a great player and does a lot of good things for us. But he also does a decent amount of bad.


Against Chicago, he was a big part of the reason we got to OT. Tonight, he was a part of the reason why we didn't get 2 points.

 

[chet1926]

When Makar arrives we will be much better at this OT thing.

And Timmins, and when they let Girard go out there instead of captain lose my man Barrie.

 

[member 116861]

And Timmins, and when they let Girard go out there instead of captain lose my man Barrie.

You mean Mikko Rantanen?

 

[SaltySkywalker]

It’s crazy how one player can completely split this board apart.

 

[forsbergavs32]

I didn't see the game but it sounds like this team's inability to be dominant on the road once again caused another loss. It's just so weird to me, I don't think I've ever seen a team like this before.

 

[Foppberg]

It’s crazy how one player can completely split this board apart.

I agree, Nemeth is something else..

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

It’s crazy how one player can completely split this board apart.

I just think it's hilarious the lengths some folks go to try and paint this picture of a Dman that Tyson Barrie isn't.

On both sides of the coin really, but it seems the Barrie defenders are completely oblivious to the bad plays he makes.

 

[Perratrooper]

I am pro trading Barrie, but also pro Barrie. Barrie is a game breaker and right now is our only secondary scoring. I myself am not blind to Barrie's defensive mistakes, but at the same time he's stepping up in a big way to replace EJ. Heck Barrie has 13 points in the 10 games EJ has been hurt and while I'm sure he's cost us some games, other games he's the only reason we're in them. No one here is claiming Barrie is a defensive stud and we all know he makes his fair share of mistakes in his own end, but he's currently stepping up doing an admirable job filling EJ's shoes. He likely knows he wont ever match EJ in d zone play, but if he can bring game changing play and offence the way he has, we might just be able to survive the loss.

He's a #3 stepping up to play his best as a #1, he's facing much tougher matchups and he's gonna get beat, but right now I'm very happy he's on our team.

 

[The Abusement Park]

I think the biggest issue I have with the pro trade Barrie crew is the expectations for him. I think it's pretty clear to everyone and their grandmother that he isn't a defensive stalwart and never will be, but when he gets played as a #1 (which tbh he never should be) his biggest flaws are obviously exposed, but at the same time when he plays #1 minutes he piles up points. He's a very polarizing player, but his offensive skill set is the most elite of the elite and I think he's a player that would be sorely missed once he's gone.

 

[hooverdam]

I guess my main problem is that Johnson's mistakes are never highlighted to the extent that Barrie's are. Johnson is heralded as a 1D here when he doesn't bring the same dynamic on offense that Barrie does, and that I believe a true 1D should. This is excused by his good defense, but the opposite never holds true for Barrie.

Johnson makes mistakes. Barrie makes mistakes. Every defenseman makes mistakes, and a heck of a lot of them wind up in the back of the net; it's the nature of the position. But there's definitely a double standard in how each defenseman's mistakes are tallied up and used against him. Johnson's sound defense is enough to make up for his lack of offense compared to Barrie, but Barrie's offense isn't ever enough to make up for his deficiencies on defense compared to Johnson. It's like people think the point of hockey is to not get scored on instead of scoring and there's more value in the former than the latter.

 

[Hinterland]

Bednar saying after the game that he didn't think the team deserved a point but he said it and almost laughed. He knows how bad the team played. He also said he thinks a lot of guys have hit a wall, that their heart is in it but the effort/energy isn't and that has to change. Can't say I disagree. The Avs were outworked mightily in Chicago and tonight.

They NEED to beat Arizona.

I think it was a mistake not to play Yakupov after his strong performance. I also wanna see Kamenev if he's good to go. Heck, I'd even take a look at Alt...it's not like Nemeth or Lindholm have been any good recently. Team looks tired. Some fresh bodies could help.

 

[forsbergavs32]

I think it was a mistake not to play Yakupov after his strong performance. I also wanna see Kamenev if he's good to go. Heck, I'd even take a look at Alt...it's not like Nemeth or Lindholm have been any good recently. Team looks tired. Some fresh bodies could help.

