Chiarelli Should Be Forced To Choose Between POHO or GM If He Stays

shoop

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of course...cause they've shown the ability to improve a team....

How does anybody think MacT was anything, but a total and absolute train wreck as GM?

The problem with the OBC is that they all got promorted/re-hired at higher level jobs when they were good at the jobs they ended up being terrible at.

KLowe was a pretty good GM who made some really bone-headed decisions as POHO.
MacT was a pretty good Head Coach for the Oilers most of his time here who made some insanely stupid decisions as GM.
 
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MessierII

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Bottom line is we're looking at the Bruins, the fact is they were basically prebuilt with everything you need at every position, even two freaking good goalies.

He's never had to "work" for a team like he has in Edmonton and honestly it's probably not surprising he's having a hard time with it. He never had to find a no.1 d-man in Boston. This stuff he never had to deal with, he's being exposed here for sure.

Gorton did a good job likely being hyper motivated because he had been passed over and wanted to show everyone he deserved a shot too.

As for the Oilers yes, they had a nice little playoff run last year, but honestly if Joe Thornton and Couture weren't playing with massive injuries, they probably lose in round 1. The Ducks series yes they did get screwed on video review calls, but if we're honest, they were also outplayed for a majority of that series.
So if the bruins win the cup this year does Chiarelli get credit for it since he drafted Pastrnak and Heinen signed Krug and left the vet core in tact for Sweeney to inherit? Trying to discredit his success in Boston is dumb. There’s enough legitimate criticism to toss around to not have to reach for the stars the way you do constantly.
 

Soundwave

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How does anybody think MacT was anything, but a total and absolute train wreck as GM?

The problem with the OBC is that they all got promorted/re-hired at higher level jobs when they were good at the jobs they ended up being terrible at.

KLowe was a pretty good GM who made some really bone-headed decisions as POHO.
MacT was a pretty good Head Coach for the Oilers most of his time here who made some insanely stupid decisions as GM.

At the same time how can we only look at one GM in that light and have blinders on to the current one?

This GM has made plenty of big mistakes too. If we're going to be harsh, then it should apply across the board, which I don't have a problem with.

I don't care who the GM is, I'm not as a fan interested in "being their friend", they have a job to do and their either do it well the first time without "do overs" or they don't. And if they don't ... we got a problem.
 

CantHaveTkachev

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How does anybody think MacT was anything, but a total and absolute train wreck as GM?

The problem with the OBC is that they all got promorted/re-hired at higher level jobs when they were good at the jobs they ended up being terrible at.

KLowe was a pretty good GM who made some really bone-headed decisions as POHO.
MacT was a pretty good Head Coach for the Oilers most of his time here who made some insanely stupid decisions as GM.
Kevin Lowe was a decent GM until Pronger broke his brain...some curious RFA signings, overpaying Horcoff, shoe-horning kids like Smid and Gagner into the line-up before they were ready
and then his hiring of Tambo and MacT set the team back years

MacT was a terrible GM...from bad coaching decisions (Eakins) to bad defenseman signings (Ference, Belov, Niktin, Fayne...just awful) to awful drafts

our AHL depth is awful due to not pissing a drop in the 2013 & 2014 drafts after the 1st round and it's burning us badly at the moment
 

StevenF1919

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Wow. Just wow.

MacT was clueless and out of depth as a GM. Nobody can seriously think MacT was anything but an absolute train wreck as a GM. MacT hiring of Eakins is probably the worst decision an Oilers GM has ever made.
MacT would have at least been able to match Chia's record of 1 playoff appearance in 3 seasons with McDavid, if not exceed it. If MacT was in charge we'd still have Hall, wouldn't have made that Reinhart trade, and wouldn't be stuck with Lucic and Russell for the next 100 years. He was awful but Chiarelli is in a league of his own.
of course...cause they've shown the ability to improve a team....



you win by building a good team, or you end up like the NY Islanders
a collection of good players but a terrible team
And what good team has Chia built? Take McDavid off the roster and this team is the worst in the league by far. All Chia had to do was keep the core group of guys and add some speedy depth players and a decent offensive top 4 RHD. He had the easiest job in the entire league and he blew it.
huh? Pronger and who else?
Pronger, Visnovsky, Pitkanen. For some reason I thought Whitney (who was a legit top pairing guy before he got hurt) was acquired by Lowe but it was Tambo.