I'd be down to get some fresh bodies in the lineup

Lando-Mack-Rantanen
Ghetto-Jost-Compher
Nieto-Soda-Comeau
Kerfoot-Kamenev-Yak

Z-Barrie
Girard-Nemeth
Siemens-Alt

 

[the_fan]

And of course Kings won

 

[chet1926]

You mean Mikko Rantanen?

I'm not referring to tonight's game.

Barrie has a tendency to somehow consistently lose his guy at the worst possible times. He does it a lot and is one of the things that holds him back from being a 1st pairing dman.

 

[McMetal]

I guess my main problem is that Johnson's mistakes are never highlighted to the extent that Barrie's are. Johnson is heralded as a 1D here when he doesn't bring the same dynamic on offense that Barrie does, and that I believe a true 1D should. This is excused by his good defense, but the opposite never holds true for Barrie.

Johnson makes mistakes. Barrie makes mistakes. Every defenseman makes mistakes, and a heck of a lot of them wind up in the back of the net; it's the nature of the position. But there's definitely a double standard in how each defenseman's mistakes are tallied up and used against him. Johnson's sound defense is enough to make up for his lack of offense compared to Barrie, but Barrie's offense isn't ever enough to make up for his deficiencies on defense compared to Johnson. It's like people think the point of hockey is to not get scored on instead of scoring and there's more value in the former than the latter.

For me, it's because as a defenseman, defense is their primary job, and offense is a secondary function. I will always weight defensive prowess higher than offense when it comes to evaluating a defenseman. It is extremely weird to me, as somebody who played D, to hear people bring up points whenever Barrie is discussed, as if that somehow outweighs everything else and he has no other job to do on the ice.

 

[Jarey Curry]

He's seriously the only one consistently scoring right now. I know his points are often considered lucky or fake or they count less than Real Defenseman Points or something, but the fact is that with the top line struggling, he is the only other gamebreaker in the lineup.

Second best ppg per defensemen in the NHL, that cannot be luck

 

[chet1926]

I guess my main problem is that Johnson's mistakes are never highlighted to the extent that Barrie's are. Johnson is heralded as a 1D here when he doesn't bring the same dynamic on offense that Barrie does, and that I believe a true 1D should. This is excused by his good defense, but the opposite never holds true for Barrie.

Johnson makes mistakes. Barrie makes mistakes. Every defenseman makes mistakes, and a heck of a lot of them wind up in the back of the net; it's the nature of the position. But there's definitely a double standard in how each defenseman's mistakes are tallied up and used against him. Johnson's sound defense is enough to make up for his lack of offense compared to Barrie, but Barrie's offense isn't ever enough to make up for his deficiencies on defense compared to Johnson. It's like people think the point of hockey is to not get scored on instead of scoring and there's more value in the former than the latter.

The problem with Barrie is that he is a defenseman, key part being defense. Defenseman are supposed to be sound in their own end, which Barrie only is some of the time.

I don't think there is a Avs fan that doesn't like and appreciate what he does offensively. But it's really getting tiresome watching his deficiencies in his own end.

You're point is valid about offense and defense being equally important aspects to the game. They are, but in Barrie's case I don't think there is an Avs fan that wouldn't like to see a guy who scores 10-15% less say like 40-45pts guy instead of the 50+pts but was 15% more reliable in his own end.

But For Barrie right now his nice offensive game doesn't outweight his deficiencies defensively.

 

[cgf]

For me, it's because as a defenseman, defense is their primary job, and offense is a secondary function. I will always weight defensive prowess higher than offense when it comes to evaluating a defenseman. It is extremely weird to me, as somebody who played D, to hear people bring up points whenever Barrie is discussed, as if that somehow outweighs everything else and he has no other job to do on the ice.

This out-dated way of thinking is why I really hate that they are called defensemen in hockey instead of blueliners or even backs. A blueliner’s job is to defend, sure, but so is a forward’s. And both getting the puck back and moving it out of danger, are key duties of blueliners.

 

[EscapedGoat]

For me, it's because as a defenseman, defense is their primary job, and offense is a secondary function. I will always weight defensive prowess higher than offense when it comes to evaluating a defenseman. It is extremely weird to me, as somebody who played D, to hear people bring up points whenever Barrie is discussed, as if that somehow outweighs everything else and he has no other job to do on the ice.

So then conversely, an offensemans job is primarily offense?

Any offenseman who doesn't score at least 40 points a year is not doing their job?