You can add Brewer, Gilbert, Grebeshkov, and Spacek to the list of guys above that Lowe traded for who are all as good or better than Larsson and didn't cost Taylor Hall to acquire. Add in his draft picks and you've also got Greene and Petry.
 

Soundwave

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So if the bruins win the cup this year does Chiarelli get credit for it since he drafted Pastrnak and Heinen signed Krug and left the vet core in tact for Sweeney to inherit? Trying to discredit his success in Boston is dumb. There’s enough legitimate criticism to toss around to not have to reach for the stars the way you do constantly.

If they win the Cup even this year, I mean are Rask, Marchand, Bergeron, Krejeci, not key pieces? He didn't acquire any of these players.

There's nothing wrong with looking realistically at what he actually did in Boston instead of saying he "built" that team when he had nothing to do with a large majority of the good players on the team.

It really should not be shocking he is having such trouble in Edmonton, it's not so easy when you aren't gifted perfect forward and goalie depth and a no.1 stud D-Man right from day 1 on the job. He's had to do more work here and I think he proving he's not able to do it without making a lot of errors.

That's a legitimate point.
 

CantHaveTkachev

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MacT would have at least been able to match Chia's record of 1 playoff appearance in 3 seasons with McDavid, if not exceed it. If MacT was in charge we'd still have Hall, wouldn't have made that Reinhart trade, and wouldn't be stuck with Lucic and Russell for the next 100 years. He was awful but Chiarelli is in a league of his own.
uh huh, because of no evidence at all
and MacT does the Reinhart trade for sure...the Oilers brass LOVED Reinhart...to the point of considering at #1 in 2012


And what good team has Chia built? Take McDavid off the roster and this team is the worst in the league by far. All Chia had to do was keep the core group of guys and add some speedy depth players and a decent offensive top 4 RHD. He had the easiest job in the entire league and he blew it.
an overwhelming team that can't score on the PP or kill a penalty...or get a save on the 1st shot
I expect a rebound in all areas next year


Pronger, Visnovsky, Pitkanen. For some reason I thought Whitney (who was a legit top pairing guy before he got hurt) was acquired by Lowe but it was Tambo.

You can add Brewer, Gilbert, Grebeshkov, and Spacek to the list of guys above that Lowe traded for who are all as good or better than Larsson and didn't cost Taylor Hall to acquire. Add in his draft picks and you've also got Greene and Petry.
Pitkanen is a stretch...dude was out of the league in 4 years
and the pieces needed to obtain Visnovsky gutted our team depth (losing Stoll and Green) and didn't make the team better
 

MessierII

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If they win the Cup even this year, I mean are Rask, Marchand, Bergeron, Krejeci, not key pieces? He didn't acquire any of these players.

There's nothing wrong with looking realistically at what he actually did in Boston instead of saying he "built" that team when he had nothing to do with a large majority of the good players on the team.

It really should not be shocking he is having such trouble in Edmonton, it's not so easy when you aren't gifted perfect forward and goalie depth and a no.1 stud D-Man right from day 1 on the job. He's had to do more work here and I think he proving he's not able to do it without making a lot of errors.

That's a legitimate point.
He built the entire defence, acquired the conne smythe starting goalie and acquired most of the forwards and oversaw the development of all of them. He had something to do with everyone on that team. You don’t GM a team for 5 years and have no influence on players careers. If you discredit Chiarelli for Boston you can discredit pretty well every cup winning GM in history.
 

StevenF1919

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uh huh, because of no evidence at all
and MacT does the Reinhart trade for sure...the Oilers brass LOVED Reinhart...to the point of considering at #1 in 2012
MacT wouldn't have traded Hall. We'd probably have Hall and Demers (who's been better than Larsson this year) instead of Lucic and Larsson.
an overwhelming team that can't score on the PP or kill a penalty...or get a save on the 1st shot
I expect a rebound in all areas next year
Someone on twitter did the math recently and even with league average special teams we'd still have a negative goal differential. Don't get your hopes up, this roster will miss the playoffs again next year too.
Pitkanen is a stretch...dude was out of the league in 4 years
and the pieces needed to obtain Visnovsky gutted our team depth (losing Stoll and Green) and didn't make the team better
Pitkanen was fantastic here and Hall > Stoll and Greene despite Visnovsky being 10x the player Larsson is.
 
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Trafalgar Sadge Law

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Funny you only mention his bad trades

what about the Horton trade? the Seidenberg trade? the Boychuk trade? Chris Kelly was a good trade

he's made mistakes, but made very good ones too...like any GM
Half of those aren't even good trades, they're decent at best. The Horton trade costed them a 1st rounder which became Derek Forbort, and was 1 spot ahead of Tarasenko. That's an even trade at best. The Seidenberg trade costed them a pick that became Alex Petrovic, and one of those classic "win for the Bruins for 5 years win for the Panthers after" trades.
 

Trafalgar Sadge Law

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other than Nashville cause they've only had one GM, which current GM didn't inherit great pieces?
There's a huge difference between inheriting great pieces to help build your team and inheriting the entire nucleus of a team that you build around, the former is far more difficult.
 

shoop

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Jul 6, 2008
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Edmonton
uh huh, because of no evidence at all
and MacT does the Reinhart trade for sure...the Oilers brass LOVED Reinhart...to the point of considering at #1 in 2012

Like!

Anybody who thinks MacT was a better GM than Chiarelli doesn't understand what the word better means. :D

The OBC's finger prints were all over that Reinhart trade.

At the same time how can we only look at one GM in that light and have blinders on to the current one?

McLellan is a miles better coach than Eakins. The Oilers were a couple terrible call from a WCF appearance under Eakins. The two MacT GM'd teams were both worse than the 2015-16 Oilers and this year's addition.

Not saying there are blinders on. As I have said repeatedly Chia gets one more season and if it's still terrible I'll join the fire Chia brigade.
 

Soundwave

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He built the entire defence, acquired the conne smythe starting goalie and acquired most of the forwards and oversaw the development of all of them. He had something to do with everyone on that team. You don’t GM a team for 5 years and have no influence on players careers. If you discredit Chiarelli for Boston you can discredit pretty well every cup winning GM in history.

He didn't acquire Thomas or Rask. See this is my point, a lot of the stuff he is credited for he didn't actually do.
 

CantHaveTkachev

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Chiarelli wouldn't have traded Hall. We'd probably have Hall and Demers (who's been better than Larsson this year) instead of Lucic and Larsson.
and why does this lead to more wins?

Someone on twitter did the math recently and even with league average special teams we'd still have a negative goal differential. Don't get your hopes up, this roster will miss the playoffs again next year too.
they'd probably be a bubble team with league average special teams and goaltending

Pitkanen was fantastic here and Hall > Stoll and Greene despite Visnovsky being 10x the player Larsson is.
Pitkanen was never a true #1
 
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StevenF1919

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So if the bruins win the cup this year does Chiarelli get credit for it since he drafted Pastrnak and Heinen signed Krug and left the vet core in tact for Sweeney to inherit? Trying to discredit his success in Boston is dumb. There’s enough legitimate criticism to toss around to not have to reach for the stars the way you do constantly.
Fun fact, Chia didn't even want to sign Krug.
 

StevenF1919

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and why does this lead to more wins?
You don't think a 90 point winger on the team with the lowest scoring wingers in the league + an upgrade on D would lead to more wins?
they'd probably be a bubble team with league average special teams and goaltending
Exactly. If you have a generational player you should be more than a bubble team.
Pitkanen was never a true #1
I never said he was. He was a pretty good #2 and a hell of a lot better than Adam Larsson.
 

CantHaveTkachev

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You don't think a 90 point winger on the team with the lowest scoring wingers in the league + an upgrade on D would lead to more wins?
why does Taylor Hall score 90 points here?
how is Demers an upgrade in anything? dude has 20 points and plays the 4th most ES minutes on the Yotes..and how many teams has he been on now?
Exactly. If you have a generational player you should be more than a bubble team.
Nashville was a bubble team last year and went to the finals...making the playoffs automatically makes you a Cup contender in the Cap era

I never said he was. He was a pretty good #2 and a hell of a lot better than Adam Larsson.
annnnnd out of the NHL after 500 games...what a stud

I bet Larsson plays 1000 NHL games
 

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